samtonga43
Well-Known Member
What, in your opinion, TS, are the foundations of Christianity?
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Homosexuality and religious.
- Thread starter Spirit of Light
- Start date
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
Be your own woman, Tb.
You don't have to follow the 'others'.
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
That's a great big 'except'.
It is a moot question.
The Baha'i already have a Law that states that sexual relations outside of a legal marriage is forbidden and that a legal Marriage is between a man and a women. To be a Baha'i, one accepts to embrace the Baha'i law, albeit it is a challenge to one's own self.
It is not known if this will be embraced as law outside of the Baha'i Faith.
That is the only answer really available, as the future is unknown to us.
Regards Tony
You won't get one, but you know that, and you know why - for exactly the reason you imply. The answer is a resounding yes, the Baha'i would support a law against homosexuality.
But you don't need them to comment directly. You know the answer.
There's no need for any critical thinker to keep asking the same question over and over, pointing out that it has been ignored yet again. When somebody won't answer a question after at most two requests, I answer it for them as I just did above. If one stops asking and report his conclusion. That's fair. If the one dodging the question wants input into the process, they are free to provide it then. Silence is a tacit admission that you got it right. Who that has been misunderstood doesn't take the opportunity to state his actual position. People that do that understand that their position isn't acceptable to their audience, which pretty much tells you what it is.
Actually, I have generalized this approach of stopping asking and begin telling. I don't ask people to give me examples of what they call spiritual truth anymore because they never do, so now I tell them that they have no such truths to offer when they make reference to them. If I ever encounter one with something to offer, he can do so then. But that doesn't happen, and many steps are saved.
Likewise with asking for evidence for gods. Why? They never offer anything better than scriptures or pointing to life, so I begin by saying that there is no compelling evidence for gods, and if they disagree and want to offer a messenger's biography, all one need to is rebut the claim and the discussion is over.
It definitely makes for a better person.
The purpose of life? Life has no purpose but what we give it. Making and raising children isn't my purpose. Getting the most out of life is, and mindful sex plays a large part in living a satisfying, purposive life. It's a spiritual experience. In some religions, other people tell you what your purpose is from the perspective of an alleged god, and what these gods expect from you. Humanists do that for themselves. He determines his own values, goals, and purpose.
Neither is as good as both combined. But sex without love can also be very good. It's a healthful pursuit. From The Health Benefits of Sex (healthline.com):
"Sex and sexuality are a part of life. Aside from reproduction, sex can be about intimacy and pleasure. Sexual activity, penile-vaginal intercourse (PVI), or masturbation, can offer many surprising benefits to all facets of your life:
- physical
- intellectual
- emotional
- psychological
- social
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I am not 'following others' just because I respond to their posts.
I am just trying to be polite.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
That's very true, since that is the purpose of sex.That's a great big 'except'.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Tolerance of all people makes one a better person, unless the people we tolerate are bad people who are harming others, like liars, thieves and murderers, or unless those people are harming themselves.
To each his or her own. Having children and raising them was not part of my purpose but getting the most out of life is not my purpose either. The reason it is not my purpose it is selfish, and the last thing I want to be is selfish.
Maybe it is for you, but you cannot speak for the whole human race.
Sex no longer plays any part in my life, thank God. I have no desire for it and I don't need it. I might have sex again if I get married again, not because I desire it, but for the man I marry.
You are free to believe whatever you want to believe about sex. I believe that sex is purely physical, and other than its primary purpose, which is procreation, sex is engaged in for physical pleasure. People claim sex is spiritual just to justify it, but sex has nothing to do with anything but the body and can have a deleterious effect on the soul, if engaged in out of its proper context.
Some people also claim that taking LSD is a spiritual experience, because it alters their consciousness. Sex also does that for the time it is engaged in and for a short time afterward, but that does not make it spiritual.
Any of the physical and psychological benefits of sex can be achieved in other ways. Food and water and sleep are necessary to live but sex is not necessary for living. Sex is desired for physical pleasure. Why not just be honest about it? Why try to make it something it isn't? There is nothing noble about sex, it is a selfish activity, even if engaged in by couples, because the partner is always getting something out of it. It cannot be compared to going to the soup kitchen and feeding the hungry.
I guess that is why no holy book ever enjoined anyone to have sex, except for bearing children, which is not a selfish act.
