heaven or hell??

[Super Universe]

I believe that when we die we all eventually go to heaven, but heaven is not the next step. Heaven is like getting your masters degree in universal theory and we're all currently enrolled in first grade.

Some will go into a stasis, a sleep, and be awakened later. Some of us will move through the 4th dimension to the 5th and remember who we really are and continue our journey of exploration and eventually find heaven.

Some will go to a very selfish place where we will work very hard for selfish beings who don't care one bit for us.

 

[Muffled]

I believe that when we die we all eventually go to heaven, but heaven is not the next step. Heaven is like getting your masters degree in universal theory and we're all currently enrolled in first grade.

Some will go into a stasis, a sleep, and be awakened later. Some of us will move through the 4th dimension to the 5th and remember who we really are and continue our journey of exploration and eventually find heaven.

Some will go to a very selfish place where we will work very hard for selfish beings who don't care one bit for us.

This sounds like wishful thinking to me. Of course I always hope that recalcitrant people will have a change of heart but there is nothing to guarantee that they will.

For me Paradise on earth is the next step and I hope it is yours also. Living in the flesh is a great blessing once evil has been removed from the earth. I only go to Heaven if I need a rest from the pain that naturally comes with a fleshly body.

Sleepers are people who stay with the body after it is dead. Chances are that such people will be interred into the bowels of the earth (Hell) when the fiery cataclysm that is coming takes place.

Sounds like Buddhism. I don't know why you think you have to work so hard and do it yourself when God is availabe to do it for you. It is like wandering around in the desert forty years instead of letting God lead you into the promised land.

I tend to believe these numbers are few. It is possible for these people to find a new life but not easy. Certainly rebirth is their lot until Paradise comes on earth.

 

[michel]

I believe that when we die we all eventually go to heaven, but heaven is not the next step. Heaven is like getting your masters degree in universal theory and we're all currently enrolled in first grade.

Some will go into a stasis, a sleep, and be awakened later. Some of us will move through the 4th dimension to the 5th and remember who we really are and continue our journey of exploration and eventually find heaven.

Some will go to a very selfish place where we will work very hard for selfish beings who don't care one bit for us.

Just one question, if I may; some of your posts have left me wondering if you believe in reincarnation; do you?

 

[Super Universe]

This sounds like wishful thinking to me. Of course I always hope that recalcitrant people will have a change of heart but there is nothing to guarantee that they will.

For me Paradise on earth is the next step and I hope it is yours also. Living in the flesh is a great blessing once evil has been removed from the earth. I only go to Heaven if I need a rest from the pain that naturally comes with a fleshly body.

Sleepers are people who stay with the body after it is dead. Chances are that such people will be interred into the bowels of the earth (Hell) when the fiery cataclysm that is coming takes place.

Sounds like Buddhism. I don't know why you think you have to work so hard and do it yourself when God is availabe to do it for you. It is like wandering around in the desert forty years instead of letting God lead you into the promised land.

I tend to believe these numbers are few. It is possible for these people to find a new life but not easy. Certainly rebirth is their lot until Paradise comes on earth.

Wishful thinking? Not at all. Why would God throw away an eternal soul, a fragment of Himself? Why would a loving God create the devil and send him out to create hell and tempt us? He wouldn't and He didn't.

There is no hell. What Jesus was describing was a warning to Lucifer for his rebellion. If found guilty, Lucifer will be annihilated by a type of energy that is best described as fire. We cannot earn this punishment by any action on the earth. That would be like sentencing a one year old child to life in prison for starting a fire that killed someone.

We are forgiven for our sins on the earth. We can't even be considered for this type of punishment until we reach the higher dimensions in the universe and then we will absolutely know better.

Paradise on earth? It's a paradise now. There are incredible forms of life here, beautiful gardens, groves of ancient trees, wild flower covered hillsides... Think of the moon. Think of mars. You're on paradise earth now. You will not live in the body forever. What human has ever lived forever? The body is not you, it is a vehicle and your true name is not Dodge or Ford.

The sleeping souls will be awakened once the earth moves into the 4th dimension. The earth will be their's for a time but not forever. All must move onward and upward.

Muffled, your fire and brimstone won't work on me because there is nothing I am afraid of. I've been to your church, I've listened to all the lectures. You think I will drop everything I know to follow you who I don't? Go sell your fear somewhere else.

