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How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?

J

Jonathan Hoffman

Active Member
What does it means to be righteous without Paul's Christ.

My favorite quote from this article is
"The problem is that Christians do not understand the meaning of the concept "righteousness." They think it means that one has never sinned. Never sinning is almost impossible. The Torah says that "There is no person on earth so righteous that he does only good and never sins" (Eccl. 7:20)
Rather, the definition of a righteous person is as taught in Proverbs 24:16: "The righteous fall even seven times and still get up, but the wicked stumble in evil."
Click to expand...

Please read:
How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?
 
Levite

Levite

Higher and Higher
Jonathan Hoffman said:
What does it means to be righteous without Paul's Christ.

My favorite quote from this article is


Please read:
How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?
Click to expand...

This guy's page is not without its issues: he's a Karliner-Stoller Hasid, and those guys are pretty deeply Haredi (ultra-Orthodox, fundamentalist). And I think there are some ways that I might want to approach how and why Judaism does not subscribe to or suppose a need for a concept of salvation as defined by Christianity, that this guy misses.

That said, he's mostly not wrong, and at least seems to get the basic concept of why the idea of salvation is so problematic for us.
 
rusra02

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Jonathan Hoffman said:
What does it means to be righteous without Paul's Christ.

My favorite quote from this article is


Please read:
How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?
Click to expand...

The Torah prophesied about Christ and made clear there can be no righteousness apart from him. "A prophet from your own midst, from your brothers, like me, is what Jehovah your God will raise up for you—to him you people should listen... A prophet I shall raise up for them from the midst of their brothers, like you; and I shall indeed put my words in his mouth, and he will certainly speak to them all that I shall command him. And it must occur that the man who will not listen to my words that he will speak in my name, I shall myself require an account from him." (Deuteronomy 18:15-19)
I believe a Jew or anyone else can attain salvation by accepting the true Messiah, Jesus Christ. As the Jewish man Peter said: "There is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved.” (Acts 4:12)
 
Terrywoodenpic

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
I find it hard to understand why a Jew from Jesus time would discuss Salvation at all.

I even find it just as hard to understand how it became a Christian concept.
There must be a logical link, to other early Christian beliefs, that defined the need for it.
 
Ken Brown

Ken Brown

Well-Known Member
Jonathan Hoffman said:
What does it means to be righteous without Paul's Christ.
My favorite quote from this article is
Please read:
How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?
Click to expand...

Hi Jonathan, I believe the only way to attain salvation is the same for both Jew and Goyim (Gentile), and that way is only achieved through righteousness. Only the righteous are saved. Another belief I have is that traditional Christians are in error to believe that righteousness can be substituted. The Scripture is very clear:

(Eze 14:14) even if these three men were in it — Noach, Dani'el and Iyov — they would by their righteousness save only themselves," says Adonai Elohim.
(Eze 14:20) even if Noach, Dani'el and Iyov were in it, as I live," says Adonai Elohim, "they would save neither a son nor a daughter; they would save only themselves by their righteousness."

So we are in agreement that only the righteous are saved, and the only way to be righteous is:

(Deu 6:25) It will be righteousness for us if we are careful to obey all these mitzvot before Adonai our Elohim, just as he ordered us to do.' "

Yes, the only way to be righteous is to OBEY. But didn't Moshe predict this about the people's obedience:

(Deu 9:6) Therefore, understand that it is not for your righteousness that Adonai your Elohim is giving you this good land to possess. "For you are a stiffnecked people!
(Deu 31:27) For I know how rebellious and stiffnecked you are! Here, even while I am still alive with you today, you have rebelled against Adonai; so how much more will you do so after my death?
((Deu 31:29) because I know that after my death you will become very corrupt and turn aside from the way that I have ordered you, and that disaster will come upon you in the acharit-hayamim, because you will do what Adonai sees as evil and provoke him by your deeds."

And even Adonai said this:

(Deu 31:16) Adonai said to Moshe, "You are about to sleep with your ancestors. But this people will get up and offer themselves as prostitutes to the foreign gods of the land where they are going. When they are with those gods, they will abandon me and break my covenant which I have made with them.
(Deu 31:17) Then my anger will flare up, and I will abandon them and hide my face from them. They will be devoured, and many calamities and troubles will come upon them. Then they will ask, 'Haven't these calamities come upon us because our Elohim isn't here with us?'
(Deu 31:18) But I will be hiding my face from them because of all the evil they will have done in turning to other gods.
(Deu 31:19) "Therefore, write this song for yourselves, and teach it to the people of Isra'el. Have them learn it by heart, so that this song can be a witness for me against the people of Isra'el.

