YOU believe all the writers did. It doesn't make it true.
I believe that too. I think you are contradicting yourself. That is OK. I still love you.
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I have another question for YOU to ignore
- Thread starter savagewind
- Start date
Where was The Holy Spirit when David decided to have his competition murdered? Or do YOU not believe it was David who wrote some of God breathed scripture?
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
You should have that checked out!
Tell me why.
When someone who believes he serves God by obeying scripture obeys a scripture which was changed from what was "God-breathed" will God consider that one loyal or will God consider that one divided as in serving two masters?
Did Jesus stop being the truth when he died?
John 14:6
Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
John 14:15-18 15"If you love me, keep my commands. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.
John 14:6
Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
John 14:15-18 15"If you love me, keep my commands. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.
Has anyone else noticed that I can make a thousand points for discussion, but the reader, if it gets a reader, will pick out minutia in the post, and maybe comment on that and leave all the real points alone?
Who has time to respond to a thousand points?
... and by the time we did, you would have made ten more.
(I just can't keep up).
As far as I can tell from scripture, the Holy Spirit came ON people for a time and purpose to empower them to do something, and left when the task was finished. Like the glory fading from the face of Moses or the anointing leaving King Saul. In the New Testament, we have a promise that when Jesus ascends to the Father, he will send "a Comforter", who is later described as a "deposit guaranteeing our inheritance". The Holy Spirit appears to take up permanent residence. In both cases, the Holy Spirit appears to function as a power enabler ... granting us the ability to do what God has commanded. In no cases that I can recall, does the Holy Spirit posses a person in the sense that a Demon possessed people in the Gospels and compelled actions contrary to their wills.
This David was under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit when he wrote the Psalms and was acting according to the lusts of his flesh when he had his lover's husband murdered to cover up his own sin. Having the Holy Spirit gives us a desire to NOT SIN, it does not render us physically incapable of doing wrong. We are empowered, not possessed.
Does that address a point?
Nope.
Jesus was the Word in John 1 ... the plan of God from before creation. In Revelation he is the Alpha and Omega. All truth is found within him.
Who was the fourth person in the fiery furnace? ... you will never get to the truth without finding Jesus, he is the Truth.
Who fulfills the promise to Eve? ... you will never understand the truth without finding Jesus, because he is the Truth.
Who will you face at judgement? What really awaits you beyond the grave? ... Jesus told you the Truth because he is the Truth. You cannot reach the truth about that without finding Jesus.
(Just as gravity does not care whether you believe in it or not, it is true irrespective of your opinions, so too, Jesus is the Truth, whether you accept or reject him, and you must deal with that truth, both now and later.)
John 14 is brushing against the reality of the Tri-Unity of God. Father-Son-Spirit = 1 God. I don't understand it, but Scripture is clear in its teaching that it is a mystery revealed by God.
I agree
I agree.
They say all the people who wrote the Bible were possessed. They do not call it possessed because their conscience will not let them. They say that those writing what we now call "scripture" were not physically capable of any wrong in the writing of it.
Have I addressed my point sufficiently?
I think you missed the point. I agree with your post, for the most part.
People say that the Helper, the Spirit of the Truth is not Jesus. You did not address that in your post.
"They" also say that bigfoot is real and aliens made circles in their corn field.
What does the Bible say?
2 Timothy 3:16-17
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
"God-breathed" = θεόπνευστος = theópneustos (theh-op'-nyoo-stos) "from G2316 and a presumed derivative of G4154; divinely breathed in:—given by inspiration of God."
Since our Life/Spirit is also 'God Breathed' (from Genesis), I posit that the relationship may be similar. Our life is not an enslavement to God, but a free gift of empowerment from God. Thus the God-breathed scripture may not be an enslaved transcription, but a divine illumination of understanding that is creatively transcribed by the inspired hand of a man to communicate accurately an eternal truth.
2 Peter 1:19-21
We also have the prophetic message as something completely reliable, and you will do well to pay attention to it, as to a light shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things. For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.
Here Peter explains the process himself.
Setting aside what 'they' say, what do you make of what Peter says?
(Just to tie back to your other thought, that Holy Spirit that carried him along is the Spirit of Truth.)
OK. Is it transmitted through time without anything false in it?"They" also say that bigfoot is real and aliens made circles in their corn field.
What does the Bible say?
2 Timothy 3:16-17
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
"God-breathed" = θεόπνευστος = theópneustos (theh-op'-nyoo-stos) "from G2316 and a presumed derivative of G4154; divinely breathed in:—given by inspiration of God."
