How Great is the Darkness?

[blackout]

Maybe "god" has not led ANYBODY to be a christian?
Perhaps people just take the path they are inclined to take
for whatever reason/s.

What is inherently evil about your darkness Mickiel?

I would really like to discuss this,
because of my own changed "view" and experience of "the Darkness".

Only if the conversation suits you of course.

 

[Buttons*]

I am being me, for once in my life I am being me. I am free from being a believer who concocks all kinds of spiritual fantasys about God, I can just be honest and say that I do not know him. I am being me, I am free from the weird adherance that many believers are giving to this horror hell hole.

I am being me, I can tell the truth and admit that God has not called me, has not placed me in a church, and has not led me to be a christian. He does not lead me at all.

I am being me, I can talk about the Darkness because I was born and shaped by it and in it. I know its inherently evil. Although I do not know God, I agree with his description of evil. I am being me, I know, and I know that I know a whole lot of sin lives in me.

And it always has. And it matters not to me what others think sin is or is not. Thats on them.

Peace.

What is it about this sin that makes you convinced that you are in perpetual Darkness?

Do you think maybe it's a trial of God instead of abandonment?

The Darkness can't govern your life unless your'e posessed by it.

I'm not sure what the Darkness makes you do, if anything at all, but why do you feel wrapped up in sin? Is it a hateful feeling? Is it a nothingness? Please describe the feelings you have when you think on the following words:

Sin
God
Heaven
Hell
Evil
Love
Hope
Understanding
Darkness
Light

 

[mickiel]

Maybe "god" has not led ANYBODY to be a christian?
Perhaps people just take the path they are inclined to take
for whatever reason/s.

What is inherently evil about your darkness Mickiel?

I would really like to discuss this,
because of my own changed "view" and experience of "the Darkness".

Only if the conversation suits you of course.

I have no problem discussing it, least manner, no problem discussing it with you, I like your Spirit. I don't know myself if God has led anyone to be a christian, I have my doubts. I think the Darkness controls christianity, not God, but thats my view of things. I think when God controls a group of believers in this age, they will be far different than the christians are. They will be like lights that cannot be hidden. These christians now a days, you can hide them anywhere and no one would notice them. They do not stand out.

My Darkness is evil, because it does not include God within it, it keeps me away from him. It cuts me off from him, theres nothing good about that. It keeps me weak and ruins my real goals. I want to be good and patient, self controlled and Kind. I want to be gentle and Joyful, happy and Longsuffering with my Life and others. I am none of these things because of the Darkness that is in me. But I know that if God were in me, I would have these things in my everyday ways and being.

I want to see the truth about why we are here, understand if God is real and what are his true plans for humanity. The Darkness in me distorts this knowledge, perverts it and keeps it from me. I am Loved by people, been Loved by many women, but I have never Loved them back. I want to Love them, I want to Love and Know what true Love is, I have had enough lust to suit me.

The Darkness keeps me from knowing Love and holds me in the bondage of Lust.

Peace.

 

[blackout]

I have no problem discussing it, least manner, no problem discussing it with you, I like your Spirit. I don't know myself if God has led anyone to be a christian, I have my doubts. I think the Darkness controls christianity, not God, but thats my view of things. I think when God controls a group of believers in this age, they will be far different than the christians are. They will be like lights that cannot be hidden. These christians now a days, you can hide them anywhere and no one would notice them. They do not stand out.

My Darkness is evil, because it does not include God within it, it keeps me away from him. It cuts me off from him, theres nothing good about that. It keeps me weak and ruins my real goals. I want to be good and patient, self controlled and Kind. I want to be gentle and Joyful, happy and Longsuffering with my Life and others. I am none of these things because of the Darkness that is in me. But I know that if God were in me, I would have these things in my everyday ways and being.

I want to see the truth about why we are here, understand if God is real and what are his true plans for humanity. The Darkness in me distorts this knowledge, perverts it and keeps it from me. I am Loved by people, been Loved by many women, but I have never Loved them back. I want to Love them, I want to Love and Know what true Love is, I have had enough lust to suit me.

The Darkness keeps me from knowing Love and holds me in the bondage of Lust.

Peace.

I really would like to continue this conversation with you...
but cannot do so for about another 45 minutes.

