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'He did nothing wrong': Family of Texas entrepreneur fatally shot by police say he was defending his

Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Stevicus said:
The cop will probably be retired with a pension, and the city will most likely have to pay out a sizable wrongful death settlement to the family.
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As with the Daniel Shaver murder.
It was even more blatant because he was very obviously unarmed.
He was executed for not playing Simon Says correctly.
The killer wasn't punished.
Nay, he retired with full pension.
Shooting of Daniel Shaver - Wikipedia
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
One thing that has not been mentioned is that the victim had already shot his own house. That changes things a bit from a police perspective. They were entering a "shots fired" situation, and they knew it was not the police that had fired those shots. Worse yet the homeowner had not informed the police of his actions. So to say that he had done nothing wrong was false. He had already shown reckless disregard for human life in his actions. You never shoot without being sure of your target. If you do shoot in an urban or suburban surroundings you immediately notify the police since they will come in assuming the worst.

Was the cop too quick on the draw? Yes. But due to the circumstances I doubt if he will be charged with anything. He might even keep his job. But the claim that the victim did nothing wrong is patently false. Acting like Rambo is not the best idea.
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Subduction Zone said:
One thing that has not been mentioned is that the victim had already shot his own house. That changes things a bit from a police perspective. They were entering a "shots fired" situation, and they knew it was not the police that had fired those shots. Worse yet the homeowner had not informed the police of his actions. So to say that he had done nothing wrong was false. He had already shown reckless disregard for human life in his actions. You never shoot without being sure of your target. If you do shoot in an urban or suburban surroundings you immediately notify the police since they will come in assuming the worst.

Was the cop too quick on the draw? Yes. But due to the circumstances I doubt if he will be charged with anything. He might even keep his job. But the claim that the victim did nothing wrong is patently false. Acting like Rambo is not the best idea.
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I agree that he should have called the police immediately before reaching for his rifle. Although the source of the "shots fired" info was a 911 caller, and that's who reported that he fired at his own house. It's not certain if that actually happened, or if he did do that, we don't know what he was firing at. Could there have been an armed intruder inside his house?
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Stevicus said:
I agree that he should have called the police immediately before reaching for his rifle. Although the source of the "shots fired" info was a 911 caller, and that's who reported that he fired at his own house. It's not certain if that actually happened, or if he did do that, we don't know what he was firing at. Could there have been an armed intruder inside his house?
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Watch the ABC video. They show from security cameras that he shot into his own house. His possible last words were:

"Yeah! You want this?" That was followed by a gunshot by the homeowner.
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Subduction Zone said:
Watch the ABC video. They show from security cameras that he shot into his own house. His possible last words were:

"Yeah! You want this?" That was followed by a gunshot by the homeowner.
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It didn't show what or who he was shooting at.
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Subduction Zone said:
He was shooting in the general direction of his house. He could not have missed it. He shot recklessly. They will recover that bullet.
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Isn't it possible that he could have seen an armed intruder inside his house? That's what can't be confirmed because he's shown facing and pointing the gun towards his house. Who is he talking to when he says "you want this"?
 
exchemist

exchemist

Veteran Member
Debater Slayer said:
I think the gun laws of the US are disastrous, but this specific incident seems to me the result of the actions of a poorly trained, trigger-happy, irresponsible cop rather than the victim's possession of a gun.
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But why do they have trigger-happy cops? Because every 2 bit criminal in the States has got a GUN, that's why. So they are in constant fear that if they don't shoot first they will get killed.

In the UK if there is a report of a criminal with a gun, that's an unusual, special situation, calling for squad of specialist cops trained to use firearms to be brought into action. Regular police are not armed. So it's relatively rare and treated much more carefully when it does happen. Even then they sometimes make mistakes of course.
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Stevicus said:
Isn't it possible that he could have seen an armed intruder inside his house? That's what can't be confirmed because he's shown facing and pointing the gun towards his house. Who is he talking to when he says "you want this"?
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That could be,. But it is highly unlikely He fired a single shot. If there was someone he would have much more likely fired multiple shots or confirmed rather quickly that the intruder was down. He did neither. To me it looks like he just shot for very bad reasons himself. He did not take care in shooting himself and then to make matters worse he did not immediately call the police.

Also I could not tell if sirens were on when the cops rolled up. If they were there was no real need to identify as police. A command of "drop the gun" after driving up with sirens on would not require an identification. I still think that the shot fired by the cop was too fast, but understanding what he was driving into, a shots fired situation, makes his actions look a bit less reckless.
 
rocala

rocala

Well-Known Member
I am not excusing the killing but the whole thing is very strange. He calls his friend but not the police? In the video hIs behaviour in front of the house seems almost relaxed and the weapon is pointing down? Even his voice during "you want this" is far from being a challenge. If it was not for the tragic ending it could be mistaken for some weird roleplaying.
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
rocala said:
I am not excusing the killing but the whole thing is very strange. He calls his friend but not the police? In the video hIs behaviour in front of the house seems almost relaxed and the weapon is pointing down? Even his voice during "you want this" is far from being a challenge. If it was not for the tragic ending it could be mistaken for some weird roleplaying.
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I wonder if he was sleepwalking or on some kind of sleep medication.
 
Shadow Wolf

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Subduction Zone said:
Okay, so perhaps we should wait a bit before we jump to judgement.
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We saw what happened. Piggly-wiggly said drop it and basically immediately after speaking, without giving any time for the victim to react, shot the victim. He wasn't threatened, he wasn't endangered, he just went straight to killing.
 
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