I almost missed this part of it of the article as I realized when I went back to read it. It was just my own idea but I guess I was right when I said that sex is engaged in for pleasure. As the article says "The benefits of sex come from the feeling of pleasure."
Celibacy and abstinence
Sex isn’t the only indicator of health or happiness. You can still lead an active and happy life without sex. The benefits of sex come from the feeling of pleasure, which studies show can also come from listening to music, interacting with pets, and having strong religious faith. According to the National Health Service in the United Kingdom, a long-term study of nuns reported that many of them lived well into their 90s and past 100 years old.
Takeaway
Sex is an important part of life and overall well-being. In relationships, orgasms play a significant part in bonding. Physical and emotional benefits like reduced risk of heart disease, improved self-esteem, and more can come from having sex.
You can still have similar benefits without sex. Engaging in other pleasurable activities like exercising, interacting with a pet, and having a strong network of friends could potentially offer the same benefits. Sex is just one way of improving your quality of life.
The Health Benefits of Sex
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samtonga43
Well-Known Member
So God is Triune?
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
Exactly. So you are contradicting yourself when you say that you cannot for the life of you see how sex has anything to do with the purpose of life....
I think it is amazing that the method of achieving the purpose is so ... enjoyable.
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
You said that you were responding to others because so many other people are talking about sex. No one is going to think of you as impolite because you don't respond.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
No, I did not contradict myself because I pointed out the exception.
I cannot for the life of me see how sex has anything to do with the purpose of life, except as it is related to bringing children into the world and raising a family. Other than that sex is a physical act that is engaged in for physical pleasure. Sex is not love and love is not sex, but all too often they get conflated.
#5594 Trailblazer, Yesterday at 4:22 PM
But once the children are conceived the purpose has been achieved. After that sex is a physical act that is engaged in for physical pleasure. I wish people would be honest and admit that there is nothing spiritual about sex.I think it is amazing that the method of achieving the purpose is so ... enjoyable.
John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
John 12:24-26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
CG Didymus
Veteran Member
Forbidding homosexuality...
There are 69 countries that have laws that criminalise homosexuality, and nearly half of these are in Africa.
So far, 28 countries in the world recognise same-sex marriages, and 34 others provide for some partnership recognition for same-sex couples...
Although several Muslim nations incorporate Sharia law in their legal systems, only a small number carry out harsh punishment for homosexuality. Below is a list of countries who have laws that punish homosexuality with capital punishment.
Brunei
Brunie’s move to impose a death sentence for homosexuality has led to widespread international condemnation. The new Islamic laws makes same-sex relationships punishable by stoning to death. Before the introduction of the rules, homosexuality was still illegal and was punishable by up to 10 years in prison.
Saudi Arabia
Saudi Arabia’s law takes after Sharia law, and until recently the carrying out of harsh and extreme punishment was common in public. Homosexuality is not only illegal by also comes with punishment by execution.
Sudan
Sudan adopted sharia law in 1983 but is seen to implement it randomly. Death by stoning remains legal but has not been carried out in decades. Activists, however, note that women are still flogged for immorality.
Nigeria
In twelve out of the 36 states in Nigeria, Sharia law extends to matters of criminal law. The courts in those states can order amputations.
Somalia
The penal code in the country stipulates imprisonment for homosexuality, but the Islamic courts in the southern region impose strict sharia law which allows the death penalty.
Mauritania
According to a 1984 law, Muslim men engaging in homosexuality can be stoned to death in Mauritania. However, the law has not been actively practiced.
Yemen
In Yemen, the 1994 penal code allows the stoning of married men who engage in homosexuality. Unmarried men face one year in prison or whipping while women face imprisonment for up to seven years.
Acceptance In The World
While homosexuality is legal in most of the world, the acceptance and equality of the LGBT community is not universal, and there are still great strides to be made. Some of the first countries to legalize gay marriage include the Netherlands, Belgium, Canada, and Spain.
You don't know? Well, now you know. It's been embraced. In some countries it's still embraced. But the trend is moving away from forbidding homosexual relationships.So far, 28 countries in the world recognise same-sex marriages, and 34 others provide for some partnership recognition for same-sex couples...
