How are these Great Beings explained?

[Dawnofhope]

Never knew that well, of course. Weirdly enough, Catholics aren't either. They feel it's charity to promote their beliefs and change others to be like them and spreading the word. Whether they understand it as proselytize, I don't know. I don't think so.

The next time I, or any Baha'i proselytizes you call tell them its against their religion.

Can you disattach yourself from god to achieve non-attachment?

Baha'is should be attached from all save God.

You mean to tell me that someone else other than christ will return after him? What is judgement day for if christ's return isn't meant to take people back to his father?

Bahaullah isn't the last prophet of christ. I honestly don't know how they even go together.

As I explained to another on post #1118 God's judgement comes in response to our failure to recognise Him and obey his commands. We don't have all this weird apocalyptic stuff and then He comes.

Maybe its hard to understand because its a both a physical and spiritual event? Not asking you to agree with it, just see it from a Baha'i perspective.

My point is if I believed in god and had a founder Zalu and you tell me he prophecied the coming of Bahaullah, a educator, and promotes world peace by reading scripture that has been in my family for eons, Id be deeply offended.

The first point here is why get offended? The Jews, Christians, and Muslims will say you are wrong. The Buddhists will tell you you're wasting your time believing in God. The Hindus will tell you there are many Gods. These poor beleaguered Baha'is just want to tell you Zalu's prophecy has been fulfilled! To have meaningful conversations with this disparate group requires us to not get offended and be patiently avoiding our eyes rolling to the back of our heads!

I will be honest. Since god is the foundation of your religion, you are already in a self-centered religion. My therapist was distinguishing between self-centered and selfish.

When you're selfish, you want all to yourself and think of yourself only.

Wow, so belief in God is selfish???
Didn't see that coming.

In this case, when you're self-centered, you're thinking of everything for god and for god only. You don't separate your self from god, so yes, you become focused only on god and do not take any other religion as any truth real truth but your own.

Nothing wrong with that. I just only heard a few christians admit it. Took them awhile. Ego thing, maybe, I don't know.

Alternatively, maybe its hard for someone who doesn't believe in God to understand the reality of someone who does? Much like explaining what an orange tastes like, so someone who's never tasted it.

Seriously, though, I want to make creativity as the cornerstone of all I do from work, cooking, praying, and relationships. I liked your guitar picture, though. Can't remember the exact type of guitar my mother played but she loved acoustic. She'd play Dust in the Wind.

That is a worthy aspiration to pursue your art.

The guitar is an Ibanez, like the one I've owned for nearly 30 years.

The song 'dust in the wind' takes me back. Very beautiful and yet melancholic to consider how inconsequential we all are in the scheme of things. We're all just dust in the wind.

You left Christianity, are a Christian, and now a Bahai?

Wouldn't you be in Christianity, because you are a Christian. And because you are Bahai, you can still believe in the teachings of Christ? (Trying to put together logic)

Sorry, continue.... Threw me off.

I'm comfortable with the apparent paradoxes and contradictions of the world I live in. Makes it easier to come to terms with myself and others...

 

[Dawnofhope]

I think it more like one life time you'd be the class clown, the next the teachers pet, the next the bully, then the teacher and if you do really well you can do home schooling.

But as a frustrated adolescent wouldn't you want to leave school and get on with your life? I would.

On the Abrahamic religions not supporting it.. the opposite is true also, the other religions don't support some of the things in the Abrahamic religions. So what makes them more truer than the others? Especially considering that you have said that all the religions have had man-made traditions and misinterpretations added in.

The Abrahamic Faiths have books that are relatively authentic. The Dharmics don't seem too concerned whether they have the original teachings or not. Their sacred books do not have the same weight as we are less certain about their origins.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Hmmm

Baha'is should be attached from all save God.

What does that mean?

The Buddha says don't be attached to gods. You believe in god. Can you disattach yourself from god if you are following the teachings of The Dharma (do you follow The Dharma teachings? I know @loverofhumanity compared himself to Hindu. Does that depend on the Bahais or is that how Bahai sees themselves in relation to other religious?)

As I explained to another on post #1118 God's judgement comes in response to our failure to recognise Him and obey his commands. We don't have all this weird apocalyptic stuff and then He comes.