Since our Life/Spirit is also 'God Breathed' (from Genesis), I posit that the relationship may be similar. Our life is not an enslavement to God, but a free gift of empowerment from God. Thus the God-breathed scripture may not be an enslaved transcription, but a divine illumination of understanding that is creatively transcribed by the inspired hand of a man to communicate accurately an eternal truth.
2 Peter 1:19-21
We also have the prophetic message as something completely reliable, and you will do well to pay attention to it, as to a light shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things. For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.
Here Peter explains the process himself.
Setting aside what 'they' say, what do you make of what Peter says?
(Just to tie back to your other thought, that Holy Spirit that carried him along is the Spirit of Truth.)
You are from your father the devil and you wish to do the desire of your father. He was a manslayer when he began and he did not stand fast in the truth.
Standing fast in the truth is related somehow to murder.
What does stand fast in the truth mean?
Standing fast in the truth is related somehow to murder.
What does stand fast in the truth mean?
Yeah, I was trying to avoid stepping in that.
OK, From the Baptist Faith and Message: GOD
"There is one and only one living and true God. He is an intelligent, spiritual, and personal Being, the Creator, Redeemer, Preserver, and Ruler of the universe. God is infinite in holiness and all other perfections. God is all powerful and all knowing; and His perfect knowledge extends to all things, past, present, and future, including the future decisions of His free creatures. To Him we owe the highest love, reverence, and obedience. The eternal triune God reveals Himself to us as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, with distinct personal attributes, but without division of nature, essence, or being."
... GOD the SON:
"Christ is the eternal Son of God. In His incarnation as Jesus Christ He was conceived of the Holy Spirit and born of the virgin Mary. Jesus perfectly revealed and did the will of God, taking upon Himself human nature with its demands and necessities and identifying Himself completely with mankind yet without sin. He honored the divine law by His personal obedience, and in His substitutionary death on the cross He made provision for the redemption of men from sin. He was raised from the dead with a glorified body and appeared to His disciples as the person who was with them before His crucifixion. He ascended into heaven and is now exalted at the right hand of God where He is the One Mediator, fully God, fully man, in whose Person is effected the reconciliation between God and man. He will return in power and glory to judge the world and to consummate His redemptive mission. He now dwells in all believers as the living and ever present Lord."
... and GOD the HOLY SPIRIT:
"The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God, fully divine. He inspired holy men of old to write the Scriptures. Through illumination He enables men to understand truth. He exalts Christ. He convicts men of sin, of righteousness, and of judgment. He calls men to the Savior, and effects regeneration. At the moment of regeneration He baptizes every believer into the Body of Christ. He cultivates Christian character, comforts believers, and bestows the spiritual gifts by which they serve God through His church. He seals the believer unto the day of final redemption. His presence in the Christian is the guarantee that God will bring the believer into the fullness of the stature of Christ. He enlightens and empowers the believer and the church in worship, evangelism, and service."
So they are correct that GOD the SON is not GOD the HOLY SPIRIT, however, both the Son and the Holy Spirit are fully Tri-Unity God. Thus there is no loss of Jesus divine attribute of Truth in the empowerment of the Holy Spirit in believers.
I have to apologize for all of the cut and paste ... it was why I avoided the question.
So the final answer: Jesus and the Holy Spirit are BOTH the TRUTH and we (the chosen) are eternally linked to both of them.
The whole world in satan lies and he is called a liar and the father of the lie.
But if there is nothing wrong with scripture, then the people who wrote it were taken out of the world and possessed by The Spirit of God because "the Holy Spirit does not render a person physically incapable of doing wrong".
All the people who wrote it and who transmitted it had to have been possessed by The Holy Spirit.
Then it was written under slavery, restriction and suppression, so how does it make a person free?
John 8:32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free
But if there is nothing wrong with scripture, then the people who wrote it were taken out of the world and possessed by The Spirit of God because "the Holy Spirit does not render a person physically incapable of doing wrong".
All the people who wrote it and who transmitted it had to have been possessed by The Holy Spirit.
Then it was written under slavery, restriction and suppression, so how does it make a person free?
John 8:32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free
Thank you. Cut and copy does not bother me.
Did you leave Someone out?
A Freudian slip, perhaps?
Jesus, The Holy Spirit and The Father are all the truth and we are eternally linked to all of them............
According to the greatest wisdom, is it right to call Jesus the helper and teacher? @atpollard