Honest opinions from Christians please

McBell · Mar 15, 2009

starlite said:
1 Corinthians 1:26-29

Yes, throwing out even more irrelevant verses really does help you.:no:

starlite · Mar 15, 2009

Mestemia said:
Yes, throwing out even more irrelevant verses really does help you.:no:

seems you missed the point :run:

McBell · Mar 15, 2009

starlite said:
seems you missed the point :run:

It is possible.

So what is this point that I missed?

Autodidact · Mar 15, 2009

26 Brothers and sisters, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. 28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him.

Now instead of just naming some poetry from an ancient holy book, how about if you just state your position for us?

Draka · Mar 15, 2009

Mestemia said:
It is possible.

So what is this point that I missed?

Reading those verses I'd have to say is her point is that she must believe those verses to mean that science is foolish and facts are foolish for they "confound" us educated people. Strange that it is the opposite though. I'm not "confounded" in the least. I understand quite well. She doesn't. So perhaps it should be she that worries about herself. but then, so few "christians" like her do. They tend to worry about everyone else "not seeing the truth" when they can't even seem to see a nicely polished finger that directs them exactly where they can go.

Do tell starlite, what things of the world DOES god despise? What things of the world that HE PUT HERE are we not suppose to learn with the brains HE GAVE US? For truly, if god is responsible for all then god is responsible for the evidence we find in support of evolution. If god is responsible for all then god is responsible for the intelligence of the very same scientists you seem to want to discredit. If god created everything, then he created everything to point towards evolution. Now, if that is NOT how we came into existence, then god is one sick and twisted prankster by playing mankind in the way he has.

Draka · Mar 15, 2009

Autodidact said:
26 Brothers and sisters, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. 28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised thingsand the things that are notto nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him.

Now instead of just naming some poetry from an ancient holy book, how about if you just state your position for us?

Wow, we must have different versions. Mine is KJV. Which is that?

jacobweymouth · Mar 15, 2009

My two cents:

When the Bible calls it "oppositions of science, falsely so-called" it isn't talking about science: it's talking about evolution and atheists.

The OP states that those three points have been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I saw no such proof.

Draka · Mar 15, 2009

jacobweymouth said:
My two cents:

When the Bible calls it "oppositions of science, falsely so-called" it isn't talking about science: it's talking about evolution and atheists.

The OP states that those three points have been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I saw no such proof.

Um, evolution IS science. Science backs up evolution. Or is science only science when the bible agrees with it? :areyoucra

Autodidact · Mar 15, 2009

jacobweymouth said:
My two cents:

When the Bible calls it "oppositions of science, falsely so-called" it isn't talking about science: it's talking about evolution and atheists.

It makes me sad how misinformed so many people are. Evolution is a scientific theory, a very specific one, in a specific scientific field, Biology. That's all it is, nothing less and nothing more. It has nothing to do with Atheism, which is not science, and which is a lack of belief that there is a God.

The OP states that those three points have been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I saw no such proof.

Proof that the earth rotates around the sun? Are you having trouble with that?

painted wolf · Mar 15, 2009

Evolution is no more atheist than any other part of science.
Is Germ theory an atheist idea because it means that demons don't make people sick?

wa:do

jacobweymouth · Mar 15, 2009

Autodidact said:
It makes me sad how misinformed so many people are.

:sad4:

I hate these discussions because all I here is how uninfomed I am, and nothing else.

Evolution is a scientific theory, a very specific one, in a specific scientific field, Biology. That's all it is, nothing less and nothing more.

Evolution covers many areas. How life originated, how the cosmos originated, how stars originated, etc.

It has nothing to do with Atheism, which is not science, and which is a lack of belief that there is a God.

This I knew. I hadn't meant to lump them together. Atheists were the "scoffers", and evolution was the "oppositions of science falsely so-called." You can't deny though that most atheists are evolutionists.

lack of belief that there is a God.

I'm debating whether or not to open this can of worms...

Proof that the earth rotates around the sun? Are you having trouble with that?

I could be really obtuse, and ask for data that the earth rotates around the sun, but...

1. The idea of the sun going up and down is metaphorical, not literal. Human beings didn't understand the concept at the time, and the Bible isn't a science book: it's God's revelation of Himself to His creation. While it doesn't violate science, neither does it discuss it in and of itself.

2. The Grand Canyon, fossil locations, flood legends are all evidence of a universal flood.

3. There has been no proof that the earth is 60,000 years old. There has been only 6000-10000 years of recorded history. Anything beyond that is guess work.

McBell · Mar 15, 2009

jacobweymouth said:
I hate these discussions because all I here is how uninfomed I am, and nothing else.

FOUL!
Try listening to what others tell you instead of clinging to your ignorance.

jacobweymouth said:
Evolution covers many areas. How life originated, how the cosmos originated, how stars originated, etc.

