How Do Christians Reconcile The Following Question Regarding Their Faith?

[prometheus11]

So a believer can't trust his own beliefs or God's word?

That's an interesting conclusion for you to come to.

Doesn't Hebrews 6:4-6 discuss believers losing their salvation?

 

[Forgemaster]

Again, you are expressing you misunderstanding of what it means to be a Christian. Of course, YOU could not meet the standard. Only Christ can and has. Love and peace is found only in resting in Him. When you say you did not "feel" love what were you looking for? Obviously, you did believe God's word which states plainly He does love those who belong to Jesus Christ.

I was looking for that God you speak of, but he's not there. If he is them I'm no more flawed than he is.

 

[Forgemaster]

Of course nothing is ever the fault of your God because you blindly follow him. A true sheep.

 

[serp777]

Which is sad and I dont know how anyone can find inspiration out of that.

Right and as well all know inspiration =/= truth.

 

[Thana]

By what standards are we to judge god?

I will not accept that he is beyond judgment.
That is your crutch, not mine.

Well I'm sure that won't be a complete and utter waste of your time to postulate the immorality of a being you don't even believe exists in the first place.

 

[McBell]

Well I'm sure that won't be a complete and utter waste of your time to postulate the immorality of a being you don't even believe exists in the first place.

i noticed you did not answer the question.
Why is that?

 

[Thana]

i noticed you did not answer the question.
Why is that?

By what standards are we to judge God?

My answer is none. We're not capable, or worthy to judge Him and you even less so since you don't even know Him. All you can judge is second hand perceptions of Him, and if you actually cared about accuracy you'd realize that even if you could get a measure of understanding of Him you're way too biased to ever be trusted.

 

[prometheus11]

We shouldn't judge God by his own standards?

 

[McBell]

My answer is none. We're not capable, or worthy to judge Him and you even less so since you don't even know Him. All you can judge is second hand perceptions of Him, and if you actually cared about accuracy you'd realize that even if you could get a measure of understanding of Him you're way too biased to ever be trusted.

And my answer is by his own standards.
I do not give god the free pass you do.

Nor do I make the ego masturbating claims of knowing god better than others.

 

[Thana]

And my answer is by his own standards.
I do not give god the free pass you do.

Nor do I make the ego masturbating claims of knowing god better than others.

Free pass? Ego?
I'm not the one who thinks they can judge a being that is supposed to be omniscient and omnipotent and the Creator of the entire universe. I mean what size ego must you have to do that?
And one would imagine that a belief in God and the practice of prayer to Him and meditation on Him would give me somewhat of an edge when it comes to knowing Him.

And you never answered my first question. Why do we not follow the rules we give to our pets? Because we know better than them and they would eat their own vomit if we let them.
We're the pets, God's the owner. Like it or not.

 

[serp777]

Free pass? Ego?
I'm not the one who thinks they can judge a being that is supposed to be omniscient and omnipotent and the Creator of the entire universe. I mean what size ego must you have to do that?
And one would imagine that a belief in God and the practice of prayer to Him and meditation on Him would give me somewhat of an edge when it comes to knowing Him.

And you never answered my first question. Why do we not follow the rules we give to our pets? Because we know better than them and they would eat their own vomit if we let them.
We're the pets, God's the owner. Like it or not.

Just because a being is all knowing doesn't mean its omni benevolent.

If anything God is beyond morality--why does he need morality? Morality is a human invention meant to help us survive in the world. There's nothing requiring God to be good as opposed to entirely neutral. If God was a neutral being the problem of good and evil goes away--those labels are relative and meaningless for a deity like God.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

If you are truly' born again then you need to repent of your rebellion against Him. It sounds to me that you didn't really know God though by the statement you made saying, " I did my best to do what was pleasing to him". Someone who is born again doesn't "try" to please God as if attempting to meet some standard by their efforts and then become disillusioned. That sounds like religion minus a relationship with Christ because in a loving relationship with Christ there is rest and peace and living a life that is pleasing to the Lord is a joyful desire.

In the bible, Yahweh accuses other gods of being crappy gods at the Council of El. Per your logic, He should return there and apologize for rebelling.

Of course he knew what was good and bad; he was created in God's image. And as a perfect creature, he was designed to always do good! He actual had to force himself to disobey. That's why the penalty was so heavy, and why the serpent (who was Satan -- Revelation 12:9) went to Eve first, being the easiest to deceive, and using her to get to Adam.

If being in God's image was the only necessary trait to know the difference between good and evil, there would be no need for a tree with magic fruit that gave those effects, right?

