How has God shown you He loves you?

[Araceli Cianna]

I think the problem is not so much about the Abrahamic God's love, but more about the propaganda that surrounds those whole religions in general. Abrahamic religions leave a bad taste in many people's mouths, including my own. I have had to struggle with the Abrahamic God (in the form of Jesus) wanting to love me but me being too angry, upset, and frightened to accept due to all my bad past experiences with people who claimed to be acting on the behalf of said God. So with my negative associations I feel that said God is angry (he is not, humanity is angry), I feel that he is whimsical (he is not, people are), I feel that he is religious and only cares about obedience (he is not, but humans are power hungry), I feel that he gets a thrill from seeing people hurt and tortured (again, another attribute projected thanks to human scaremongering). But when I really make time, to sit down and connect with him in my mind and heart, I get a completely different picture. All I feel is love, healing, acceptance, and nurturing. It is a completely different experience. So I have had to make a conscious effort to disconnect him from what I have been made to believe about him, and that's been a very hard path for me. I am still working on it as well.

So my advice is if you want people to know how much that God loves them, you need to first strip the lies that humanity has told them about said God.

 

[syo]

So I'd like to be able to show the sick suffering poor tortured souls that God loves them. The first obstacle is the fact that God refuses to speak up to them. God hides himself. Would a God who loves people hide himself from them and refuse to speak up and leave people tortured and confused?

god sent jesus. but noone cares about the teachings of jesus.

 

[Spiderman]

god sent jesus. but noone cares about the teachings of jesus.

I do but I'd like to see him faithful to his word. He said those who believe in him will do his works and greater works. He said ask anything of the father in his name and it will be done. If Jesus would be faithful to his word, more people would listen to him.

 

[Truthseeker]

I would say

So I'd like to be able to show the sick suffering poor tortured souls that God loves them. The first obstacle is the fact that God refuses to speak up to them. God hides himself. Would a God who loves people hide himself from them and refuse to speak up and leave people tortured and confused?

The world is tortured, sick, and confused. It would be nice if there was some evidence to leave people that they can turn to God and God will protect, provide, and be faithful to his word. I pray to God unceasingly for guidance and am left sick and confused. Reading the Bible just causes more confusion and anger and makes me want to puke!

How hard is it for God to simply demonstrate that his word is true and that he cares about people and will enlighten them, guide them, heal their wounds? Why is it that one person seeks the truth and winds up Catholic, another person seeks the truth and winds up a Jehovah's witness, another person seeks the truth and winds up Eastern Orthodox, or some other denomination? People are reading the same book and praying to the same God, while winding up with opposite beliefs.

I can't tell you how many people have read the Bible and come to believe the Catholic church is the whore of Babylon... others read the same book and give a Biblical defense of why the Catholic church is the church that Christ founded.

At this time, how does a person know who to listen to? I go to God , and he seems to tell me that the Holy Spirit guides the church councils and established the church as the authority to settle disputes about faith and morals. Yet so many Bible Christians tell me the church is evil, Pagan, and the religion of Satan and the Antichrist.

In the end, I'm just going to have to follow my conscience, because God isn't giving clear answers.

All this time I could be following the whore of Babylon, the religion of Satan.

Which would mean the very Bible these people cherish, they got from the whore of Babylon, because for quite a few centuries there were no Protestant churches.

If God let the world be deceived by this satanic whore, how am I supposed to place my trust in such a God? He failed to guide the church, and the Bible contradicts itself.

Who does a person listen to?

My heart tells me to listen to the church , because Christ said Upon This Rock I build my church and the gates of Hell shall not Prevail against it.

There is an unbreakable chain of popes that dates back to the first century. Protestantism began in the 16th century. How am I supposed to believe the Protestant faith is the true faith when God waited so many centuries to establish a Protestant church?

If God wants me to be a Protestant, then which of the thousands of denominations doesn't preach error?

How am I supposed to tell anybody that God loves them, when God does such a pitiful job of shepherding his flock? Turn to God for answers and get silence. How has this God shown himself to be trustworthy?

How has God shown you he loves you?

If you were going to tell a chronically sick tortured soul that God loves them, what would you provide them as evidence for this claim? All the evidence suggests otherwise.

I would say look inside of yourself and let God commune with you. God is not a voice, it is spirit. I know God loves me because He lets me commune with Him. Pick out a prayer and say it, and if it gets you closer to God, close your eyes and let the spirit flow.