Although several Muslim nations incorporate Sharia law in their legal systems, only a small number carry out harsh punishment for homosexuality. Below is a list of countries who have laws that punish homosexuality with capital punishment.
Brunei
Brunie’s move to impose a death sentence for homosexuality has led to widespread international condemnation. The new Islamic laws makes same-sex relationships punishable by stoning to death. Before the introduction of the rules, homosexuality was still illegal and was punishable by up to 10 years in prison.
Saudi Arabia
Saudi Arabia’s law takes after Sharia law, and until recently the carrying out of harsh and extreme punishment was common in public. Homosexuality is not only illegal by also comes with punishment by execution.
Sudan
Sudan adopted sharia law in 1983 but is seen to implement it randomly. Death by stoning remains legal but has not been carried out in decades. Activists, however, note that women are still flogged for immorality.
Nigeria
In twelve out of the 36 states in Nigeria, Sharia law extends to matters of criminal law. The courts in those states can order amputations.
Somalia
The penal code in the country stipulates imprisonment for homosexuality, but the Islamic courts in the southern region impose strict sharia law which allows the death penalty.
Mauritania
According to a 1984 law, Muslim men engaging in homosexuality can be stoned to death in Mauritania. However, the law has not been actively practiced.
Yemen
In Yemen, the 1994 penal code allows the stoning of married men who engage in homosexuality. Unmarried men face one year in prison or whipping while women face imprisonment for up to seven years.
Acceptance In The World
While homosexuality is legal in most of the world, the acceptance and equality of the LGBT community is not universal, and there are still great strides to be made. Some of the first countries to legalize gay marriage include the Netherlands, Belgium, Canada, and Spain.
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
You don't think that Christianity is outdated? Great!
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
You are correct when you say that God is One.
God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit, three distinct persons sharing one homoousion.
One God, Three (equally divine) Persons -- Father, Son, Holy Spirit. All three named individuals are divine, and equally so. These three persons are the one God of the Bible.
samtonga43
Well-Known Member
Correct. So..............?
You have a different understanding of what tolerance is. In the humanist vision, tolerance includes allowing others to decide what is harmful for themselves. This is the back door that allows the religious to justify persecution of others for violating one's own moral code.
If by selfish you mean inappropriate, I disagree. I'm beginning to suspect that for you, the pursuit of satisfaction is a moral failing even when that is accomplished serving others. Everything I do for others, I also do for myself. My career was in medicine, during which time I helped myself while helping others. I just put my dogs' bowls down, and enjoyed seeing their enthusiasm anticipating then diving into their food. Last night, we had another couple over for a pre-Thanksgiving meal of stuffed game hens, which we all enjoyed very much. This is what I mean from getting the most out of life, and I do it in part because I know how it will end up - others will be happy, which will increase my satisfaction in life.
I disagree. Sex can be a very spiritual experience. But maybe we are talking about different things. For me, the spiritual experience is a very pleasant transcendent one characterized by a sense of connection and belonging. It can occur while contemplating the night sky, while enjoying a stirring passage of music, while gardening, while enjoying a belly laugh, while being of service to others, and while having sexual relations. All of these experiences can invoke that spiritual intuition, and that is EXACTLY what makes them spiritual, including a sexual connection. I suspect that your understanding of spiritual experience and the proper role of sex in one's life, which are both so different from mine, are religiously determined
Then we should pursue those as well. You seem to think it is a virtue to avoid sex. If so, I disagree. It's not a crime to avoid it, but it is a loss to not be able to enjoy it, just like it's a loss to not be able to enjoy music.
Like most people, I engage in sex for pleasure, and like most of them, freely say so. I'm glad that it's also a salutary pursuit. It's both of those things. Why try to make it something it isn't?
Here's a big difference between us: Your understanding of selfishness is far from mine. To you, getting pleasure is selfish and therefore inappropriate. I limit the word to mean a pattern of relative indifference to the wants and needs of others. Things I do for myself at no cost to others are for the self, but not selfish, and certainly things that give both oneself and others pleasure are not selfish. But I get the sense that you disapprove of all of those things, because they all give pleasure, and consider the pursuit of pleasure selfishness in any of its forms, including sex.
Yes, it can. They are both pleasurable experiences that give one a warm feeling and a sense of connection to our world. It can all be part of a full and satisfying life.