I dont know about judgement other than revelations. He was born, he lived, he died, he rose, he will come again. As I'm not interested in scripture anymore, that's probably as far as I will get from memory.

Maybe its hard to understand because its a both a physical and spiritual event? Not asking you to agree with it, just see it from a Baha'i perspective.

Actually, Catholicism is physical and spiritual. Many protestants only understand the spiritual perspective. I'm surprised you talk about the physical because I've been talking with loverofhumanity about traditions, languages, and cultures (TLC ) and while he agrees we don't have to disregard it, he does disregard how it shapes ones view in god and why each person's view cant be put under one religion. However you've already defined it.

The first point here is why get offended

Ah Ha! That's why. I'm running out of words to explain it.

Wow, so belief in God is selfish???

Self-centered. My therapist said it's healthy to be self-centered. When you're selfish you're thinking of yourself at the expense of others. Self-centered religions are focused on what they feel is true. If not, they would not be a religion in any sense of the word organization or otherwise.

It's an observation because he was correcting me on how I saw myself at the time of my depression. Interesting to observe it in religious thought as well.

Alternatively, maybe its hard for someone who doesn't believe in God to understand the reality of someone who does? Much like explaining what an orange tastes like, so someone who's never tasted it.

The oranged tastes good just I think you're trying to put oranges, apples, and pears from each person's basket into the one in the middle. While each bahai is different in respect of what they put in the basket. The belief is more saying peace will come from each person's fruit in the basket. Most religions rather keep their individuality without the gray area.

This goes back to why people are offended and understanding cultural appropriation.

That is a worthy aspiration to pursue your art.

Thank you and you with your music.

I'm comfortable with the apparent paradoxes and contradictions of the world I live in. Makes it easier to come to terms with myself and others...

Eh. It confuses the mess out of us on RF especially when debating. You can express your beliefs but making it logical for the other to understand takes a more effort. I know other sites that are more designed for more-effort debates. I don't have the time for it though.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Most religions probably want to have peace and end this. Most religions would probably do it in the way their founders and/or teachings want them to. I keep repeating my point but you're not addressing them specifically.

The best example is saying that you are like Hindu because you have the same goals you feel one of many gods of hindu have that's defined by your religion not by Hinduis themselves.

Doing this is division. It causes people to divide when their beliefs are appropriated in other people's beliefs regardless the intention.

Diversity is not division. If you are for diversity, Bahaullah would not have other founders as prophets for his coming. It is a divisional religion just as many other god-religions.

The difference is I don't hear Bahai on the news causing wars. That doesn't mean you are different just mean you are nice and willing to learn.

Hindus say similar things. According to this website we are all Hindus. It's ok for them to define anyone who does good as a Hindu? I consider it a compliment and an honour not an insult.

About Hinduwebsite.Com - Our Aims and Mission

Who is a Hindu and why we do not favor conversions?
In truth, Hinduism is not just about those who practice it. Everyone who participates in creation and who shares a part of God's eternal and continuous duties and owes his or her life and allegiance to Him is a Hindu.

If you are living selflessly and performing your actions selflessly, you are a Hindu. If you are helping others, you are a Hindu. If you are living for God, in the service of God and offering your actions, you are Hindu. If you participate in any manner in God's eternal sacrifice called creation, you are a Hindu.


I am proud to belong to a religion which has taught the world both tolerance and universal acceptance. We believe not only in universal toleration, but we accept all religions as true. - Swami Vivekananda

Let's be completely fair here. If it's fair for prominent Hindus to say they accept all religions and not Baha'is then that's discrimination. If they can believe in all religions so can we. I'm sure they don't go to communion or confession or practice all the traditions of all the religions. Like us they simply believe that all religions teach truth.

Ask them to define exactly what they mean by 'we accept all religions as true' and I'm sure you'll find there's a lot of 'filtering and editing' involved in that statement. For starters most religions don't believe in reincarnation so wherefore the statement 'we accept all religions as true'??

Prominent people who shaped India and Hinduism spent time with Baha'is and read Bahá'í books.

Swami Vivekananda - Hindupedia, the Hindu Encyclopedia

The Swami lived while Baha'u'llah was alive and is mentioned in this article as a 'lover of mankind' and who was no doubt inspired by the teachings of Baha'u'llah which were circulating throughout India and Burma at the time.