I know it is hard to find the truth, but you won't find truth if you let other men define it for you. Even then, it is hard. You should not consider the Bible as the only possible truth, you should look for it everywhere.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I do but I'd like to see him faithful to his word. He said those who believe in him will do his works and greater works. He said ask anything of the father in his name and it will be done. If Jesus would be faithful to his word, more people would listen to him.

I have found God 'is' faithful to His words as found at 2 Timothy 3:1-5; 2 Timothy 3:13.
No where in Matthew chapter 24 or Luke chapter 21 does Jesus say such troubles are from his God.
King Solomon, who was known for his wisdom, wrote at Ecclesiastes 8:9 that MAN has dominated MAN to MAN's injury, or MAN's hurt. Just as written we are in the last days of badness on Earth before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, will usher in global Peace on Earth among person's of goodwill.

Those ' greater works ' that Jesus mentioned was in connection to Luke 4:43-44.
Jesus' spiritual works were for the first century Israelites.
His followers would do ' greater 'spiritual' works ' because they would go beyond the borders of Israel to the point of being able to cover the globe with the good news of the Kingdom of God of Daniel 2:44.
That is why Jesus gave his followers the instructions found at Matthew 24:14 and Acts of the Apostles 1:8.
The 'ask his Father, in Jesus' name', was in connection to getting that 'spiritual preaching work' done internationally.
No, more people would Not listen, but would be hated as per Matthew 10:22; John 15:17-20,25.
Notice what Jesus says about the MANY as found at Matthew 7:21-23.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

god sent jesus. but no one cares about the teachings of jesus.

Those doing the 'spiritual work' of Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:18-20 do care.

 

[Kenny]

In that He gave His only begotten son so that whosever believeth in Him, should not perish but have evelasting life.

I love HIm because He first loved me.

If that is all He had done, it would be enough to serve Him with all our hearts... but He has done so much more.

 

[Electra]

The kindness of strangers and lovers

I got a mcflurry yesterday and they filled the container to the top, while normally it's like halfway

haahahahahhahaah

stuff like that gets me going

 

[Quiddity]

The most common misunderstanding of course is to confuse it with some type of feeling. The scriptures don't use many words to say that God is something.....as if He was composed of it like parts in a machine......It speaks of Love like it is His very essence. I've always seen it as an innate faculty that's just part of who God is. Love can not be a feeling, or just an act of kindness, or even something abstract or directed at an object. There must be the potential of reciprocality and that can only occur among people, or more precise from person to person. So yes, it's self-sacrifice, it's an act, it has goodness as it's intent, but there must be potential for reciprocality. Otherwise you are left with creating objects that can't respond back in any way similar to a person.

You have to answer the question of what is love first before you take the next step.

 

[Araceli Cianna]

I do but I'd like to see him faithful to his word. He said those who believe in him will do his works and greater works. He said ask anything of the father in his name and it will be done. If Jesus would be faithful to his word, more people would listen to him.

This is what I thought for a long time too, but you have to remember the bible was edited by people with an agenda. I don't think half of the bible is the original text. So again people have blurred Jesus' true character... In my opinion. Because with this struggle I have been mad at him for not doing what the bible says he would do... I get the sense he's saying forget about all that and just focus on my love.

 

[idea]

I have really enjoyed this thread. So much of life is a mystery, highs and lows define one another, the ups and downs is a roller coaster ride but would you have it any other way? The pain and suffering in the world - I can only hope that people are stronger than we think, and that whatever the next existence brings, our experiences here will - in the eternal scheme of things - make us stronger. Choose to be an optimist, or a pessimist - choose to walk with hope/love/joy or with fear/anger/sorrow.... Follow what brings light and hope. Love others, and you will feel loved. Have hope for others, and you will have hope for yourself. Find joy in the journey, forgive and let live - I think this is the secret of life.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

To write about how God has shown me love would require more time than I would be allowed to write in this thread. By God, I'm referring to the universal being that binds this whole universe together, that makes the minute great, and the great small. As a human being I'm so insignificant that if I stopped posting today none of you would even bat an eye. to many people across the world nobody knows of my existence except those that have encountered me. I'm sure if I died today nobody would care, but despite all that I feel important, that I am but one piece of a grand mosaic. I've should have died so many times in the past including the time where I found out I was allergic to the painkiller demoral.

I almost went into cardiac arrest at 13 years old. My mother was at my bedside and it pained her that the potential of me passing away from an allergic reaction was devastating (today I wish I had rather than experiencing my mother's passing but that is another story). Sometimes I don't know why but I feel like I have a positive purpose in this world. I don't know what it is but I do feel that way. To someone else it could be delusion or me trying to convince myself but I don't know, I see God as this ocean and the more I try to swim upstream the more difficult it is. It almost feels like I have to allow the currents to take me to my destination.

