muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
I never said that we don't evolve over time.
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How Much Do You Doubt God's Existence?
- Thread starter Nakosis
- Start date
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Of course it is. The fact that we evolve says nothing about how we originated.
It is only a hypothesis that we all originate from LUCA.
Then why question the theory?
Muffled
Jesus in me
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe that is like Platos people in a cave.
And I believe that this is gaslighting.
Of course you were able to get out of the cave, right?
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe I didn't know I was in a cave until I saw the light of day which I believed because other people believed in it.And I believe that this is gaslighting.
Of course you were able to get out of the cave, right?
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe it would be like saying that life on earth came from meteorites. After all we have the remains of meteorites as evidence so that makes the theory true, right?
Of course that's how you'd place yourself in the narrative.
Your use of the allegory of the cave tells me that you aren't interested in an honest discussion.
1/ No god is required to form galaxies
2/ No god is required to form planets
I could go on but 2 will do.
You are welcome to your belief, i believe gods are a figment of the imagination. Perhaps you consider i am welcome to my belief... Or perhaps not.
Since amino acids have been found on meteors and asteroids it is plausible they came from elsewhere in space.
What can't be found is any God.
It is part of the facts that the building blocks of life can explain how life emerged and evolved.
What isn't in any collection of facts is any creation by a supernatural.
Bear Wild
Well-Known Member
There is no book that can hold the wisdom of the Well of Segais nor the Yggdrasil with its spring at its base.
Bear Wild
Well-Known Member
Jus to make sure I understand the reply does not include the words from Jesus saying he died everyone.
I was discouss your idea, God can anything, even had shape human or animal "idols".
In Islam God is one, never be idol or human shape or had son.
Allah never dead.
Though I can't say that there are wrong questions, there could be better asked questions.
Question 1 is, if God exists then how would you know?
Question 2 is, does this God, if exists, concern me or not? (if a god doesn't concern you then he can be ignored even exists)
Question 3 is, what do you need a god for, at the end? (i.e., if he concerns you)
Question 4 is, if a god is needed then what he should do to fulfill your that "need"?
1. how would you know
the most efficient way for a powerful god to do is, to show up in front of humans! if not then you have to ask the next question, why a much more powerful god has to hide from humans. Did he ever provide a reason which is deemed acceptable?
Now if this god has an undeniable reason to hide behind, then what would be the next most efficient way to let you know his existence?
Example,
The Christianity God has a mutual Covenant with humans saying that humans need Faith to be saved. He then can't show up publicly or else humans can approach Him without faith. If so then humans are no longer savable in accordance to the Covenant between God and men.
That begs the question that what would be the next most efficient way for the truth of His existence to be conveyed to humans?
The next most efficient way for God's truth to convey to humans is through the same way how every single truth is conveyed. There's methodology employed by humans to convey all sort of truth without exception. God employed the same way to convey His truth. Humans are blinded to be fully aware of this methodology of truth conveying but employ it on a daily basis and on everything!
As a result, if this unique methodology is brought to your awareness, you may believe with more certainty. That is, there is something which humans use all the times for everything without their own knowledge, yet the God employs it too (implies that this god knows what humans as a whole don't know).
There is a such a methodology, so go figure it out (i.e., to bring it to your full awareness, you made use of it on a daily basis and on almost everything)!
(This is even prophesied, "the god of this world has blinded the minds of ... that they cannot see... why the gospel is a necessity", sorta. So by the time you can tell the necessity of this gospel, you may be up to something!)
2. can this god be ignored
In Christianity then, the god said that there is a covenant between God and men and a Judgment will follow to see one is "saved or not". It means you can't choose to ignore Him (if He exists), while He not only concerns you but also is tied to your death or life!
3. why do you need a god at all
The same as why do you need a job, with a pension plan why you are growing old. It is so because it's a human responsibility to take care of one's own future. The government/laws may force you to join a pension plan in case you don't know what responsibility is.
That begs the question that do we humans have a future after death, which needs our responsible preparation? If, by faith I must say, you presumed that such a future doesn't exist, then you will give up preparing for it. So you made such a decision on your presumption, by faith I must say (unless you count the absence of evidence as the evidence of absence).
This is where a god is for. We humans can't tell if such a future exists. We presume by faith on the two options, namely, this future exists or it doesn't exist. We stopped preparing with the faith that it doesn't exist (a stance of the atheists). We look for the gods to see what options lying in front of us, if we choose not to presume the non-existence. That's the basic stance of Gnosticism.
It's out of human capability to know and confirm a future, that's why we need someone who knows to tell us. That's the stance of what theism is. You need a god because he knows your future which you need to know! That's why you need a god for as a necessity. You need a god to guide your daily life? This is not a necessity. You are safe without a god's guidance. But you are not safe if this god has a Judgment for you.
4. what this god should do to get you informed of his requirements as well as his existence
That actually goes back to Question 1. If this god has a critical message for you, which ties to your death and life (such that you can't choose to ignore him), then he should choose the most efficient way possible to convey the message, such as to make use of a methodology which humans use to convey all kinds of truths on a daily basis!
One of the crucial parts of this methodology demands that, if the critical message from this god is aimed on all humans (or else he can be ignored), he should convey the message in a human-facing manner! The deity of Christianity has an explicit command that "the gospel (message) must be preached (conveyed) to all nations (making it human-facing which is closely tied to the efficiency of how a truth shall convey). Do other gods have the equivalent command? That's the next question!
An analogy is, if the US government has a crucial message for its citizens what should it do. It should employ a US-facing media to broadcast the message. It shouldn't broadcast only in Russia in the hope that the message can reach all citizens in the US. Similarly if a god has a message for all mankind (else he can be ignored), he shouldn't have left his message in India only! (in this case he might have a message for the Indians but not you, he doesn't concern you)
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muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
G-d does not "hide" .. G-d makes Himself known to whomsoever He wills.
..but as G-d is not a person, it is not as straightforward as you might imagine.
What would it mean to "show up in front of humans"? What would you expect G-d to look like?
Great… then follow your heart.
G-d does not "hide" .. G-d makes Himself known to whomsoever He wills.
..but as G-d is not a person, it is not as straightforward as you might imagine.
What would it mean to "show up in front of humans"? What would you expect G-d to look like?
If God is capable, and He has a crucial message for humans then what do you expect Him to do? He should come forward to inform each human individuals about his presence and what His important message is, agree?
Now the question for you is, has any god done that before? That is, came forward to inform each human individual about His presence and His important message for humans.
Since there's no such a god coming forward to keep each human informed of His important message, the chances are,
1) God doesn't exist
2) He exists but He doesn't have an important message for humans
3) He has a special reason not to come forward to each and every human to tell him God's truth
If it's 1) then nothing more to be discussed.
If it's 2) then God is irrelevant. We humans don't need to believe or know anything from God as He has no message for us at all.
If it's 3) then, we may need to work out what possible reason that God doesn't come forward to tell us, each of us, about His godly message.
Now last but not least, has your God provided a valid reason not to come forward to tell everyone His important message which requires human kind to know of?
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I think you didn’t read what I said. Luke 24:45 And He opened their understanding, that they might comprehend the Scriptures.
46 Then He said to them, “Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, 47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
there is tis… all nations
So, in our story, it is me, you and the world
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