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I just saw this ridiculous commercial for the 2nd time:

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Bro. A leaky boat?

Englishman's Concordance
bak·kō·p̄er — 1 Occurrence
Genesis 6:14
HEB: מִבַּ֥יִת וּמִח֖וּץ בַּכֹּֽפֶר׃
NAS: it inside and out with pitch.
KJV: it within and without with pitch.
INT: within and without pitch

Asphalt, also known as bitumen (UK: /ˈbɪtjʊmɪn/, US: /bɪˈtjuːmən, baɪ-/), is a sticky, black, and highly viscous liquid or semi-solid form of petroleum. It may be found in natural deposits or may be a refined product, and is classed as a pitch. Before the 20th century, the term asphaltum was also used. The word is derived from the Ancient Greek ἄσφαλτος ásphaltos.

Etymology
The word "asphalt" is derived from the late Middle English, in turn from French asphalte, based on Late Latin asphalton, asphaltum, which is the latinisation of the Greek ἄσφαλτος (ásphaltos, ásphalton), a word meaning "asphalt/bitumen/pitch", which perhaps derives from ἀ-, "without" and σφάλλω (sfallō), "make fall".
..............
The expression "bitumen" originated in the Sanskrit words jatu, meaning "pitch", and jatu-krit, meaning "pitch creating" or "pitch producing" (referring to coniferous or resinous trees). The Latin equivalent is claimed by some to be originally gwitu-men (pertaining to pitch), and by others, pixtumens (exuding or bubbling pitch), which was subsequently shortened to bitumen, thence passing via French into English. From the same root is derived the Anglo-Saxon word cwidu (mastix), the German word Kitt (cement or mastic) and the old Norse word kvada.

Ancient times
The use of natural bitumen for waterproofing, and as an adhesive dates at least to the fifth millennium BC, with a crop storage basket discovered in Mehrgarh, of the Indus Valley Civilization, lined with it. By the 3rd millennia BC refined rock asphalt was in use, in the region, and was used to waterproof the Great Bath, Mohenjo-daro.
In the ancient Middle East, the Sumerians used natural bitumen deposits for mortar between bricks and stones, to cement parts of carvings, such as eyes, into place, for ship caulking, and for waterproofing. The Greek historian Herodotus said hot bitumen was used as mortar in the walls of Babylon.

The 1 kilometre (0.62 mi) long Euphrates Tunnel beneath the river Euphrates at Babylon in the time of Queen Semiramis (ca. 800 BC) was reportedly constructed of burnt bricks covered with bitumen as a waterproofing agent.

Bitumen was used by ancient Egyptians to embalm mummies. The Persian word for asphalt is moom, which is related to the English word mummy.
The Egyptians' primary source of bitumen was the Dead Sea, which the Romans knew as Palus Asphaltites (Asphalt Lake).

Approximately 40 AD, Dioscorides described the Dead Sea material as Judaicum bitumen, and noted other places in the region where it could be found. The Sidon bitumen is thought to refer to material found at Hasbeya. Pliny refers also to bitumen being found in Epirus. It was a valuable strategic resource, the object of the first known battle for a hydrocarbon deposit—between the Seleucids and the Nabateans in 312 BC.

In the ancient Far East, natural bitumen was slowly boiled to get rid of the higher fractions, leaving a thermoplastic material of higher molecular weight that when layered on objects became quite hard upon cooling. This was used to cover objects that needed waterproofing, such as scabbards and other items. Statuettes of household deities were also cast with this type of material in Japan, and probably also in China.

In North America, archaeological recovery has indicated bitumen was sometimes used to adhere stone projectile points to wooden shafts.
In Canada, aboriginal people used bitumen seeping out of the banks of the Athabasca and other rivers to waterproof birch bark canoes, and also heated it in smudge pots to ward off mosquitoes in the summer.

The ancients were definitely not backward, were they?
If they were, they most definitely had help, from the more ancient... if you know what I mean.
Yes, I read it. And you were wrong in your most recent reply to @Jose Fly , perhaps studying up on the square/cube law would help.
 

ecco

Veteran Member
Seems like this one always comes up, despite it being explained countless times.
New evidence from the Maya city of Copan, in Honduras, reveals that ancient Mesoamericans routinely captured and traded wild animals for symbolic and ritual purposes, according to a study published September 12, 2018...

Wild animals were routinely captured and traded in ancient Mesoamerica

Haven't most people watched The Life of Pi?
Do you believe the Life of Pi is factual?

Other than that, what's your point?
 

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
Concerning eating.....Let me ask you this:
Do you think it possible that God could have induced a state of hibernation for those animals? So they wouldn't eat much?

Does the Bible say? No, it doesn't. But it seems likely, given there was only the one entrance/exit on the Ark....the 1-cubit-high window, that stretched around the Ark, was near the top.

During stormy weather (which is what the Flood was, lol), many animals tend to enter a state of hibernation, or at least torpor, inactivity.

Could Jehovah just keep them from getting hungry? In the Book of Daniel, we are told of a situation where Daniel was thrown into a pit of lions...they didn't attack him. Were they not hungry? No, they were! Daniel was taken out, his accusers were hurled in, and the lions ate them up quickly.

Where the Bible is silent on details of anything, I go with what the interpretation allows and makes the most sense, staying within the parameters of the story. And consider the Bible's entire context. I've never found it to be wrong.


Concerning their distribution after the Flood.....

Again, the Bible is silent. But it does tell that Jehovah God took Elijah "up in a windstorm, in a flaming chariot." (He wasn't taken to heaven, as many think....a while later, he wrote a letter to Israel's new king.) Apparently, he was simply transported to another area. Couldn't Jehovah do the same? Though He's not required to give us any explanation.