You spout ignorance like this and wonder why people mention how uninformed you are?

jacobweymouth said:
This I knew. I hadn't meant to lump them together. Atheists were the "scoffers", and evolution was the "oppositions of science falsely so-called." You can't deny though that most atheists are evolutionists.

So by continuing your logic, atheist value truth whilst those like you value dogma, misinformation, and flat out lies.
Thanks for clearing that up.

jacobweymouth said:
I'm debating whether or not to open this can of worms...

I would strongly suggest that you don't.
At least not till after you cure your serious mental condition, ignorance.

jacobweymouth said:
I could be really obtuse, and ask for data that the earth rotates around the sun, but...

1. The idea of the sun going up and down is metaphorical, not literal. Human beings didn't understand the concept at the time, and the Bible isn't a science book: it's God's revelation of Himself to His creation. While it doesn't violate science, neither does it discuss it in and of itself.

2. The Grand Canyon, fossil locations, flood legends are all evidence of a universal flood.

3. There has been no proof that the earth is 60,000 years old. There has been only 6000-10000 years of recorded history. Anything beyond that is guess work.

Again, you wave your ignorance around like a flag.
Yet whine when you are told as such.

I do not know which is worse...your ignorance, or your being proud of your ignorance.

jacobweymouth · Mar 15, 2009

Mestemia said:
FOUL!
Try listening to what others tell you instead of clinging to your ignorance.

I would strongly suggest that you don't.
At least not till after you cure your serious mental condition, ignorance.

Again, you wave your ignorance around like a flag.
Yet whine when you are told as such.

I do not know which is worse...your ignorance, or your being proud of your ignorance.

You spout ignorance like this and wonder why people mention how uninformed you are?

You see what I mean?

That's all I hear... :sleep:

So by continuing your logic, atheist value truth whilst those like you value dogma, misinformation, and flat out lies.
Thanks for clearing that up.

Now you're putting words in my mouth. I never said evolution was true, and I never mentioned value.

McBell · Mar 15, 2009

jacobweymouth said:
You see what I mean?

That's all I hear... :sleep:

Now you're putting words in my mouth. I never said evolution was true, and I never mentioned value.

And as so long as you are proud of your ignorance, you will be called ignorant.

Perhaps it would be good for you to actually read what was written.
I did not put any words in your mouth.
If you are to ignorant to understand that, then it falls back on you.

jacobweymouth · Mar 15, 2009

Mestemia said:
And as so long as you are proud of your ignorance, you will be called ignorant.

Please show me why I'm ignorant. I didn't see any evidence offered that those things suggested in the OP were at all conclusive.

Perhaps it would be good for you to actually read what was written.
I did not put any words in your mouth.
If you are to ignorant to understand that, then it falls back on you.

That was toungue and cheek. I was simply pointing out that evolution is false.

You seem mighty adamant that I'm ignorant, a liar, etc., and I just got here. I'm not playing the victim: I'm just perplexed. I made some statements, you proceeded to dismiss them as lies and ignorance, without any explanation as to why they are lies and ignorance.

9-10ths_Penguin · Mar 15, 2009

jacobweymouth said:
Evolution covers many areas. How life originated, how the cosmos originated, how stars originated, etc.

No, it doesn't.

People occasionally use evolution as an analogy or metaphor when talking about these sorts of things, but evolution itself is fairly narrow and very specific in scope.

jacobweymouth · Mar 15, 2009

9-10ths_Penguin said:
No, it doesn't.

People occasionally use evolution as an analogy or metaphor when talking about these sorts of things, but evolution itself is fairly narrow and very specific in scope.

Yes, I'm aware that evolution generally refers to the evolution of life, and is therefore in the field of biology -ie Macroevolution.

However, when we contrast in to creationism, we begin talking about Cosmic, stellar, etc. evolution. For example, macroevolution that you're talking about could only have happenned without a fairly large amount of time -without that time, the theory is sunk. Creationism purports that there was not that much time. Thus, we begin talking about the lot of evolutions.

McBell · Mar 15, 2009

...chess with a pigeon...

jacobweymouth · Mar 15, 2009

Mestemia said:
...chess with a pigeon...

Tell me, if you had uses the term moron, idiot, etc. would that have made that post abusive?

Or we're you even referring to me? I hate to jump to conclusions on the internet.

Okay, we all know that when evolution is generally referred to, it's usually specifically the evolution of life on earth. I forget that most people don't know that there are actually 6 different definitions, and I refer to them all generally.

So, now that we've cleared that up, let's move on.

McBell · Mar 15, 2009

jacobweymouth said:
So, now that we've cleared that up, let's move on.

Agreed.
How about you start with these:

Now I understand that that is a lot of information.
The question is are you actually going to do some research or are you merely going to reject it all without even looking?
The next question is are you going to actually do honest research or are you going to merely ratify your beliefs?

Do not worry.
I will not be holding my breath.

Honest opinions from Christians please

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