I know not all Muslims are Islamists, but...

[Terrywoodenpic]

I know I'm going to be massively unpopular for saying this, but what's the problem with this? You wouldn't leave your valuables on show and the door unlocked for a burglar to come in your house. Many women dress in a way that is sexually appealing, and then wonder why they are harassed by men who believe the woman is sexually available/willing. Simple solution is that if you don't want attention, don't draw it to yourself!

British law only places the guilt on the perpetrator of Rape. There are no valid excuses for breaking that law. We all understand that, and understand the consequences.

A burglar is also guilty of burglary when he enters an unlocked house. (In many parts of the country housed are rarely locked.)

In neither case can the criminal claim he has had an invitation.

If you feel attracted to a single woman our social customs allow many ways of approaching her that are neither oppressive nor harassment. None are based on how she is dressed.

In the UK most women dress much the same as each other. It is those that cover up that stand out, and draw attention.

 

[Nehustan]

In the UK most women dress much the same as each other. It is those that cover up that stand out, and draw attention.

That's not true Terry...it's much easier to have a perve at some women than at others!!! i.e. shape, legs, curves. They very much dress differently in this regard.

There's an Islamic saying in regard to beautiful women; 'The first look is for yourself, the second look is for Shaitan'

 

[Pastek]

If you feel attracted to a single woman our social customs allow many ways of approaching her that are neither oppressive nor harassment. None are based on how she is dressed.

I'm ok with you, it's not a reason to harass women.

Everyone knows that in some countries like Egypt for exemple, women are harassed even if they wear the hijab.

I saw some months ago the show of Bassam Youssef (El Bernameg) and he said that Afghanistan was the first country in the "top" in a classement about harassment againt women, and Egypt just after.

It's start at 0:46:00
Ok i'm sorry it's subtitled in french, but it's very interesting thought if you understand a little bit.

[youtube]MUIBc6WvVi4[/youtube]
Bassem Youssef : être humoriste en Egypte aujourd'hui - YouTube


I think it depends on many things.
Religion condemn any bad behavior. I believe that it's a question of education and responsability first.

 

[Sakeenah]

You know I think it's a shame that we ONLY associate the hijab or the wearing of the face veil with the sexuality of men ,rape and women wearing revealing clothes and the pressures of today's society.

Most of us aren't forced by anyone and we don't wear it because we think men can't control themselves. We do believe that you should share your beauty with the people you love instead of every stranger on the street. BUT this isn't the number 1 reason why most women choose to cover themselves. We cover because we believe its a commandment of God.We do it out of modesty and we believe it's a way to get closer to God.

This doesn't mean I look down on women who don't wear hijab/face veil..because I have been without hijab..and now wear hijab and face veil.
For those who want to know why a woman in the west would wear a face veil read this article in the NY times: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/fashion/13veil.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

 

[Nehustan]

You know I think it's a shame that we ONLY associate the hijab or the wearing of the face veil with the sexuality of men ,rape and women wearing revealing clothes and the pressures of today's society.

Most of us aren't forced by anyone and we don't wear it because we think men can't control themselves. We do believe that you should share your beauty with the people you love instead of every stranger on the street. BUT this isn't the number 1 reason why most women choose to cover themselves. We cover because we believe its a commandment of God.We do it out of modesty and we believe it's a way to get closer to God.

This doesn't mean I look down on women who don't wear hijab/face veil..because I have been without hijab..and now wear hijab and face veil.
For those who want to know why a woman in the west would wear a face veil read this article in the NY times: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/fashion/13veil.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

To be honest, one can still see when a sister is stunning even with Hidjab and Niqab. Beautiful eyes and an imagination can be more alluring than a pair of daisy dukes. It takes more than a veil to combat the male mind, astagfir Allah.

 

[Aquitaine]

That's not true Terry...it's much easier to have a perve at some women than at others!!! i.e. shape, legs, curves. They very much dress differently in this regard.

There's an Islamic saying in regard to beautiful women; 'The first look is for yourself, the second look is for Shaitan'

I'm gonna have to agree with Terry on this one: a woman wearing the Niqab or a Burkha in the UK will stand out far more than a woman wearing a mini-skirt.