Michel: Reincarnation is often thought of as something that occurs without our choice and that we can only reincarnate into lifeforms on the earth. There's a whole universe out there.

Our soul can go anywhere in our dimension to learn and experience whatever we choose. We incarnate many times but we choose where to go, we choose our experience. Your next life might be as another humanoid. You might choose to go there to help awaken the selfish humanoids to the beauty of the universe.

 

[None]

Wishful thinking? Not at all. Why would God throw away an eternal soul, a fragment of Himself? Why would a loving God create the devil and send him out to create hell and tempt us? He wouldn't and He didn't.

There is no hell. What Jesus was describing was a warning to Lucifer for his rebellion. If found guilty, Lucifer will be annihilated by a type of energy that is best described as fire. We cannot earn this punishment by any action on the earth. That would be like sentencing a one year old child to life in prison for starting a fire that killed someone.

We are forgiven for our sins on the earth. We can't even be considered for this type of punishment until we reach the higher dimensions in the universe and then we will absolutely know better.

Paradise on earth? It's a paradise now. There are incredible forms of life here, beautiful gardens, groves of ancient trees, wild flower covered hillsides... Think of the moon. Think of mars. You're on paradise earth now. You will not live in the body forever. What human has ever lived forever? The body is not you, it is a vehicle and your true name is not Dodge or Ford.

The sleeping souls will be awakened once the earth moves into the 4th dimension. The earth will be there's for a time but not forever. All must move onward and upward.

Muffled, your fire and brimstone won't work on me because there is nothing I am afraid of. I've been to your church, I've listened to all the lectures. You think I will drop everything I know to follow you who I don't? Go sell your fear somewhere else.

Michel: Reincarnation is often thought of as something that occurs without our choice and that we can only reincarnate into lifeforms on the earth. There's a whole universe out there.

Our soul can go anywhere in our dimension to learn and experience whatever we choose. We incarnate many times but we choose where to go, we choose our experience. Your next life might be as another humanoid. You might choose to go there to help awaken the selfish humanoids to the beauty of the universe.

I wish I could frubal you for this. I agree with everything.

 

[joeboonda]

Well, the "blessed hope of every believer" (Titus) is that we "shall not all sleep" (I Thes.) I believe in a 'pre-trib' Rapture, that it is imminent, so I may not even die. But if Christ tarries, and I die, I believe "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord" (Cor.) that the moment I die, I will be taken to Heaven, because of what Christ did for me, paid for my sins, and gave me His righteousness in place of my own, which is "as filthy rags." (Isaiah) At some point after the Rapture, I will stand before the Lord at the 'Judgement Seat of Christ', not to be judged for my sins, (Christ took that punishment for me), but to be judged for my works, whether they were motivated by love, or something else. Then I will return with Christ to earth, where He will rule for a thousand years, and I will have some position (probably very low) in His Kingdom. At the end of the thousand years, God will make a new heaven and new earth, the City of the New Jerusalem (15,000 miles wide, long and high) will ascend, and we will live forever with the Lord.

 

[LeMaverick]

It is interesting how much people believe they know about the un-knowable.

 

[Ronald]

Just remember that the Bible says the spirit goes back to God who gave it, so everyones spirit goes back to God! Not just the righteous! The spirit of the murderer, the Homosexual, the abortion Doctor and you!

But you don't really know what the spirit really is. It is described in Torah as the breath of God. So is your spirit just air?

I know for sure that the Greek "Immortal Soul" is bogus! Otherwise why did The Son of God offer you eternal life? And Paul say this mortal put on immortality?

If we die and do not get creamated we will be buried in a grave or tomb, to you NT Christians that is HELL! OUCH!

Shalom

 

[Super Universe]

It is interesting how much people believe they know about the un-knowable.

You can close your eyes, but you can't close mine.

 

[LeMaverick]

You can close your eyes, but you can't close mine.

I choose to use my eyes to see what is real in the world I inhabit. I do not look for imaginary super beings promoted by self-appointed prophets, preachers and religion promoters.

I do not have difficulty saying that I cannot accept a "life after death" for which no independent, impartial evidence has been presented. I do not feel any need to claim that I know what happens after death -- though many seem to have that compunction.