I thank God for giving me compassion for others and although I do get compassion fatigue, I definitely thank God for giving me the foresight to see the best or potentially the best in human beings. I definitely thank God for my sight, hearing, taste, my mind, the ability to touch and sense, the ability to walk and sit. The ability to experience pleasure and pain. The ability to weep and feel sorrow for others. I cannot attribute love for God because it does no justice to apply something a finite being can apply to something beyond comprehension.

But if God does love me I've only been shown but a glimpse in this life and by just that glimpse alone has drawn me more closer to the Creator.

 

[Windwalker]

I see God as this ocean and the more I try to swim upstream the more difficult it is. It almost feels like I have to allow the currents to take me to my destination.

This is exactly the case, and why it is that we struggle. We don't know, or we fear, just letting go and let the currents guide us.

I want to share a practice I have been doing that you may find helpful. I've been learning Tai Chi and one of its basic principles is that everything in the body must be relaxed, starting for the head down through the feet out into the earth below. You learn to move without using strength. The face muscles relax, the neck, the shoulders, the ribs, the spine, the hips, the thighs, the knees, the calves, the ankles, the feet.

I go swimming every day at the Y, and they have a vortex pool there which has strong currents in a pool which is oval shape with a center island around which the water swirls. It's around 30 feet long. As part of practicing this complete relaxation of the body, I end up floating around within these currents, face down, rolling onto the back, arms completely let go. I'm sure I look like a dead body just being pushed around like some debris floating by in the river, but the life guards can tell the difference between that and someone actually drowning, which would include lots of flailing around.

The sensation of this is utterly informative to the body, and the mind. A sudden strong jet of water just pushes me as I float past its force. And you can recognize which parts of you are not relaxed, and then you let yourself relax further, and deeper. Then after about 10 minutes of this complete relaxation, you feel completely connected and grounded to all parts of your body, and your movements become flowing and effortless. You can reach and stretch like this beautiful elastic muscle as your body glides and slides though the water when you then swim laps. You become like the body of an otter, or some water mammal.

The effect this has on your mind and your spirit as well follows and flows from this, and it literally begins to inform all other parts of your life. To live without forcing, grasping, clutching, pulling, trying to control nature and your life. You become responsive, rather than reactive. There is key difference there.

And so it is with God. If I had to give a single word to all of this, it is trust. By learning how to relax the body and to feel this connection to the world through this letting go, you are as I like to put it, 'falling backwards in the Ocean'. That complete relaxation includes relaxing the mind, the emotions, the spirit, letting go off clutching, and just being right there in that moment, feeling the currents moving you.

It's not that you have to learn Tai Chi, or go to a pool everyday, but just laying on the floor, feeling every muscle and letting it relax becomes a practice of awareness of where and how we store and hold everything within us from all our flailing around in the currents of life we fear will drown us if we let go. It then moves into meditation, and deeper and deeper relaxation to the point you literally melt into God.

 

[Trailblazer]

Thanks for your honesty and sincerity... We need more people like you in the world.

So I'd like to be able to show the sick suffering poor tortured souls that God loves them. The first obstacle is the fact that God refuses to speak up to them. God hides himself. Would a God who loves people hide himself from them and refuse to speak up and leave people tortured and confused?

Apparently so.

The world is tortured, sick, and confused. It would be nice if there was some evidence to leave people that they can turn to God and God will protect, provide, and be faithful to his word. I pray to God unceasingly for guidance and am left sick and confused. Reading the Bible just causes more confusion and anger and makes me want to puke!

I feel your pain. The Bible is the last place I would look.

How hard is it for God to simply demonstrate that his word is true and that he cares about people and will enlighten them, guide them, heal their wounds?

Apparently too hard.

At this time, how does a person know who to listen to? I go to God, and he seems to......
In the end, I'm just going to have to follow my conscience, because God isn't giving clear answers.

Me too. I think you can trust your conscience because you are so sincere... God knows that.

Who does a person listen to? My heart tells me to listen to the church , because Christ said Upon This Rock I build my church and the gates of Hell shall not Prevail against it.

Sure, but look at what the Christians have done to the Church since Peter....
The church became the church of Paul, not Peter, since there was no written covenant.

How am I supposed to tell anybody that God loves them, when God does such a pitiful job of shepherding his flock? Turn to God for answers and get silence. How has this God shown himself to be trustworthy?

Can't say that I know the answer to that.

How has God shown you he loves you?

I cannot say that I know even if He has. To say anything else would be less than honest.