Secondly - shape, legs, curves etc are all still present regardless of what an individual is wearing.

 

[Aquitaine]

I know I'm going to be massively unpopular for saying this, but what's the problem with this? You wouldn't leave your valuables on show and the door unlocked for a burglar to come in your house. Many women dress in a way that is sexually appealing, and then wonder why they are harassed by men who believe the woman is sexually available/willing. Simple solution is that if you don't want attention, don't draw it to yourself!

Wow..... girl I have to completely disagree with you here.

That's like saying: "if you don't want anti-Islamic attention, then don't draw it to yourself by acting and dressing as a Muslim."

 

[HiddenHijabi]

You know I think it's a shame that we ONLY associate the hijab or the wearing of the face veil with the sexuality of men ,rape and women wearing revealing clothes and the pressures of today's society.

Most of us aren't forced by anyone and we don't wear it because we think men can't control themselves. We do believe that you should share your beauty with the people you love instead of every stranger on the street. BUT this isn't the number 1 reason why most women choose to cover themselves. We cover because we believe its a commandment of God.We do it out of modesty and we believe it's a way to get closer to God.

This doesn't mean I look down on women who don't wear hijab/face veil..because I have been without hijab..and now wear hijab and face veil.
For those who want to know why a woman in the west would wear a face veil read this article in the NY times: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/fashion/13veil.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

I agree with this. Hijab should be worn for the sake of Allaah above anything else.

 

[Godobeyer]

I'm ok with you, it's not a reason to harass women.

Everyone knows that in some countries like Egypt for exemple, women are harassed even if they wear the hijab.

I saw some months ago the show of Bassam Youssef (El Bernameg) and he said that Afghanistan was the first country in the "top" in a classement about harassment againt women, and Egypt just after.

It's start at 0:46:00
Ok i'm sorry it's subtitled in french, but it's very interesting thought if you understand a little bit.

[youtube]MUIBc6WvVi4[/youtube]
Bassem Youssef : être humoriste en Egypte aujourd'hui - YouTube


I think it depends on many things.
Religion condemn any bad behavior. I believe that it's a question of education and responsability first.

I am fan of Bassem Youssef , he had very funny critic about some bad scholars whom use Islam to get some personal benefices or politic benefices , some scandals


AlKASAS , ALKASAS
القصاص ...القصاص


[youtube]zhGJmztZYcc[/youtube]
‫

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I know I'm going to be massively unpopular for saying this, but what's the problem with this? You wouldn't leave your valuables on show and the door unlocked for a burglar to come in your house. Many women dress in a way that is sexually appealing, and then wonder why they are harassed by men who believe the woman is sexually available/willing. Simple solution is that if you don't want attention, don't draw it to yourself!

It might be naive to leave the door unlocked, and the valuables on show, but burglary is burglary, and rape is rape. As a man, I sure as hell don't want someone making excuses on behalf of me or any other man for this reason, and I find it a bit insulting. I'm quite capable of controlling myself, and any man who can't is a criminal.

 

[Pastek]

This doesn't mean I look down on women who don't wear hijab/face veil..because I have been without hijab..and now wear hijab and face veil.
For those who want to know why a woman in the west would wear a face veil read this article in the NY times: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/fashion/13veil.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Personnally i don't cover my face.
But i respect those who choose that.

Can i ask you if you work ?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

You know I think it's a shame that we ONLY associate the hijab or the wearing of the face veil with the sexuality of men ,rape and women wearing revealing clothes and the pressures of today's society.

Most of us aren't forced by anyone and we don't wear it because we think men can't control themselves. We do believe that you should share your beauty with the people you love instead of every stranger on the street. BUT this isn't the number 1 reason why most women choose to cover themselves. We cover because we believe its a commandment of God.We do it out of modesty and we believe it's a way to get closer to God.