.

 

[logician]

Do you believe that when you die you will be going to heaven or hell or somewhere else?

What are your reasons for your answer?

I believe in neither heaven or hell, as I do not believe in an after"life" of any sort.

Certainly, any supposed god that would punish a "soul" eternally in hell is a monster.

 

[Super Universe]

I choose to use my eyes to see what is real in the world I inhabit. I do not look for imaginary super beings promoted by self-appointed prophets, preachers and religion promoters.

I do not have difficulty saying that I cannot accept a "life after death" for which no independent, impartial evidence has been presented. I do not feel any need to claim that I know what happens after death -- though many seem to have that compunction.

.

Would this real world that you live in have any gardens in it? Any beautiful people or colorful art or playgrounds? Would it have birds and ponds, breaking white foam ocean waves, forrests of majestic Sequoia trees, and Redwood trees that were 242 years old when Jesus was born?

You want evidence of God? The evidence is the universe and life itself. If that is not good enough for you, then tough. It's not about you. It never was about you and it never will be about you. Where in the night sky does it say "All of this is here for you, wish and you will receive!"

How would you like it if you worked two jobs just to make the down payment on the new home and the first words out of your babies mouth were "Where's the silver spoon daddy?"

You say that you do not feel any need to claim this or that because you have no compunction yet you "think" you know what we know. Not all humans are the same.

Some here have insight that I can only imagine but then I may have a view they have not seen.

So far all I've seen from you is anger. Is that all you are?

 

[LeMaverick]

Replies in Blue

Would this real world that you live in have any gardens in it? Any beautiful people or colorful art or playgrounds? Would it have birds and ponds, breaking white foam ocean waves, forrests of majestic Sequoia trees, and Redwood trees that were 242 years old when Jesus was born?

The world I inhabit seems to include all of the things you mentin and several more. The point is?

You want evidence of God? The evidence is the universe and life itself. If that is not good enough for you, then tough. It's not about you. It never was about you and it never will be about you. Where in the night sky does it say "All of this is here for you, wish and you will receive!"

I don't want or request evidence of god.

I say that evidence of gods is not presented. The presence of the universe does not indicate that gods exist, or which gods, or anything of the sort. There is no more evidence that gods created the universe than there is that it was created by leprechauns.

One can conclude that the universe is a "sign of god's power", but that is simply something the person wishes to believe. There is no evidence it is correct.

How would you like it if you worked two jobs just to make the down payment on the new home and the first words out of your babies mouth were "Where's the silver spoon daddy?"

The point of this high level reasoning is??????

You say that you do not feel any need to claim this or that because you have no compunction yet you "think" you know what we know. Not all humans are the same.

It might be interesting to quote me correctly and then respond to what I actually say.

Some here have insight that I can only imagine but then I may have a view they have not seen.

I'm confident that individual viewpoints and insights differ.

So far all I've seen from you is anger. Is that all you are?

It is interesting that all you choose to see is anger. I do not seek to please or impress you. I am here to discuss ideas with those who can keep discussion on that level. Your zeal in protecting religion seems to require a [FONT=&quot]a vigilant [/FONT] attack upon any opposing ideas.

Have you forgotten that everything discussed here is opinion and that all are entitled to express one? Is it your duty to "defend" all of religion or just certain beliefs?

Those who rely on emotion and dogma may disagree with my positions and attempt to prove themselves right. I wish them well.

 

[Zephyr]

I'll take my place in Hel's home when the time comes. If the gods call me to their halls it would be a great honor, but I'm satisfied wherever.

 

[gnomon]

Do you believe that when you die you will be going to heaven or hell or somewhere else?

What are your reasons for your answer?

When I die my body will be mummified, placed in a special container and launched into space towards the edge of our solar system. As humanity continues from that moment to look into the heavens and wonder if anything is out there the answer will be yes-

ME! Along with various advertisements placed on my space coffin to cover the expenses.

 

[Super Universe]

LeMaverick:

My zeal in protecting religion? I have absolutely no interest in protecting religion and I guarantee that I've been fighting it for longer than you have. Your attack in another post was not directed at religion, it was directed at God and I will defend God forever.