If you were going to tell a chronically sick tortured soul that God loves them, what would you provide them as evidence for this claim? All the evidence suggests otherwise.

That’s true, but they are just supposed to believe it anyway, because it is IN the scriptures.

God will probably get me for this... He loves doing that and it has been a while since He has done anything major so I am just about as overdue for God's wrath as I am for God's love....

Sorry I cannot be much help, but believe me, I feel your pain.

 

[Trailblazer]

god sent jesus. but noone cares about the teachings of jesus.

And that is one of the biggest problems, too many people just care about themselves and getting saved, and not about what Jesus said about how to live life.

But that is certainly not true of everyone, as there are many good people in the world who care about others more than themselves.

 

[Trailblazer]

I would say look inside of yourself and let God commune with you. God is not a voice, it is spirit. I know God loves me because He lets me commune with Him. Pick out a prayer and say it, and if it gets you closer to God, close your eyes and let the spirit flow.

How do you know that? Why doesn't that happen to everyone? Why is it their fault if it doesn't happen to them?

Love me first and then I will love you seems unfair. How can someone love something they cannot see or hear from? Not everyone sees this God Duane, they just don't. Why doesn't God care enough to reach out to these people?

So many questions, so few answers... To blame people because they are not "doing it" the right way is not the answer. For some reason God has favored certain people and not others... I guess all we can do is wait to find out how it shakes out in the afterlife.

I really do not care about being close to God anyway, because I know the Truth about God and that is the greatest gift God could ever give me. I have eternity to get close to God. Somewhere in the Writings it says that some fruit only ripens after it falls from the tree.

 

[Truthseeker]

How do you know that? Why doesn't that happen to everyone? Why is it their fault if it doesn't happen to them?

It isn't always their fault. Some people more naturally feel close to God than others because of how their brain was built by their genes. It can be their fault because they have sinned, and the sin brings them down to a lower spiritual level from which they cannot commune with God. All are sinners but some sin more than others. One can be close to God, though, and not feel it. I learned this from reading a book called The God gene where if people had this gene they felt more close to God and could commune with God. It's complicated, though, whether a person can commune to God. It may be they are on a lower spiritual level. Also some people feel tortured because of things that happened to them that weren't their fault. This can interfere with communing with God. God will make up for that in the next world.

Love me first and then I will love you seems unfair. How can someone love something they cannot see or hear from? Not everyone sees this God Duane, they just don't. Why doesn't God care enough to reach out to these people?

If you love justice, then you love God. In general if you love the attributes of God then you love God. That's why sometimes atheists have a spiritual experience. They love God, but they don't know it. God did reach out to those atheists though they didn't explicitly love God. You don't explicitly love God, but love the attributes and God will find you.

I really do not care about being close to God anyway, because I know the Truth about God and that is the greatest gift God could ever give me. I have eternity to get close to God. Somewhere in the Writings it says that some fruit only ripens after it falls from the tree.

You should care about being close to God because that is what all religion in the end leads up to. The first commandment was to love God. You may have eternity to get close to God, but you will be at a higher level of spirituality in the next world tp begin with if you get closer to God now. Nothing also is as good as being close to God anyway. Believe me, I know. There is no happiness like a spiritual experience.

 

[Trailblazer]

@Truthseeker9

It isn't always their fault. Some people more naturally feel close to God than others because of how their brain was built by their genes.

You believe in a God gene? Is there any scientific evidence for that?

One can be close to God, though, and not feel it. I learned this from reading a book called The God gene where if people had this gene they felt more close to God and could commune with God.

How could they be close to God and not feel close to God? How would they know they are close if they do not feel close? What does close even mean? How could anyone ever know if they are close to God? It could just be their imagination.

It's complicated, though, whether a person can commune to God. It may be they are on a lower spiritual level. Also some people feel tortured because of things that happened to them that weren't their fault. This can interfere with communing with God. God will make up for that in the next world.

I do not understand what you mean by communing with God? Baha’u’llah wrote that there can be no direct intercourse between humans and God:

“Immeasurably exalted is He above the strivings of human mind to grasp His Essence, or of human tongue to describe His mystery. No tie of direct intercourse can ever bind Him to the things He hath created, nor can the most abstruse and most remote allusions of His creatures do justice to His being. Through His world-pervading Will He hath brought into being all created things. He is and hath ever been veiled in the ancient eternity of His own exalted and indivisible Essence, and will everlastingly continue to remain concealed in His inaccessible majesty and glory. All that is in heaven and all that is in the earth have come to exist at His bidding, and by His Will all have stepped out of utter nothingness into the realm of being. How can, therefore, the creature which the Word of God hath fashioned comprehend the nature of Him Who is the Ancient of Days?” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 317-318

If you love justice, then you love God. In general if you love the attributes of God then you love God.