This is a photo of the Swami taken at the Baha'i Green Acre School.

Green Acre Bahá'í School - Wikipedia

Swami Vivekananda, a prominent Hindu monk serving in interfaith awareness efforts and spent nearly two months there in the summer of 1894.

I wonder where he got many of his Baha'i like ideas from? Or was it just pure coincidence?

Beyond Bollywood: Swami Vivekananda and guests at Green Acre School | Newsdesk

The only way to accept all religions as true is to accept what they have in common and disregard their differences otherwise one cannot say all religions are true because there are contradictions.
The Swami would have recognised that which they have in common and made that statement otherwise how could he say they are all true when he believes reincarnation was true and they don't? He filtered and edited the differences out as Baha'is do and only look at what we have in common.

He wanted unity and peace and the great thinkers of India have all read our books and know what we're about - peace.

Mahatma Gandhi and the Bahá'ís

Ghandi said "The Bahá'í Faith is a solace to humankind." These words appeared in the Bombay Chronicle newspaper on May 24, 1944,

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Hindus say similar things. According to this website we are all Hindus. It's ok for them to define anyone who does good as a Hindu? I consider it a compliment and an honour not an insult.

About Hinduwebsite.Com - Our Aims and Mission

Who is a Hindu and why we do not favor conversions?
In truth, Hinduism is not just about those who practice it. Everyone who participates in creation and who shares a part of God's eternal and continuous duties and owes his or her life and allegiance to Him is a Hindu.

If you are living selflessly and performing your actions selflessly, you are a Hindu. If you are helping others, you are a Hindu. If you are living for God, in the service of God and offering your actions, you are Hindu. If you participate in any manner in God's eternal sacrifice called creation, you are a Hindu.


I am proud to belong to a religion which has taught the world both tolerance and universal acceptance. We believe not only in universal toleration, but we accept all religions as true. - Swami Vivekananda

Let's be completely fair here. If it's fair for prominent Hindus to say they accept all religions and not Baha'is then that's discrimination. If they can believe in all religions so can we. I'm sure they don't go to communion or confession or practice all the traditions of all the religions. Like us they simply believe that all religions teach truth.

Ask them to define exactly what they mean by 'we accept all religions as true' and I'm sure you'll find there's a lot of 'filtering and editing' involved in that statement. For starters most religions don't believe in reincarnation so wherefore the statement 'we accept all religions as true'??

Prominent people who shaped India and Hinduism spent time with Baha'is and read Bahá'í books.

Swami Vivekananda - Hindupedia, the Hindu Encyclopedia

The Swami lived while Baha'u'llah was alive and is mentioned in this article as a 'lover of mankind' and who was no doubt inspired by the teachings of Baha'u'llah which were circulating throughout India and Burma at the time.

This is a photo of the Swami taken at the Baha'i Green Acre School.

Green Acre Bahá'í School - Wikipedia

Swami Vivekananda, a prominent Hindu monk serving in interfaith awareness efforts and spent nearly two months there in the summer of 1894.

I wonder where he got many of his Baha'i like ideas from? Or was it just pure coincidence?

Beyond Bollywood: Swami Vivekananda and guests at Green Acre School | Newsdesk

The only way to accept all religions as true is to accept what they have in common and disregard their differences otherwise one cannot say all religions are true because there are contradictions.
The Swami would have recognised that which they have in common and made that statement otherwise how could he say they are all true when he believes reincarnation was true and they don't? He filtered and edited the differences out as Baha'is do and only look at what we have in common.

He wanted unity and peace and the great thinkers of India have all read our books and know what we're about - peace.

Mahatma Gandhi and the Bahá'ís

Ghandi said "The Bahá'í Faith is a solace to humankind." These words appeared in the Bombay Chronicle newspaper on May 24, 1944,

If you don't have the traditions, language, and culture, you are not hindu.

That's like calling me Bahai all because I want world peace. I'm sure there are things one should believe if one considers themselves bahai.

I cannot defend who is hindu and who is not only repeat what @Vinayaka said, what I read on Hindu threads, and what I briefly researched on my own. Buddhism has similar worldviews just without gods.

All of you have the same goals. No one is denying that.

Same goals and being one humanity does not make you another person.

 

[Dawnofhope]

What does that mean?

The Buddha says don't be attached to gods. You believe in god. Can you disattach yourself from god if you are following the teachings of The Dharma (do you follow The Dharma teachings? I know @loverofhumanity compared himself to Hindu. Does that depend on the Bahais or is that how Bahai sees themselves in relation to other religious?)

To understand the Baha'i revelation one must look to the writings:

Our greatest efforts must be directed towards detachment from the things of the world; we must strive to become more spiritual, more luminous, to follow the counsel of the Divine Teaching, to serve the cause of unity and true equality, to be merciful, to reflect the love of the Highest on all men, so that the light of the Spirit shall be apparent in all our deeds, to the end that all humanity shall be united, the stormy sea thereof calmed, and all rough waves disappear from off the surface of life's ocean henceforth unruffled and peaceful. Then will the New Jerusalem be seen by mankind, who will enter through its gates and receive the Divine Bounty.
(Abdu'l-Bahá, Paris Talks, p. 87)

Now is the moment in which to cleanse thyself with the waters of detachment that have flowed out from the Supreme Pen, and to ponder, wholly for the sake of God, those things which, time and again, have been sent down or manifested, and then to strive, as much as lieth in thee, to quench, through the power of wisdom and the force of thy utterance, the fire of enmity and hatred which smouldereth in the hearts of the peoples of the world.
(Bahá'u'lláh, Epistle to the Son of the Wolf, p. 12)

To me detachment means being mindful of God and having my thoughts and actions centred on His being.

I dont know about judgement other than revelations. He was born, he lived, he died, he rose, he will come again. As I'm not interested in scripture anymore, that's probably as far as I will get from memory.

To properly understand Christianity and be Christian at some stage we need to come to terms with the bible in its entirety. We can not take selected passages that contradict others. The book of Revelations is poorly understood by Christians IMHO, and one of the purposes of this book is for those that have recognised its fulfilment to explain it to those who haven't.

The oranged tastes good just I think you're trying to put oranges, apples, and pears from each person's basket into the one in the middle. While each bahai is different in respect of what they put in the basket. The belief is more saying peace will come from each person's fruit in the basket. Most religions rather keep their individuality without the gray area.

This goes back to why people are offended and understanding cultural appropriation.

I do not believe we are putting different fruit in peoples basket. I don't see how we are doing that.

We do have some clear and fixed ideas about what other religions are saying though. The resurrection of Christ is an example and fulfilment of prophecy another. Is that what you mean?

Eh. It confuses the mess out of us on RF especially when debating. You can express your beliefs but making it logical for the other to understand takes a more effort. I know other sites that are more designed for more-effort debates. I don't have the time for it though.

I grew up Christian. I had a period of a few years where I took time out from Christianity. During that time I explored Hinduism and Buddhism but didn't get very far with it. I returned to Christianity. Later I became a Baha'i. That is just my journey. Every Baha'is journey is different.

Sorry to confuse you.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Hm.

To me detachment means being mindful of God and having my thoughts and actions centred on His being.

Just thinking that's not at all what the Dharma taught. But, like Christianity, I can't make out the relation between Bahai and the other religions other than the goal for world peace.

Our greatest efforts must be directed towards detachment from the things of the world; we must strive to become more spiritual, more luminous, to follow the counsel of the Divine Teaching, to serve the cause of unity and true equality, to be merciful, to reflect the love of the Highest on all men, so that the light of the Spirit shall be apparent in all our deeds, to the end that all humanity shall be united, the stormy sea thereof calmed, and all rough waves disappear from off the surface of life's ocean henceforth unruffled and peaceful. Then will the New Jerusalem be seen by mankind, who will enter through its gates and receive the Divine Bounty.

To properly understand Christianity and be Christian at some stage we need to come to terms with the bible in its entirety. We can not take selected passages that contradict others. The book of Revelations is poorly understood by Christians IMHO, and one of the purposes of this book is for those that have recognised its fulfilment to explain it to those who haven't.

I do not believe we are putting different fruit in peoples basket. I don't see how we are doing that.

There's nothing wrong with it from a Bahai point of view. Think about it. Each founder is each fruit. The basket is world peace. You are kindly (unlike those who kill) taking fruit from each basket because you feel that every founder wants to make a fruit basket (world peace) and agree with you in how to do it. While I find that highly immoral and some people here with their own baskets corrected you on doing this, we can't stop you from "taking our fruits" just point out how it's affecting us by doing so.

You just have a different belief system. I never heard of a religion that does this, though. That's why it's nice talking to you.

We do have some clear and fixed ideas about what other religions are saying though. The resurrection of Christ is an example and fulfilment of prophecy another. Is that what you mean?

Just that he was born, lived, died, rose, and will come again. That's what scripture says. Whether it's true, how, when, metaphoric or not, it's only literal when I experience all of these things in Mass. Outside of that, for discussion, I'd have to reread the bible. Aka: I can only talk from my experiences.

I grew up Christian. I had a period of a few years where I took time out from Christianity. During that time I explored Hinduism and Buddhism but didn't get very far with it. I returned to Christianity. Later I became a Baha'i. That is just my journey. Every Baha'is journey is different.

As a Bahai, couldn't you be all these things at one time?

 

[Dawnofhope]

Just thinking that's not at all what the Dharma taught. But, like Christianity, I can't make out the relation between Bahai and the other religions other than the goal for world peace.

OK. Understanding Buddhism is a work in progress for me. When I talk about attachment and detachment, I'm explaining the Baha'i position. Clearly these are themes that feature strongly in Buddhists teachings. However Baha'is believe in God, whereas many Buddhists don't. Baha'is believe we should be attached to God through prayer, reading from the writings, and living the life.

There's nothing wrong with it from a Bahai point of view. Think about it. Each founder is each fruit. The basket is world peace. You are kindly (unlike those who kill) taking fruit from each basket because you feel that every founder wants to make a fruit basket (world peace) and agree with you in how to do it. While I find that highly immoral and some people here with their own baskets corrected you on doing this, we can't stop you from "taking our fruits" just point out how it's affecting us by doing so.

You just have a different belief system. I never heard of a religion that does this, though. That's why it's nice talking to you.

Thank you. I hope I haven't offended you. Baha'is should avoid giving or taking offence.

In regards to one faith taking from another, The Christians have taken from the Jews, and the Muslims have taken from the Jews and the Christians. Its nothing new and I think many Abrahamic adherents, especially those who have interfaith dialogue know this and understand it. At some point we just accept it for what it is, rather than trying to change it, or get upset about it. Then we can better understand it, because we are detached.

Just that he was born, lived, died, rose, and will come again. That's what scripture says. Whether it's true, how, when, metaphoric or not, it's only literal when I experience all of these things in Mass. Outside of that, for discussion, I'd have to reread the bible. Aka: I can only talk from my experiences.

That is fine, as I talk from my experience as a Christian also (lowly protestant of course).

As a Bahai, couldn't you be all these things at one time?

That's an interesting question. I believe in all the main world religions but would not say that I am a Muslim, Buddhist, or Hindu. I might sometimes say I'm Christian because I live according to the teachings of Christ and study the Bible. I have a special personal relationship with Christianity. If someone asks and they do not know me, I will say I'm a Baha'i. Because we have talked a lot you know I have this special connection to Christianity so I may say to you I'm Christian too.

 

[loverofhumanity]

If you don't have the traditions, language, and culture, you are not hindu.

That's like calling me Bahai all because I want world peace. I'm sure there are things one should believe if one considers themselves bahai.

I cannot defend who is hindu and who is not only repeat what @Vinayaka said, what I read on Hindu threads, and what I briefly researched on my own. Buddhism has similar worldviews just without gods.

All of you have the same goals. No one is denying that.

Same goals and being one humanity does not make you another person.

Other websites say anyone who serves humanity is in essence a Hindu. I just want you to try and think not so much about outward things but the fact that inwardly we all believe in truth.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Why the Adamic Cycle? That's so Abrahamic. And isn't the Hindu traditions older than 6,000 years?

So what happened during the previous 500,000 minus the 6,000? 'Cause things were sure ugly during those last 6,000.

The hell we made it? Who's in charge? If God is real, if he's the one that created everything, why did he make it so we are so stupid as to behave as we do?

A century to make peace? If God struck the bad people down, annihilated Sodom and Gomorrah, flooded and killed almost every living thing on the planet, why doesn't he still do that? Let him rid the planet of evil people like he used to do. Oh yes, in Revelation he says he is going to do that when Jesus comes back. In fact Jesus is going to do it. So what happened?

The spike in science and technology? How many modern innovations are the result of research for military purposes?

There were cycles before and Manifestations before but we don't know their name.

When a child is born it is ignorant and needs to be educated. Humanity has gone through its stages of adolescence and now is approaching maturity but it won't happen overnight.

If we listened to the advice of the Manifestations we wouldn't be in this mess.

Note: Baha'u'llah came and taught about peace and unity close to a decade before the world wars broke out. That should tell us something.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Especially shocking that he returned in Persia. Why not Jerusalem? But on the other hand, so much is made about Jesus. Tell me more of how he fulfilled being the return of who was expected in Islam? And right off the bat
So if reincarnation is not from God, then from whom? Man? and not a the manifestation? Yet, in the Holy writings of some religions it says that people come back here in a different body.

Now for walking in the "ways" of God? Which ways? You've got people believing all sorts of things about God and putting into practice those things to promote that version of who they believe God is. Like Paul in the NT persecuted Christians, and you have had probably some well-meaning religious people work against the Baha'i Faith... in the name of who they think God is.

And the thing about the soul: Why put a soul through the misery of an impoverished life on this Earthly realm? They are born with nothing, get tortured, have no food, get horrible diseases and die young. What was their purpose? Why is this world so filled with people in hopeless situations?

Wouldn't it be more fair, that if you are a tyrant in one life, that you come back and see what it's like to be the one being put through the misery because of the cruelty of others?

Jeremiah 49:38

I will set my throne in Elam (Persia)

Both the Bab and Baha'u'llah appeared in Persia - Elam.

 

[loverofhumanity]

So the Hindu concept of 'unity in diversity' is wrong, according to you. So the only right 'unity in diversity' is the Bahai version? Comments like that will build bridges?

I was speaking about how some Muslims see other Faiths as 'infidels'. Nothing to do with Hinduism at all. Hinduism has a very broad minded and tolerant religion with a wonderful concept of non violence.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Other websites say anyone who serves humanity is in essence a Hindu. I just want you to try and think not so much about outward things but the fact that inwardly we all believe in truth.

I don't think you're getting what Hindu means to Hinduis compared to a name. TLC are seen in the same way as inward signs. They cannot be separated.

I can do better with Catholicism. Catholic means universal. So, in that sense, you are saying that you are Catholic because of the love of Christ, the spiritual understanding of the sacraments, love, and unity

You can all yourself Catholic but without the literal outward signs of the sacraments of Christ, believing the Eucharist is Jesus Christ, and being of one mind with the Church and no one else not even Bahaullah you are not Catholic.

Outward signs shape how we define inward signs. If it's the other way around, that sounds more new age. All religions have outward signs, Bahai included (I've already gave you an example, posts ago).

The native american example I gave you, it's saying you're Cherokee all because you have Cherokee blood in you. It's saying I'm bahai all because I do believe in unity and love....

but the unity and love as how you define it is different than how I define it.

Without my believing in god, bahaullah, and being of like-mind with other bahais, am I really Bahai just because I believe in world peace?

What's the difference between a Bahai and just any person with a title who wants world peace?

 

[Vinayaka]

I was speaking about how some Muslims see other Faiths as 'infidels'. Nothing to do with Hinduism at all. Hinduism has a very broad minded and tolerant religion with a wonderful concept of non violence.

Yes, that's what I meant. Your criticism is at Islam.

But to return to this idea of 'unity in diversity' and our differences on it. I had further insight from meditations. For us, the idea of sharing willingly includes things like food, labour, and time. For Bahai, and this is an essential difference, you guys also want to share IDEAS. True, some people may need ideas like ahimsa, but a lot of us don't. therefore we find it annoying. You're preaching to the converted on that. And of course we don't neet to hear all about Bahai either.

 

[loverofhumanity]

I don't think you're getting what Hindu means to Hinduis compared to a name. TLC are seen in the same way as inward signs. They cannot be separated.

