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I just want to sin!!!

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
Doesn't sound like a very liberating faith to me. Nonstop guilt for your shortcomings? Do you find comfort in guilt?

I live everyday very happy and with complete inner peace. This is a religion of gratitude where we are so joyous that we have been given a very precious gift.

When I first joined the Baha’i Faith 46 years ago, I had all sorts of guilt complexes and anxieties left over from my previous beliefs. I found that the emphasis on focusing on the positive, healed me of all those traumas and made me a happy and joyous person.

Regular reading the Words of Baha’u’llah fills me with so much encouragement and hope.
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
I can believe that.
I can see from the staunch atheists on this site, that some people have an agenda of leading people away from G-d. The ringleaders of dissension cannot be accepted as friends of those responsible for maintaining law and order.
It does not surprise me at all that you think that.
 

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
I feel that it is an excuse to sin. I was so happy that I could do what I wanted when I was a Christian. They told us we are not bound by the laws of the Abrahamic/Moses laws. Jesus died so you can be free of sin. Now I am not a Christian (not bragging) but, it is a hoax to me.

Free of sin, or free to sin, or both? Forgiven upon asking 'sincerely,' or forgiven immediately by default?

As for what it is, I wouldn't say it is hoax, but rather I am becoming somewhat convinced that it might originate as someone's master's thesis at university, or other collegiate level sociology product to synthesize religion and philosophy. The binding agent was a copious amount of mystery, case and point being: that we still here now trying to discuss what it means. And for that, I suppose I have to applaud the genius of those university students
 

Sheldon

Veteran Member
I can see from the staunch atheists on this site, that some people have an agenda of leading people away from G-d.

Yes it seems clear you are one of those theists who would prefer it if atheists were silenced, so that your beliefs and ideas were never challenged. However it is an absurd claim, since one cannot lead someone away from something, if one does not believe it exists.
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
You might feel more guilt and shame as a sincere Christian. But of course it is pretty easy for Christians to have their conscience dulled through repetition of the same sins.
Nevertheless for a Christian God still works in their lives to change them for the better.
And if they completely ignore the Holy Spirit in their life then maybe that is the unforgiveable sin.
No true Scotsman
 

MyM

Well-Known Member
So you believe it’s just fine to be God’s Prophet and receive worship from men?
Again, Using the Scripture you quoted: Is
Jesus good, yes or no?

No, we in Islam, do NOT worship prophets. Why worship a man? Allah is above all, we only worship Allah and all the prophets and messengers from Allah peace and blessings be upon them, are just his creations. We don't worship Allah's creations in Islam, we only worship the Creator for he is the only one worthy of worship.

We believe that all his prophets and messengers were good :) yes.
 

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
I have seen Christians on this site make that claim, then espouse homophobic bigotry, as one example. The bible is a book of vague and even contradictory claims, open to subjective interpretation, which is probably why there over 45000 separate denominations globally. Yet every Christian claims to know what the deity they imagine exists wants, same with every Muslim and the Quran.

As an atheist my primary concern is to avoid and as far as possible prevent unnecessary suffering. I don't need to love my neighbour for that, in fact I can detest them, hate their guts, but still recognise they deserve the same rights as anyone else.

Hi Sheldon.

Yes that’s one of the things that caused me a lot of angst that two sects of Christianity in the same street hated each other’s guts despite supposedly believing in the same Book. I just couldn’t reconcile myself to these contradictions and became an atheist and believed I was more sincere because I walked away from inconsistency rather than turning a blind eye. How can one preach to others to be united and loving when one is divided into tens of thousands of sects?

“Where, precisely, are "Judaism", "Buddhism", "Christianity", "Islám" and the others, since they obviously cannot be identified with the irreconcilably opposed organizations that purport to speak authoritatively in their names?”

So joining one means you axiomatically must reject the others and who speaks authoritatively for these Faiths as none of them speak with one voice? Will the right or true Christianity or Islam or Buddhism please stand up?

So this situation has rightfully led people to become atheists because where is their God if they can’t get along with each other?

For me, as an atheist, I eventually found that there was a way out of this mess but it means moving on, not clinging to outworn shibboleths which have had their time and are not fit for this age and which need to give way to the needs of this time.
 
No, we in Islam, do NOT worship prophets. Why worship a man? Allah is above all, we only worship Allah and all the prophets and messengers from Allah peace and blessings be upon them, are just his creations. We don't worship Allah's creations in Islam, we only worship the Creator for he is the only one worthy of worship.

We believe that all his prophets and messengers were good :) yes.
I didn’t ask if you who you worship, I asked you what you would think of a Prophet of God who receives the worship of men?
Also, if all the prophets are good then when Jesus said only God is good then what?
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
But the thing the really scares me is when they say, "If you don't believe in God, what keeps you from just killing other people?" Yikes! Are they saying that their belief in God is the only thing that holds them back from murder?? Shouldn't we all be afraid of them?

Oh yeah! I used to hear that one a lot. Not so much recently. Hopefully that mentality has tapered back. At least a little.
 
It doesn't matter, no one needs to disprove an unevidenced assumption, and you simply assumed we are limited to those two choices, that is why it is a fallacy.
There are only 2 options, so until you present another then it’s not a false dichotomy fallacy.
 

MyM

Well-Known Member
Free of sin, or free to sin, or both? Forgiven upon asking 'sincerely,' or forgiven immediately by default?

As for what it is, I wouldn't say it is hoax, but rather I am becoming somewhat convinced that it might originate as someone's master's thesis at university, or other collegiate level sociology product to synthesize religion and philosophy. The binding agent was a copious amount of mystery, case and point being: that we still here now trying to discuss what it means. And for that, I suppose I have to applaud the genius of those university students


Yes, I would think that a Book of God (meaning the bible) would not hold confusion and doubt and contradictions. Being forgiven in Islam, Allah is very merciful. There are ahadith that says beautiful things about forgiveness. There are many ways that Allah can forgive and gives us the chance to ask for that forgiveness. Something so simple can tip our scale for the good example...

It was narrated that Abu Hurayrah said: The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said: “Whoever says Subhaan Allaah wa bi hamdih (Praise and glory be to Allah) one hundred times, morning and evening, his sins will be erased even if they are like the foam of the sea.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6042; Muslim, 2691.

When one commits a major sin, one is to do towbah, (pray 2 rakaat) and afterwards ask Allah for forgiveness with sincerity and to obstain from that sin, Allah will forgive. Allah has many ways to forgive.

We are not given the entitlement to go sin -you have a choice to or not, but for Muslims, our repercussions will go against us and that is something you do not want to do .
 

Sheldon

Veteran Member
In Islam, he already knows who will go astray or not. He is Allah. He created heaven and hell. He said he will test. He gave mankind the free will to choose or refuse. Why blame God for something that is your fault?

That's a contradiction, have you heard of the law of non-contradiction? Hypothetically if a deity existed that already knows whether I will "go astray or not", then I cannot truly have the free will to choose the outcome, that is axiomatic.
 
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Colt

Well-Known Member
"But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart."
Apparently not.
Lust is the act of imaging having sex with another. Its something that we do with our minds, its not something that "happens to us".
 

Sheldon

Veteran Member
There are only 2 options, so until you present another then it’s not a false dichotomy fallacy.

Repeating the false dichotomy fallacy doesn't make it rational, you would have to offer something beyond bare assertion for your claim. In logic it is also fallacious to assert that a claim or belief is true until it is disproved, that is called an argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy.
 
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