I do not understand why you say that Duane? I see no justice in this world. Regarding the attributes of God, how can we really know God has those attributes? Those are just what scriptures say about God.

That's why sometimes atheists have a spiritual experience. They love God, but they don't know it. God did reach out to those atheists though they didn't explicitly love God. You don't explicitly love God, but love the attributes and God will find you.

Atheists love God? What are these attributes?

You should care about being close to God because that is what all religion in the end leads up to.

No, that is not what religion is about, not according to Baha’u’llah. That is what some people want for themselves, to be close to God, but religion is about so much more:

“And now concerning thy question regarding the nature of religion. Know thou that they who are truly wise have likened the world unto the human temple. As the body of man needeth a garment to clothe it, so the body of mankind must needs be adorned with the mantle of justice and wisdom. Its robe is the Revelation vouchsafed unto it by God. Whenever this robe hath fulfilled its purpose, the Almighty will assuredly renew it. For every age requireth a fresh measure of the light of God. Every Divine Revelation hath been sent down in a manner that befitted the circumstances of the age in which it hath appeared.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 81

Do religious people even bother to look around at society and what is going on in the world? Or do they just sit and meditate and try to get close to God?

I consider it rather selfish to just consider myself and being close to God, which is why I do not care if I am close to God. If God wants me to be close to Him, He can come and get me. Otherwise, I am not going to come running after an elusive God who remains in hiding for all but a few who claim to hear from Him. However, I believe what Baha’u’llah wrote and He wrote that there can be no direct intercourse between God and His creatures, so if people claim that they had intercourse with God I have to say that is their imagination. Either that or I discount what Baha’u’llah wrote. But if Baha’u’llah is infallible why would I believe in fallible humans? That makes no logical sense at all.

The first commandment was to love God.

Where did that commandment come from, the Bible? Sorry, but the Bible has now been superseded by the Writings of Baha’u’llah. The first counsel is now to love others.

1: O SON OF SPIRIT! My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

The second counsel is this:

2: O SON OF SPIRIT! The best beloved of all things in My sight is Justice; turn not away therefrom if thou desirest Me, and neglect it not that I may confide in thee. By its aid thou shalt see with thine own eyes and not through the eyes of others, and shalt know of thine own knowledge and not through the knowledge of thy neighbor. Ponder this in thy heart; how it behooveth thee to be. Verily justice is My gift to thee and the sign of My loving-kindness. Set it then before thine eyes.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

You may have eternity to get close to God, but you will be at a higher level of spirituality in the next world to begin with if you get closer to God now. Nothing also is as good as being close to God anyway. Believe me, I know. There is no happiness like a spiritual experience.

What you are not understanding Duane is that I do not care about myself and where *I* will be in the next world. I equate personal spiritual experiences with personal happiness and I have no interest in personal happiness since Baha’u’llah wrote that we are to surrender self for the Cause of God.

“By self-surrender and perpetual union with God is meant that men should merge their will wholly in the Will of God, and regard their desires as utter nothingness beside His Purpose….. The station of absolute self-surrender transcendeth, and will ever remain exalted above, every other station.” Gleanings From the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 337

“O ye beloved of God! Repose not yourselves on your couches, nay bestir yourselves as soon as ye recognize your Lord, the Creator, and hear of the things which have befallen Him, and hasten to His assistance. Unloose your tongues, and proclaim unceasingly His Cause. This shall be better for you than all the treasures of the past and of the future, if ye be of them that comprehend this truth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 330

The way I look at it, I either believe what Baha’u’llah wrote or I just pack up my bags and go home. I can only do what Baha’u’llah enjoined me to do. Other than that, I cannot ever know what God wants me to do. God does not speak to ordinary people, even if they imagine that He does.

 

[Windwalker]

God does not speak to ordinary people, even if they imagine that He does.

If he doesn't, then why do you feel you hear God in the teachings of Baha'u'llah? Aren't you considering yourself "ordinary", yet you believe God is speaking to you through this means?

 

[Trailblazer]

Trailblazer said: God does not speak to ordinary people, even if they imagine that He does.

Windwalker said: If he doesn't, then why do you feel you hear God in the teachings of Baha'u'llah? Aren't you considering yourself "ordinary", yet you believe God is speaking to you through this means?

I originally had it written this way: “God does not speak directly to ordinary people, even if they imagine that He does” but I deleted the word directly.

God does speak to people through the Messengers He sends... that is why He sends them.