The Bible makes lots of claims that there is no evidence for.
And your own imagination has less value than the Bible's hollow assertions.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
If God could magically make animals comply peacefully to his will and order themselves single file, all well-behaved rather than obeying their natural instincts, why couldn't he just get humans to behave like that and make the whole ark thingy unnecessary to begin with?

Sounds like an awful waste of life to destroy it all, when he used magic to save some of it from himself. Very confusing. Reason cannot make sense of such strange logic. "I will curse life and destroy it because it disobeys me, so I will use magic to make it obey me so I don't have to destroy all of it for not obeying me." :confused:
You can’t reason on It? It’s not hard: Jehovah really owns everything — the earth and all in it — except for one thing.....our loyalty. He wants us to give it, willingly. (Not because we have to, like unthinking robots.) Most humans — many spirit creatures — don’t.

It’s because of those rebellious spirit creatures (Genesis 6:1-4), that Jehovah had to protect the human race.

Where do you think the idea for most of the Greek, Roman, etc., mythologies came from?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Do you believe the Life of Pi is factual?

Other than that, what's your point?
Of course. How else could one film that tiger? Video is as reliable as the Bible:rolleyes:


On a serious note, even amateurs can make rather amazing special effects videos these days, so of course on YouTube another amateur came up with a channel explaining how those videos were made:


CaptainDisillusion
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
I have apologized on this very site, when proven to be wrong, or if I made a mistake regarding someone's perceived character/comment.

But, oddly enough, I've never had to apologize to YOU. Hmmmm....
We’ve had very little interaction. I kinda prefer it that way: you tend to berate and resort to ad hominem. It’s telling.

Tar hardens with cold temperatures. It becomes quite brittle, in fact-- I have messed around with tar quite a bit, as a matter of fact. Tar wouldn't help.

Actually I think it was bitumen.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
*sigh*

The level of educational requirements to bring your education up to the level required, to just begin to explain how we know how old the mountains are?

Would cost many thousands of dollars at a mere state university. That's just to get to square one.

And that is assuming simple ignorance. In your case? Many many years of eliminating the false teachings, a kind of anti-knowledge, that you have in your head? Would likely take several thousands of $$ more-- just to get to a blank page on which to begin.

And you expect a pat answer of less than 100 words.... because we know you won't read anything longer... past actions on your part prove that well enough.
You are abusive, aren’t you?

Have I hurt you somehow?
 

Bob the Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
Again you failed to read my post.
When you do so, I will find something meaningful in your post, to respond to. Try reading through for a change.

I read it. It was marginally funny. And sad at the same time. Regardless of which ancient gluelike substances you attempt to twist into the Myth?

The Myth is still impossible: even WITH modern glues? A wooden boat the size of the ark?

Would quickly sink in even the mildest of seas. Your story? Cannot work, based on this simple fact alone.
 

Bob the Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
We’ve had very little interaction. I kinda prefer it that way: you tend to berate and resort to ad hominem. It’s telling..

You really need to review what "ad hominem" means. Because it does not mean what you seem to think it means.

Criticizing someone's quaint and fatally flawed beliefs and... "arguments" (and we use the term loosely here), is not an actual ad hominem.

But calling someone a poopyhead? Or as you did above? Making false statements about another's actions? Actually is.

hmmmm...

Actually I think it was bitumen.

Does not help. Even if you used modern silicone or epoxies?

A wooden boat built to the size of the ark?

Would twist in the waves, open it's long planks, and SINK.

That's basic physics of **wood**.... not that I expect you'd appreciate the physics of ... well... anything, really.

And I know that, from reading your posts on "physics"....

And no... that wasn't an ad hom either.
 

Bob the Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
“Torque in the planks” — oookaay.

‘Noah’s Ark would have floated’

Floating is one thing. The twisting of a long hull, as described in the ark myth?

Is simple boat building facts.

There is a VERY GOOD REASON WHY nobody has EVER successfully made a wooden boat the size and shape of the ark:

Because it would SINK. Inescapable fact.

But it's physics, again.... what's that? You do not believe in physics?

Yeah... I noticed....
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
I read it. It was marginally funny. And sad at the same time. Regardless of which ancient gluelike substances you attempt to twist into the Myth?

The Myth is still impossible: even WITH modern glues? A wooden boat the size of the ark?

Would quickly sink in even the mildest of seas. Your story? Cannot work, based on this simple fact alone.
I noticed you don't have a backup source. Is this another one of your, "because Bob says so" baseless claims? Or do you have source material that we can verify this wild claim?

Be careful. It no use if your words are just striking the wind.
 

Bob the Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
Implied threats”?!

It’s a hope...I wish you no harm.

It’s a hope I have. Grief.


Yes.... threats. Wishing someone will be tortured forever in your god's custom torture pit?

Is quite an over the top threat. Fortunately for you?

I'm an atheist, and I find your threats amusing. Sad, but amusing.

How tiny a god do you believe in, that has to stoop so low as to create a custom torture pit for all the creatures that do not ... ahem.... "love" it?

Christianity: So awful that it's god created a fraction of itself so it could kill said fraction to "pay" for the rules that it had created in the first place.... but it negates the payment by not letting the fraction actually stay dead...

I'd say "ridiculous" but that would be too kind.
 

Bob the Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
I noticed you don't have a backup source. Is this another one of your, "because Bob says so" baseless claims? Or do you have source material that we can verify this wild claim?

Be careful. It no use if your words are just striking the wind.

I do not need a "backup source" because it matters not one whit, WHAT sort of ancient "glue" you choose to rewrite into the Noah Myth.

A wood boat that large would sink. Especially since Noah did not have access to modern bilge pumps.

Even worse: Noah didn't have sufficient helpers to man those pumps in the first place...

No.. . The Ark Myth fails on so MANY levels... the glue is just one of many failure points.
 
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