Hope you're around when I come back.

 

[mickiel]

I really would like to continue this conversation with you...
but cannot do so for about another 45 minutes.

Hope you're around when I come back.

We can continue tommorrow, I have to go to another website, and then its the bed for me.

Peace.

 

[blackout]

Maybe you just have some "Darkness" habits and mind-sets you could begin tweaking?
because I tell you... there is nothing "intrinsically" evil about the Darkness.

Have fun with your "demons". Have fun with yourSelf.

Send them on new errands they've never been on.
Confuse them.
Make yourSelf laugh.
My thing is always double meanings and the like,
word play.... making things mean "Other" things...
and thus they become.

But everyone has their own style.
Your demons are nothing but Self contrived sparring partners.
Find your style and spar then!

And don't worry about "patience" and all that.
Living in the present moment is always best.
And that takes no patience whatsoever.

How can you say your Darkness is evil because it does not contain god?
Can gOd be contained?
Is there ANYWHERE that gOd is not?
Is there anything that IS NOT gOd.
What exists outside of gOd?
And how would it do so?

I really think you need to wipe your "god concept" slate clean.
Start over. And search yourSelf. Go Within (instead of "without")
You are mixing all kinds of (mainstream) christian assumptions about god
into almost every statement you make/question you ask about god.
Do you realize that?
Christianity is still IN-FORMING your god concept.
(and yet you state that this "Darkness" is "controling" christianity)

You speak quite a bit of god "controling" and the"Darkness" controling?
Why is that?

And LongSuffering! ACK! Who wants to be LongSuffering anyway!?!
(that was a NIGHTMARE)

Here's a little secret Mickiel...
gOd IS the Darkness also.

This is my experience.

 

[blackout]

I want to see the truth about why we are here, understand if God is real and what are his true plans for humanity. The Darkness in me distorts this knowledge, perverts it and keeps it from me.

Maybe every answer you need, is there IN your Darkness.

Maybe. Have you tried searching your Darkness, instead of judging it?

just sayin.

 

[slave2six]

I think Black is beautiful, but the Darkness, I don't see that as beautiful. Peace.

Ever looked up at the sky at night? Trust me. It's beautiful. And when you consider that 90+% of the universe is unaccounted for and currently referred to as "dark matter" one gets a real sense that there is more wonder about the darkness than we yet comprehend. Indeed, I think there will come a time when "darkness" will come to mean something as powerful, if not more so, as the word "light." It's all perspective.

 

[slave2six]

The bible says that God will give his Spirit to those who ask, I have asked a thousand times, and have gotten nothing. So thats my answer, no Spirit of God for me, only the Darkness. And the Darkness is Greater than I first understood.

Peace.

First, why are you hung up on the Bible? Second, if you stood in a dark warehouse and stumbled around calling out for someone to turn on the lights and no one responded, what would you conclude? Either someone is there and tormenting you or no one is there.

If you have "asked a thousand times" and gotten not response, isn't the logical conclusion that either God is there and tormenting you or there isn't anyone there? The later is far more comfortable and to my mind the more likely.

BTW - I went through more than 30 years of that and I feel your pain. You just have to use your brain on this one.

 

[slave2six]

Even Jesus himself in John 12:31, 14:30 and 16:11...

Look, stop reading the Bible and stop going to church and stop listening to radio and TV preachers for six months. During that time, seriously consider what other people who do not promote Christianity have written about it. Here are two important quotes from Gandhi's biography (which was one of the first books I read on my journey to examin Christianity as a whole):

1. "I do not seek redemption from the consequences of my sin. I seek to be redeemed from the sin itself, or rather from the very thought of sin. Until I have attained that end, I shall be content to be restless."
2. "To allow a man to believe a thing that one has not fully verified is to compromise truth."
3. "You can wake a man only if he is really asleep; no effort that you make will produce any effect upon him if he is merely pretending to sleep."

These are not mere trite sayings but ideas worthy of consideration. You cannot find the truth unless you search for it in all places. If you assume that you have found the truth only by searching in one place, you have failed yourself.

 

[slave2six]

My heart's desire is to be free of it, the truth is I am not.

This is because you do not trust your head. Use that and you will find what you seek.