As was mentioned, they only had one prohibitive law. If they hadn't known good from bad, there would have been a lot more laws. "Don't beat the animals", "Don't pee in your food", etc.

And the penalty? He knew what death was. He had seen animals die. He knew what it meant!

Why didn't God kill them? Could it be because He cares about moral rationales and decided, as He did later with Cain, that no willful disobedience took place because you have to sin knowingly to sin? Otherwise, you're just an idiot who screwed up. They couldn't even handle the ONE law. Eve, who wasn't there when it was mentioned (she was created afterwards), adds "touching" when God said no such thing. Adam and Eve are idiots.

By what standards are we to judge God?

My answer is none. We're not capable, or worthy to judge Him and you even less so since you don't even know Him. All you can judge is second hand perceptions of Him, and if you actually cared about accuracy you'd realize that even if you could get a measure of understanding of Him you're way too biased to ever be trusted.

But as you believe the bible is God's Word, we are not getting "second hand perceptions" about morality. We are using the standards He Himself supposedly gave, like the standard that if I am unable to scream in a populated area when raped, I get to be murdered by authorities because I "should have screamed".

Free pass? Ego?
I'm not the one who thinks they can judge a being that is supposed to be omniscient and omnipotent and the Creator of the entire universe. I mean what size ego must you have to do that?
And one would imagine that a belief in God and the practice of prayer to Him and meditation on Him would give me somewhat of an edge when it comes to knowing Him.

And you never answered my first question. Why do we not follow the rules we give to our pets? Because we know better than them and they would eat their own vomit if we let them.
We're the pets, God's the owner. Like it or not.

FYI
Also here

 

[McBell]

Free pass? Ego?
I'm not the one who thinks they can judge a being that is supposed to be omniscient and omnipotent and the Creator of the entire universe. I mean what size ego must you have to do that?
And one would imagine that a belief in God and the practice of prayer to Him and meditation on Him would give me somewhat of an edge when it comes to knowing Him.

And you never answered my first question. Why do we not follow the rules we give to our pets? Because we know better than them and they would eat their own vomit if we let them.
We're the pets, God's the owner. Like it or not.

i am not the one who has put god on an untouchable pedestal...
Nor am I the one who thinks god is my "owner"

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

My brother and I aren't our dogs' owners. We are the "parents" who took over from the canine parents...

 

[Katzpur]

My brother and I aren't our dogs' owners. We are the "parents" who took over from the canine parents...

But unless the courts found their canine parents to be "unfit" or unless the canine parents voluntarily gave their children up for you to adopt, wouldn't that make you a kidnapper of sorts?

 

[Thana]

i am not the one who has put god on an untouchable pedestal...
Nor am I the one who thinks god is my "owner"

Neither does a puppy acknowledge their owner and master.

And I didn't put Him on that pedestal, thats just the basic monotheistic concept of God. If you aren't willing to approach Him as is then bringing Him down to a level He is not at just to debate the faults you gave Him is not very productive.

 

[McBell]

Neither does a puppy acknowledge their owner and master.

So now we are no better than puppies?

And I didn't put Him on that pedestal, thats just the basic monotheistic concept of God.

ouch.
So you merely accept where you were told he "belongs"?

If you aren't willing to approach Him as is then bringing Him down to a level He is not at just to debate the faults you gave Him is not very productive.

You mean as you claim he is...
actually, I see it as bringing him up to a level to discuss, but to each their own.

What debate?
You are merely declaring your beliefs.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

But if he knew good and evil then why eat the fruit at all? Wasn't that the point?

Yeah....it was pretty easy to follow, wasn't it? He did it, because Eve had already eaten from it, and he didn't want to lose her. Or live without her. He chose her over God.

And I don't think animals died because isn't death the punishment so there is no way he saw animals die.

What? Animals die now, they've always died. God's purpose for them wasn't to live forever. Besides, how would Adam know what death was, if he hadn't seen it?

 

[Skwim]

What? Animals die now, they've always died. God's purpose for them wasn't to live forever. Besides, how would Adam know what death was, if he hadn't seen it?

Got a chapter and verse for this? "God's purpose for the other animals and plants is to die."

 

[prometheus11]

Yeah....it was pretty easy to follow, wasn't it? He did it, because Eve had already eaten from it, and he didn't want to lose her. Or live without her. He chose her over God.



What? Animals die now, they've always died. God's purpose for them wasn't to live forever. Besides, how would Adam know what death was, if he hadn't seen it?

You're saying that Adam gained ZERO knowledge of good and evil from eating of the tree?

Why were A & E banished from Eden?