This doesn't mean I look down on women who don't wear hijab/face veil..because I have been without hijab..and now wear hijab and face veil.
For those who want to know why a woman in the west would wear a face veil read this article in the NY times: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/fashion/13veil.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Hey, thanks for posting the article link, I found it an interesting read. I have to be honest, though, I still don't really understand the point of wearing the face veil vs simply wearing the hijab. You're still clearly proclaiming your religion, are still (as I understand it) complying with the tenets of the Quran, and can still dress modestly in combination with it.

I guess that's the part I can't quite grasp. Why go the extra step? I might have trouble understanding, to be honest. I'm a male atheist trying to imagine life from the pov of a Muslim woman...lol...it's a stretch for me!

But how does it make you closer to God?

 

[Pastek]

AlKASAS , ALKASAS
القصاص ...القصاص



[youtube]zhGJmztZYcc[/youtube]
‫

hhhhhhhhhhhhh Lol !!!!

 

[Aquitaine]

It might be naive to leave the door unlocked, and the valuables on show, but burglary is burglary, and rape is rape. As a man, I sure as hell don't want someone making excuses on behalf of me or any other man for this reason, and I find it a bit insulting. I'm quite capable of controlling myself, and any man who can't is a criminal.

Exactly, plus women who wear Burkhas and Niqabs are also the victims is Sexual Assault and Rape. So clothing is just a lame victim-blaming excuse.

"We'll she was wearing a Niqab, exposing her eyes to people out in public - she was asking for it."

 

[HiddenHijabi]

Hey, thanks for posting the article link, I found it an interesting read. I have to be honest, though, I still don't really understand the point of wearing the face veil vs simply wearing the hijab. You're still clearly proclaiming your religion, are still (as I understand it) complying with the tenets of the Quran, and can still dress modestly in combination with it.

I guess that's the part I can't quite grasp. Why go the extra step? I might have trouble understanding, to be honest. I'm a male atheist trying to imagine life from the pov of a Muslim woman...lol...it's a stretch for me!

But how does it make you closer to God?

It's a teaching within Islam that doing any act commanded of you which is obligatory is rewarded. However there is extra reward from Allah where the act being done is an addition to the obligatory duties. So hijab is the bare minimum for what is required for modesty, so many women wear a full-face veil to show their obedience even more than the minimum hijab. It's 'going the extra mile' so to speak.

 

[Aquitaine]

hhhhhhhhhhhhh Lol !!!!

Would it be possible to explain to me what is going on in this video for me, please?

 

[Pastek]

Would it be possible to explain to me what is going on in this video for me, please?

Turn on CC to see the english sub


[youtube]anJBfWQRwEk[/youtube]
Bassem youssef's Albernameg- Morsi and The leader (funny part) w/english sub - YouTube

 

[lewisnotmiller]

It's a teaching within Islam that doing any act commanded of you which is obligatory is rewarded. However there is extra reward from Allah where the act being done is an addition to the obligatory duties. So hijab is the bare minimum for what is required for modesty, so many women wear a full-face veil to show their obedience even more than the minimum hijab. It's 'going the extra mile' so to speak.

Okay, got it. Thanks for that.

Couple more questions, if I can. For any wearing the face veil, why not go the burqa?
And also, I've read conflicting reports about where the...requirement I guess...to wear even a hijab is in the Quran. Can anyone clarify, or at least tell me more from a cultural point of view where it comes from if it's not a requirement of the Quran?

Might be a bit off topic, but I don't get the chance to ask these questions in my day to day life. Last observant Muslim girl I was friends with was way back at Uni (and I mean waaaay back. I'm not as young as I used to be...lol)

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

That's not true Terry...it's much easier to have a perve at some women than at others!!! i.e. shape, legs, curves. They very much dress differently in this regard.

There's an Islamic saying in regard to beautiful women; 'The first look is for yourself, the second look is for Shaitan'

I said they all dress much the same not that they are all equally beautiful.

 

[Nehustan]

I said they all dress much the same not that they are all equally beautiful.

I still think that there is a great difference in how women dress. I should say I'm somewhat of an expert on the subject, given how much of my day is spent glancing...my bad...