You think God is religion. You think the bible is God's book. God did not put His mark on it no matter what any human says. Religion is like a man who creates a club for men, with dues, rites of initiation, and a group feeling of superiority.

God does not make divisions of His children. We're all equal to Him regardless of any sin we commit.

 

[LeMaverick]

You think God is religion. You think the bible is God's book.

It should be rather obvious that I do NOT think that god is religion or that the bible is god's book -- because I openly state that I consider gods to be imaginary.

You made a mistake with those statements just as I did regarding your defense of religion (misunderstanding that it was god you were defending)

God did not put His mark on it no matter what any human says. Religion is like a man who creates a club for men, with dues, rites of initiation, and a group feeling of superiority.

I agree. I further maintain that organized, commercial religion gains influence and wealth by falsely proclaiming that it has special understanding of gods and salvation.

God does not make divisions of His children. We're all equal to Him regardless of any sin we commit.

I can relate to that without agreeing totally.

 

[Muffled]

Wishful thinking? Not at all. Why would God throw away an eternal soul, a fragment of Himself? Why would a loving God create the devil and send him out to create hell and tempt us? He wouldn't and He didn't.

There is no hell. What Jesus was describing was a warning to Lucifer for his rebellion. If found guilty, Lucifer will be annihilated by a type of energy that is best described as fire. We cannot earn this punishment by any action on the earth. That would be like sentencing a one year old child to life in prison for starting a fire that killed someone.

We are forgiven for our sins on the earth. We can't even be considered for this type of punishment until we reach the higher dimensions in the universe and then we will absolutely know better.

Paradise on earth? It's a paradise now. There are incredible forms of life here, beautiful gardens, groves of ancient trees, wild flower covered hillsides... Think of the moon. Think of mars. You're on paradise earth now. You will not live in the body forever. What human has ever lived forever? The body is not you, it is a vehicle and your true name is not Dodge or Ford.

The sleeping souls will be awakened once the earth moves into the 4th dimension. The earth will be their's for a time but not forever. All must move onward and upward.

Muffled, your fire and brimstone won't work on me because there is nothing I am afraid of. I've been to your church, I've listened to all the lectures. You think I will drop everything I know to follow you who I don't? Go sell your fear somewhere else.

Michel: Reincarnation is often thought of as something that occurs without our choice and that we can only reincarnate into lifeforms on the earth. There's a whole universe out there.

Our soul can go anywhere in our dimension to learn and experience whatever we choose. We incarnate many times but we choose where to go, we choose our experience. Your next life might be as another humanoid. You might choose to go there to help awaken the selfish humanoids to the beauty of the universe.

Who said anything about throwing away a soul? As for God's creation He has never said that it is a fragment of Himself and in truth God can't be divided into fragments.

Try supporting this theory by explicating each reference to Hell made by Jesus to show that it must refer to Lucifer.

So when Sodom and Gomorrah were completely destroyed because of their sinfullness that was actually forgiveness? Evidently God sees things differently, holding us responsible because we aren't children and He has made a free offer of salvation.

Try telling that to parents of young girls who have been raped and murdered.

This goes so far back that there doesn't seem to be anyone who remembers but the remnants of that age lived hundreds of years.

God chooses where you will go. Sometimes He will grant your wish if you are in His good graces and it suits His purpose.

That isn't the issue. Even if you are not afraid of ending up in fire and brimstone, is that what you would choose? If not then you need to be on a path that insures you don't end up in it.

 

[hmvv]

i belive niether. i belive the spirit wonders the earth till its destruction. it is'nt too bad though because think how much fun it would be to terrorise the living.

 

[Darkness]

My zeal in protecting religion? I have absolutely no interest in protecting religion and I guarantee that I've been fighting it for longer than you have. Your attack in another post was not directed at religion, it was directed at God and I will defend God forever.

You think God is religion. You think the bible is God's book. God did not put His mark on it no matter what any human says. Religion is like a man who creates a club for men, with dues, rites of initiation, and a group feeling of superiority.

God does not make divisions of His children. We're all equal to Him regardless of any sin we commit.

Even though I do not believe in God, I like your God better than the ones of most Earthly religions. He seems to be a really awesome Deity.

If there is a Hell, I will probably go there. How else will I join Satan in the second rebellion and overthrow YHWH. :bat: