How are these Great Beings explained?

[TransmutingSoul]

Great and appropriate analogy. A 2018 Jeep for a $1000? And we're going to trust that salesman? What's the catch? Same with the Baha'i Faith, can we trust the salesman? Baha'is make everything sound simple and easy. Yes, all religions are one if we reject the religious teachings from the past that taught differences.

So how is the Baha'i car running? A lot of us have seen local Baha'i Communities in action. It's far from perfect. Inactive members. Years of Baha'i fireside talks with very few "seekers". I was there in the 70's when they tried mass teaching techniques. Going door to door and inviting people to a meeting to hear the message. What happened? Isn't there something about entry by troops? It's been almost 50 years. The Baha'i Faith is still struggling along trying to get members, and to keep members.

Is the Baha'i Faith a clunker or a finely tuned machine?

Ha ha CG, they are actually free, no charge.

Given away as long as you abide by the requirements and look after the gift.

When you do that there is an etrnity warranty. They only ever have issues if we do not look after them as instructed.

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Sorry you are mistaken about God.

Meditate and talk to ones own self to find all that is good and you talk to God.

Baha'u'llah is your true self, if He did not exist, you are not here. When you draw on all that is good in you, you ask that of Baha'u'llah. (All Great Beings)

To deny God is to deny we live.

Yes, you have that choice and we are dead without God.

This is exactly why it is hard to speak with you. You deny that god is only a delusion and your true self is not attached to god and anything else you look outside to help you. Whether you believe it or not, it is true. I hope one day you will not believe in god anymore and find your true self js from your mind first not your heart.

Sorry. Im not that cruel to mean that; thats not my personality nonetheless my morals. Proving a point you may have missed or ignored.

I am happy you are in your faith. It helps you. You dont deny The Buddha. You cannot deny something you dont believe is true. So, I see no use in hoping you find your true self.

That is completely rude not just to you but for me as well.

That is me.

Again I ask. How can you deny something that does not exist?

I asked this many times.

It is not me selling the car. Baha'u'llah is Gods Representative.

They stand on their own Merritts, they do not need people that do not want to choose what is on offer.

Again I am not part of that company, I have no shares. I am but a happy customer.

They give amazing bonuses with their cars.

Why should I trust you then?

Why offer information if you dont want us to trust you are giving us correct information?

I did not ask you and would never ask you to trust me, I only offered you a chance to look for yourself.

That is the point in offers. You have to build some sort of trust first.

If not, it is not offers. If is protestlyzing and solicitation.

They only want people that choose to buy, a customer who is prepared to really look after what they brought.

So they put the best of cars on display with no price tags. We then find, if we do choose to look, they are actually given away at no cost. Still people choose not to look at them, convinced there is some catch or dishonesy happening.

Actually, no. If the salesman is not an employee of the company, doesnt feel he has the right to sale his company's car, and only offers cars without gaining the clients trust,

Why in the world would you expect a client to take what you offer when they are getting information directly from you and you dont want to build trust; so, we dont know if your offer is trustworthy?

Unless you can bring out the manager to sell the car for you?

Can you?

Then there are some that drive away and do not look after what they were given.

I am happy with mine, need to look after it a lot better.

As I said, your choice if you want to look.

That does not make sense, Tony. I have a car. Why look at yours when you cant even say you represent the people who sell it?

Who Are you then in relation to what you offer?

Sounds like you do not want a perfect free car, no worries just thought I would let you know.

Thus I wish you well and leave it at that. It was great to meet you.......If in the future you see me around and want directions or number of that place, still happy to provide. Or you may stumble upon it yourself.

Speeds off happy in what I got Farewell from Tony

This is a HUGE problem.

I saw a Bahai temple on the bus on my way to school twice a week.

If Bahai expects me to buy their car even though I already have a new one (better maliage) and they cannot genuiely wish me well without hoping to buy their car, why visit?

Its totally rude.

Especially for anyone expecting to be One with diversity.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Again I ask. How can you deny something that does not exist?

All the Questions you ask, build an understanding only when there is God in the mix, thus my answers contain that importance.

I have told you if you ask me any questions, it will have that component.

Now, together, we have proved the advice from a Great Being, that to argue over God proves we are both wrong.

The Great Beings Wisdom should be considered in these matters.

Stay happy Carlita.

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Now, together, we have proved the advice from a Great Being, that to argue over God proves we are both wrong.

The Great Beings Wisdom should be considered in these matters.

I dont see jesus, bahaullah, muhammad as divine great beings. I disagree god exists. I personally can talk as if god does. I can even discuss christianity and religion in general because I love religion. My beliefs dont change just because I dont mind talking about god. If anything, that makes me learn about myself and my place among people of other religions. The more I learn about other religions the stronger I am in my own. Personal experience.

Its a hyperthetical. I asked you the question without religion involved: how can I deny a pencil in my hand where there isnt one in my hand?

This question isnt religious in nature. Its not an analogy. Im asking you to use science-pyschological logic based on your understanding of reality to deterine how you define and talk about something say the pencil is red when there is no pencil to judge its color.

Its not an analogy for god. God isnt a pencil nor a thing.

Can you answer the question?

Remember. Not all questions have a god component. RF is throwing you off. Pretend we are in person and I dont know you believe in any god.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Hey @adrian009

Here is more information on Mahayana Buddhism in which Pure Land is in. The Lotus Sutra I read has many buddhas that come after shakyamuni. Many of which already died going into paranivana and coming back to helping beinves to enlightenment. It doesnt reflect the original Buddhist teachings that had no salvational aspect to it like Pure Land and Tendai (Japanese) does. Pure Land is in the middle. Im not too much into wiki. Good info nonetheless.

Mahayana sutras (not suttas) in later buddhisms and Mahayana sutras two. I read the sutras are oral and wasnt written down until later.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I dont see jesus, bahaullah, muhammad as divine great beings. I disagree god exists. I personally can talk as if god does.

As one who says they were a Catholic, where God is fundamental important to being a Catholic, and you say you have no belief in God, I am not surprised.

We can use the lamp without the Light.

Remember. Not all questions have a god component. RF is throwing you off. Pretend we are in person and I dont know you believe in any god.

The Great Beings have a God compnent. You can not take that out of belief in them.

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

As one who says they were a Catholic, where God is fundamental important to being a Catholic, and you say you have no belief in God, I am not surprised.

We can use the lamp without the Light.



The Great Beings have a God compnent. You can not take that out of belief in them.

Regards Tony

Catholics believe in the trinity. Jesus is part of that trinity and he is god. He is historical and a physical person with physical sacraments and a physical Eucharist. You cant get to god without christ. No christ. No god.

Islam, Judaism, Hindu, Pagan, all believe in gods. Many of which are not "physical" gods. Some are beings, some are transedential force (for lack of better words), and some are historic idols worshiped. They are all invisible.

I know nothing of these gods however defined unless there is a physical element involved (christ, vishnu statue, pagan statue) but I know nothing of Judism god, Islam, nor Bahai.

Explain god's physical nature. If it has a physical nature (not trinitarian, I dont know bahaullah-no bahaullah sacraments) I can get a concept of it. If its just an essense, that could be anything.

I left catholicism because to know christ you MUST believe in his father. If you dont believe the father, you dont believe in christ. You dont believe in christ you are no longer part of the Church.

We have seen spirits before. We have interacted with spirits before. All used to be actual people.

Explain god without someone (christ, bahaullah) or something (statue) physical without describing its virtues, we have somewhere to start.

Since I know no god, again, how can I deny something that does not exist?

Dont insult my intellegence and experience. Its a question that can be applied to any subject.

It does NOT have to be god.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

De ja vu

 

[CG Didymus]

Ha ha CG, they are actually free, no charge.

Given away as long as you abide by the requirements and look after the gift.

When you do that there is an etrnity warranty. They only ever have issues if we do not look after them as instructed.

Regards Tony

A Baha'i teaching the Faith is like a salesperson. They are representing the faith, but they aren't perfect. But there's the problems of the teachings of all the other religions. They all differ. Baha'is have to show all religions are one in spite of these differences.

The Christian salesperson says that Jesus is God. The devil is out to deceive you. And they have the only truth and that truth is Jesus. Now add all the other religions and which salesperson do you believe? They are all just people. And like with cars, most of them are happy with what they have.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

A Baha'i teaching the Faith is like a salesperson. They are representing the faith, but they aren't perfect. But there's the problems of the teachings of all the other religions. They all differ. Baha'is have to show all religions are one in spite of these differences.

The Christian salesperson says that Jesus is God. The devil is out to deceive you. And they have the only truth and that truth is Jesus. Now add all the other religions and which salesperson do you believe? They are all just people. And like with cars, most of them are happy with what they have.

Remember in the Analogy that God is the Manufacturer and the salesperson is the Messenger, not the believer. The believer does not re-sell, but tells people where to find to look and consider for their own selves.

The difficulty is that man likes re-badging His chosen make and also puts on all His accessories. So what was once made perfect, has been changed greatly....a bit like this;

Now what Faith was that again?

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@adrian009

I have a question I want to ask you. I asked many christians this too and no answer. Youre reflective about it.

Can you deny something that does not exist?

It doesnt need to be religious in nature. Just I dont know the logic behind it.

 

[loverofhumanity]

A Baha'i teaching the Faith is like a salesperson. They are representing the faith, but they aren't perfect. But there's the problems of the teachings of all the other religions. They all differ. Baha'is have to show all religions are one in spite of these differences.

The Christian salesperson says that Jesus is God. The devil is out to deceive you. And they have the only truth and that truth is Jesus. Now add all the other religions and which salesperson do you believe? They are all just people. And like with cars, most of them are happy with what they have.

CG. You said the most important thing - we are all people.

Sounds very simple but it’s not accepted universally by everyone. Equal,human rights is not universally applied resulting in much oppression. If everyone viewed the world as one family we could not tolerate gross injustices against minorities or things like racism or world’s poverty. People unfortunately are divided into races, religions and nationalities each only concerned with themselves.

If we accepted all humanity as our family then there would be things like universal free Medicare, universal free education and world employment and military budgets would be used to improve the quality of life of all people. Things like clean water would be made available to all from a world fund dedicated to improving the quality of life of all peoples.

We would have educational programs promoting the beauty of all races, religions and nationalities and there would not be this ‘us and them’ mentality.

However a blind eye is often turned when it’s not our race or our religion or our nationality which is being persecuted or gassed or exploited or suffering.

The most important thing today is to change the mentality from ‘us and them’ to ‘we’ and see the injury of one as the injury of all, the poverty of one as a reflection on us all.

We can only stand by and do nothing about the suffering and poor because we have been desensitized to look after only number one.

As you said so wisely. It doesn’t matter what we believe or don’t believe or what colour, race and religion we are. All that matters is we are all people. That is what we all need to learn and accept - our oneness and common foundation as human beings but in action not just empty words.

 

[Dawnofhope]

@adrian009

I have a question I want to ask you. I asked many christians this too and no answer. Youre reflective about it.

Can you deny something that does not exist?

It doesnt need to be religious in nature. Just I dont know the logic behind it.

If someone does not believe in something then of course they are at liberty to express that belief. You don't believe in God and I don't believe in gods. We deny the existence of something we do not believe in. Whether or not our beliefs are true as well as genuine concern for others is at the heart of any meaningful conversation. We need to accept and respect others POV for that to happen. What do you think?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

If someone does not believe in something then of course they are at liberty to express that belief. You don't believe in God and I don't believe in gods. We deny the existence of something we do not believe in. Whether or not our beliefs are true as well as genuine concern for others is at the heart of any meaningful conversation. We need to accept and respect others POV for that to happen. What do you think?

I was thinking in general its illogical. Outside of religion, if I had a pencil in my hand I can deny its existence even though its not true. If I had no pencil, there would be nothing to deny. Instead, I can deny the idea that there is a pencil but not the pencil itself.

Make sense?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Since I know no god, again, how can I deny something that does not exist?

I was thinking in general its illogical. Outside of religion, if I had a pencil in my hand I can deny its existence even though its not true. If I had no pencil, there would be nothing to deny. Instead, I can deny the idea that there is a pencil but not the pencil itself.

Make sense?

Its not that tangible Carlita. To make a stance on what is not yet proven is the issue here. With a pencil in the hand, it is or it is not, life is simple with that decision.

Science can not say yet if there is a God or not, the jury is still out. Many do think there is intelligence in the design.

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Its not that tangible Carlita. To make a stance on what is not yet proven is the issue here. With a pencil in the hand, it is or it is not, life is simple with that decision.

Science can not say yet if there is a God or not, the jury is still out. Many do think there is intelligence in the design.

Regards Tony

I dont believe in god so talking about god is like talking about a pencil that isnt there.

So, its just a question of tangible intellect logic. I asked Adrian if what I said made sense.

There is no god in this question.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Dont insult my intellegence and experience. Its a question that can be applied to any subject.

I dont believe in god so talking about god is like talking about a pencil that isnt there.

So, its just a question of tangible intellect logic. I asked Adrian if what I said made sense.

There is no god in this question.

I appealed to your intelligence with my reply.

So we can conclude. Carlita - No God, Science still unknown, Great Beings = God.

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I dont believe in god so talking about god is like talking about a pencil that isnt there.

So, its just a question of tangible intellect logic. I asked Adrian if what I said made sense.

There is no god in this question.

I appealed to your intelligence with my reply.

So we can conclude. Carlita - No God, Science still unknown, Great Beings = God.

Regards Tony

The question was a yes or no and why. You answered indirectly (its there or its not) and I cant guess what you mean unless you are direct. That and you added god which wasnt in the question. So, your answers are roundabouts. Its your conversation style.

 

[CG Didymus]

CG. You said the most important thing - we are all people.

Sounds very simple but it’s not accepted universally by everyone. Equal,human rights is not universally applied resulting in much oppression. If everyone viewed the world as one family we could not tolerate gross injustices against minorities or things like racism or world’s poverty. People unfortunately are divided into races, religions and nationalities each only concerned with themselves.

If we accepted all humanity as our family then there would be things like universal free Medicare, universal free education and world employment and military budgets would be used to improve the quality of life of all people. Things like clean water would be made available to all from a world fund dedicated to improving the quality of life of all peoples.

We would have educational programs promoting the beauty of all races, religions and nationalities and there would not be this ‘us and them’ mentality.

However a blind eye is often turned when it’s not our race or our religion or our nationality which is being persecuted or gassed or exploited or suffering.

The most important thing today is to change the mentality from ‘us and them’ to ‘we’ and see the injury of one as the injury of all, the poverty of one as a reflection on us all.

We can only stand by and do nothing about the suffering and poor because we have been desensitized to look after only number one.

As you said so wisely. It doesn’t matter what we believe or don’t believe or what colour, race and religion we are. All that matters is we are all people. That is what we all need to learn and accept - our oneness and common foundation as human beings but in action not just empty words.

It seems like in some religions there is a built in "us" and "them". The Israelites were the "chosen" and all others were evil idol worshippers. In Christianity, there are the believers and those that are lost destined for hell. No other people from other religions qualify for the Christian heaven. There's the saved and the unsaved non-believers.

 

[CG Didymus]

Remember in the Analogy that God is the Manufacturer and the salesperson is the Messenger, not the believer. The believer does not re-sell, but tells people where to find to look and consider for their own selves.

The difficulty is that man likes re-badging His chosen make and also puts on all His accessories. So what was once made perfect, has been changed greatly....a bit like this;

Now what Faith was that again?

Regards Tony

Forget the car. The messenger makes claims about who God is. People then evaluate it and decide to accept or reject the claims. There is always enough ambiguity to go either way. It never fits perfectly. Some believe and say how wonderful the new religion is. Others point out all the things wrong with the new religion. But people are still trying to promote the religion or trying to warn people against it. The worst proof of the validity of a religion is how the believers live up it's tenets. Are the Baha'is living proof of the truth of their religion? Unfortunately no, people will always fall short.