 

[slave2six]

I dont understand how satan can use the Word to keep me in darkness, altho there is some darkness in my life. I am a NT christian, God said His Word was truth and that it would indure to the end,Jesus was the Word, I dont think the darkness can change or alter the Word, I dont know if satan can change your perception of the Word. I know its a battle I have been in for 30 years, that is to remove the darkness.

It's strange to me how people have all the evidence in front of them and yet fail to reach for the most obvious answer to the problem.

 

[slave2six]

You don't understand how something can keep you in a 30 year battle to remove it? Thats just how Powerful the Darkness is, its a lifelong influence.

Because you obsess about how you feel rather than reason about reality. This is why so many professional psychologists and psychiatrists are so screwed up. They became professionals because they are so self-absorbed that they have made a career of trying to find out what is wrong with them.

I'll tell you again that the fastest way out of the darkenss is to comitt an act of generosity for someone who cannot repay you. Do it again and the darkness reduces more. Pretty soon you will have very little darkness to deal with. This is the voice of experience here. But it's entirely up to you.

 

[slave2six]

What is the "alot of sin" in you?

I mean... are you SURE that what you are calling "sin" is really anything "bad" at all?

Are you going around murdering little girls?

Some religions peg so much stuff as sin, it's ridiculous.
The Darkness BTW is a place of rest.
Also creation and uncreation.
The Darkness is a wonderful place,
and there is NOTHING evil about it.

Unless you are infringing on others freedom to BE...
just BE YOU. and stop worring about it. ya know?

Exactly!

 

[slave2six]

What Catholics think means little to me, but your right, I gave up on trying to be something I am not. I am not a born again, spirit filled believer, I am a fleshly sinful believer, and I have not progressed beyond that.

Peace.

Just dump the "believer" bit and you'll be well on your way to being healthy again. This is how I deal with the whole God issue. I cannot believe that God is anything other than Good by the very highest definition of the word. Whatever does not meet that criterion is not God. Period.

Do you really believe that God makes human beings as we are and then condemns them for being the way that he made them? Human beings have human desires and tendencies. Any God who cannot overlook all of that without laying major guilt on people or playing favorites is not "good." Period.

 

[slave2six]

I am being me, I can talk about the Darkness because I was born and shaped by it and in it. I know its inherently evil. Although I do not know God, I agree with his description of evil.

Wrong. You believe what someone else has told you about "darkness".

Dude, I know what you're talking about. I do. I went down this road as well and was nearly insane over the unfairness of it all. It was not until I defined God as "Good" and dared to ask "OK, does this passage meet the standard?" that I came to realize that the Bible is not, in any way shape or form, "God's word" or even inspired by God because not one thing about it, not one, meets the definition.

Read this. It's long but you may find it helpful.

 

[slave2six]

My Darkness is evil, because it does not include God within it, it keeps me away from him. It cuts me off from him, theres nothing good about that. It keeps me weak and ruins my real goals. I want to be good and patient, self controlled and Kind. I want to be gentle and Joyful, happy and Longsuffering with my Life and others. I am none of these things because of the Darkness that is in me. But I know that if God were in me, I would have these things in my everyday ways and being.

Let me tell you about one of my best friends. He's a Christian but not like anyone you have ever met before. He is the most direct, unpolished, impatient people I know. He cusses just fine and makes no bones about where he stands on issues. He's a Marine officer who doesn't screw around. He is the the most truly human being I know. There is nothing pretentious about him at all and while I cannot see him kicking it with a Mother Teresa type person, he is faithful with his money and his time to give to the church and the needy.

There is no one I respect more. He knows what he believes and cannot be swayed - mostly because he's stubborn that way. But he is not the kind of person that anyone would look at and say , "Ah! A Christian." Not by a long shot. In fact, most people don't know what to make of him.

The reason I respect him is because he knows his flaws and doesn't beat himself up over them. Some of his unconventional behavior is conditioning (his father is way worse) and part is genetics/personality. He has no control over either. But he doesn't pine away that he's not something that God didn't make him to be either.

If you're a Christian, you have to believe in forgiveness and grace. If God made you, he didn't make you to be Pope John Paul II or Saint Francis of Asissi. He made you to be you. Once you accept that you are the way you are and that God is perfectly fine with that, seeing as how he made you that way and all, the better off you'll be.

 

[mickiel]

When Jesus was captured and arrested he said an interesting thing in Luke 22:53;" While I was with you daily in the Temple, you didnot lay hands on me; but this hour the Power of the Darkness are yours." When I believe in things, what Jesus has said molds my opinions, what people say about it is meaningless to me. I know this subject will attract people who are attracted to the Darkness, even Love the Darkness, but Jesus called the Darkness Great and Powerful, that is what shapes my mind on the subject, not what people think about the subject.

People can rant on and on as they wish, but I pay attention to Christ words, although I do not know the Man, the Son of the Living God. I just think he knows the subject far better than humans. I think humans are just messed up in the head, thats why my head is messed up. So I do not allow another messed up head, to further mess mine up.

That being said, I want to go into " The Power of Darkness."

Peace.

 

[jtartar]

One thing about my life I have regretably come to accept, is that I live my life in the Darkness. I had to leave the Church many years ago because I began to understand that I was different than them, I had a lot of sin in me, and it was in me to stay. I was born with sin, and it ruled much of my life. It was also just as easy for me to believe in God, since my memory began, as far back as I can recall. I just always believed in God, that has never been an issue with me, its been easy. But there was something in me that was drawn to sin. The way it made me " Feel", the pull it had has always been more powerful than I. Its just that when I was young, I didnot know what this " Darkness was." This " Thing inside of me", this influence that kept hurting me, rotting my sucesses and knocking me down. I didnot understand that this " Force" was indeed Great!

In Matthews 6:23, Jesus himself gives an astounding teaching;"But if your eye is bad, your whole body is full of Darkness. If therefore the Light in you is Darkness, how Great is the Darkness!" If what is really leading you, is this Great Darkness, then the Darkness is your Master. Its what has you. And it has had me all of my life. It has never taken away my belief in God, but it has continually asserted its dominance over me. I understand what the Great King David meant when he asked God not to let his sin have dominion over him.

But I wanted to give an inside view of this Great Darkness, because I live in it each day.

Peace.

mickiel,
Your lamentation is just like all fallen men, we all are imperfect and are drawn to sin. In fact you words remind me of exactly what Paul said about his own life, at Rom 7:7-25. Paul did not give up, he knew that by prayer and sincerely trying to do better, God would give him the strength to overcome his inclinations. We are in the same condition today, even more so, because we have so many immoral things to contend with.
All men who do not understand God's Holy Scriptures are in darkness. Jesus was and is the Light of the world. If we search the scriptures to find what Jesus did and told his disciples to do, we can be saved by his great Ransom Sacrifice. We can never keep from sinning, because sin is the falling short of what God would do. By trusting in the Ransom sacrifice of Jesus we can have our sins forgiven and NOT be charged against us, Heb 10:11-18.
One WARNING: If a person knows that he is living in sin and does not try to change his course, there is no longer any sacrifice for him, Heb 10:26,27. Jesus' sacrifice will not continue to cover that person.
The end of this system will come upon ALL those on the surface of ALL the earth!! We all have a short time to reconcile ourselves to God, by obeying His commands, as good as we are able.

 

[mickiel]

mickiel,One WARNING: If a person knows that he is living in sin and does not try to change his course, there is no longer any sacrifice for him, Heb 10:26,27. Jesus' sacrifice will not continue to cover that person.
The end of this system will come upon ALL those on the surface of ALL the earth!! We all have a short time to reconcile ourselves to God, by obeying His commands, as good as we are able.

I grow tired of these warnings, just as I grow tired of the Darkness. I have tried to change my course, using my own human strength, my own knowledge, my own will. All this has been innsufficent to release me from the Darkness, its Power is just to strong. If Jesus sacrifice is a matter of " Only the Strong will survive", then I am doomed. But I do not view Jesus sacrifice, or Gods plan of Salvation as a matter of only the strong " Will make it". Thats why I ignore such religious babbling. If the weak willnot be allowed to Live with God, then I will take my place amoung the doomed. If God is only accepting applications from humans who have the Power to change themselves, and personally defeat the Darkness, then he can write my name in the doomsday book. If thats how God is, I have no desire to meet him anyway.

I need Grace and Mercy. I need forgiveness and help, I do not need judgement, I get enough of that from this Darkness that envolpes me.

Peace.