I can do better with Catholicism. Catholic means universal. So, in that sense, you are saying that you are Catholic because of the love of Christ, the spiritual understanding of the sacraments, love, and unity

You can all yourself Catholic but without the literal outward signs of the sacraments of Christ, believing the Eucharist is Jesus Christ, and being of one mind with the Church and no one else not even Bahaullah you are not Catholic.

Outward signs shape how we define inward signs. If it's the other way around, that sounds more new age. All religions have outward signs, Bahai included (I've already gave you an example, posts ago).

The native american example I gave you, it's saying you're Cherokee all because you have Cherokee blood in you. It's saying I'm bahai all because I do believe in unity and love....

but the unity and love as how you define it is different than how I define it.

Without my believing in god, bahaullah, and being of like-mind with other bahais, am I really Bahai just because I believe in world peace?

What's the difference between a Bahai and just any person with a title who wants world peace?

A Baha'i shall be known by his deeds so it's posssiblr that a person who has never heard or believe in Baha'u'llah is a better Baha'i than a Baha'i because he might embody more better the virtues of the Baha'is.

Strictly speaking outwardly no you're not a Baha'i but Bahá'í is not just a name but an inward reality. A belief is an inward reality not just a name.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Strictly speaking outwardly no you're not a Baha'i but Bahá'í is not just a name but an inward reality. A belief is an inward reality not just a name.

To Hinduis its not just a name. It means something just as Bahai means to you. Cant you see the connection in what you said?

"Outwardly I am not a bahai" as a result inwardly I am not "as well."

They go together. If you dont understand how TLC is embedded in a Hindu definition of love, there is no unity among diversity.

Try to understand their TLC rather than tell us what you dont believe

AND

Consider what we say is truth even though these TLC arent "just " tlc to others as they are to you

 

[Vinayaka]

Strictly speaking outwardly no you're not a Baha'i but Bahá'í is not just a name but an inward reality. A belief is an inward reality not just a name.

Inward realities vary a ton. Because of reincarnation (and I don't mean it as some vague theory, but as an inward reality) the Hindu world view differs from yours. We see ourselves as souls temporarily inhabiting bodies, and are chronically reflecting (and discussing) on things like picking up new souls, where to best get reborn to alleviate karmas, who a person was in their last lifetime, what karma they may hold to have a disability, etc. All these things are just ordinary topics of conversation with Hindus, because of our inner reality.

No Bahai would be so casual about this stuff, or they would have to face the tough question, "Am I really a Bahai?" because these re not Bahai beliefs.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Inward realities vary a ton. Because of reincarnation (and I don't mean it as some vague theory, but as an inward reality) the Hindu world view differs from yours. We see ourselves as souls temporarily inhabiting bodies, and are chronically reflecting (and discussing) on things like picking up new souls, where to best get reborn to alleviate karmas, who a person was in their last lifetime, what karma they may hold to have a disability, etc. All these things are just ordinary topics of conversation with Hindus, because of our inner reality.

No Bahai would be so casual about this stuff, or they would have to face the tough question, "Am I really a Bahai?" because these re not Bahai beliefs.

It was just figuratively speaking. We do believe in karma though just that it will effect our spiritual development in both this world and worlds hereafter.

 

[Vinayaka]

It was just figuratively speaking. We do believe in karma though just that it will effect our spiritual development in both this world and worlds hereafter.

But that's not karma in any traditional sense. In any traditional sense it is intricately connected to the reincarnation process. Why do you keep inventing things like this? I don't understand your purpose at all.

This is like me saying, "Oh yeah, I know Bahaullah. He's that friend of Donald Trump." It is plain irrational and goes against all previous knowledge.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Yes, that's what I meant. Your criticism is at Islam.

But to return to this idea of 'unity in diversity' and our differences on it. I had further insight from meditations. For us, the idea of sharing willingly includes things like food, labour, and time. For Bahai, and this is an essential difference, you guys also want to share IDEAS. True, some people may need ideas like ahimsa, but a lot of us don't. therefore we find it annoying. You're preaching to the converted on that. And of course we don't neet to hear all about Bahai either.

We have you to thank. You pointed me to a very nice website where I can do more research from a Hindunpoint of view as well as a Book I bought which I love the ahimsa throughout. And you've been most patient.