You know, it looks like Adonai and Moshe didn't have much faith in the ability of the people to be righteous. I wonder how that can be turned around so that they can be saved? KB
 
L

Latuwr

Member
Hi Jonathan Hoffman,

Blessings to you through Messiah Yahushua, My YAHWEH and My ELOHIM!

I would like to reply to your linked article entitled:

How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?

The remarks of the article below are coded in blue. My comments right below appear in black:

How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?

Christianity maintains that all men are doomed to sin, and everyone will go to everlasting hell unless they accept jesus as their savior.

I have a friend who is friends with a Jewish linguist. This Jew, who btw is not a Christian, informed my friend that Genesis 3:1 actually states that the serpent (HaSatan) is more naked than any other beast of the field.

Judaism has always held that we do not need that sort of salvation, for we are not doomed or damned at birth. We are not doomed or fated to sin. Quite the contrary. The Torah says: "If you do good, won't there be special privilege? And if you do not do good, sin waits at the door. It lusts after you, but you can dominate it." (Genesis 4:7) In other words, you can do good, and if you do, things will be better for you. If you do not do good, sin wants to be partners with you. But you can control sin, you can control your evil desires, and you can be good.

If HaSatan is more naked, and if Adam and Eve were created naked, what does their nakedness declare about their original state? Nakedness, according to the teaching of the New Testament, indicates a person devoid of righteousness. Of course, Adam and Eve before their sin had no knowledge of their lack of righteousness. They had no knowledge of good and evil. After they sinned, they immediately became aware of their nakedness.

So we have free will, and that is what Judaism has always believed, because that is what the Torah teaches. The Torah does not teach -- or even mention -- that we are "born in sin," or that we are fated to sin. Just the opposite. We have the ability to choose.

The Torah does command each of us to choose life over death. In order to choose life and receive life, we must be clothed in righteousness, that is, the doing of the Torah.

All people just like Adam and Eve come into this world naked, and very few of all of those who have come into this world, very few learn how to clothe themselves in righteousness so that they may live and not die. The vast majority grow older and get sick and die proving that they did not make the proper choice with respect to righteousness. So, the vast majority actually leave this world naked just like they came into this world.

Which means that we can be good, or we can be evil. It's up to us. And if can be good, that means we can be righteous. I cannot understand how or why Christians like to say that no one can be righteous in the eyes of G-d. The Torah says otherwise.

Yes, all men can potentially be good or evil. We can be clothed, or we can remain naked, but no one really believes Moses, do they? I am curious, how did you yourself acquire a knowledge of good and evil, and are you yourself right now clothed with righteousness or have you chosen for yourself to remain naked?

Thanking any in advance that should be moved to reply, I am,

Sincerely, Latuwr
 
Isaiah Torres

Isaiah Torres

I know Truth
Jonathan Hoffman said:
What does it means to be righteous without Paul's Christ.

My favorite quote from this article is


Please read:
How Does a Jew Attain Salvation?
Click to expand...
you attain salvation by repenting and being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ according to acts 2:38 and receive the baptism of the Holy Ghost speaking in other toungues as the Spirit of God gives utterance according to Acts 2:4 & continue steadfastly in the Apostles doctrine according to acts 2:42 & that's how you obtain true salvation and that goes for jew, greek,latin, and any other race under the sun
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Isaiah Torres said:
you attain salvation by repenting and being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ according to acts 2:38 and receive the baptism of the Holy Ghost speaking in other toungues as the Spirit of God gives utterance according to Acts 2:4 & continue steadfastly in the Apostles doctrine according to acts 2:42 & that's how you obtain true salvation and that goes for jew, greek,latin, and any other race under the sun
Click to expand...
So, going through such a ritual will supposedly save one?
 
Isaiah Torres

Isaiah Torres

I know Truth
metis said:
So, going through such a ritual will supposedly save one?
Click to expand...
Its not such a ritual..you go down in water in Jesus name and get the Baptism of the Holy Ghost and just live Holy and continue do what you know is right..but the bible makes it plain that yea that "ritual" is how you get save mark 16:16 John 3:5 Acts 2:38
 
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