Identifying True Christianity

[Pegg]

Every religion has its identifying features. I want to list the five identifying features of a true Christian believer. These features can be gleaned from the gospels in Jesus instructions about how to follow him.

Identifying feature 1 found in Matthew 7:21
“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.”
Its not enough to profess Christianity, a true christian must 'practice' it. This involves their whole way of life, including their attitude toward money, secular work, entertainment, worldly customs and celebrations, and marriage and other relationships with fellow humans.


Identifying feature 2 found in Luke 4:43
“To other cities I must declare the good news of the kingdom of God, because for this I was sent forth.”
Like Jesus, a true follower is one who also shares the message that Jesus shared. It was the message of the Kingdom. That kingdom was explained in Daniel 2:44 as a real heavenly rulership that would eventually take over the rulership of the earth. Jesus preached that this kingdom is mankinds only hope for salvation and included it in his model prayer "let your kingdom come"



Identifying feature 3 found in Matthew 6:9
“YOU must pray, then, this way: “‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified."
Jesus made Gods name known to his disciples and they were in turn to sanctify that name. This sanctification of Gods name was so important to Jesus that he made it the first priority in the Model Prayer. A follower of Christ would uphold and cherish the name of God, they would carry that name to others just as Jesus carried it to them.



Identifying feature 4 found in 1John 2:15
“Do not be loving either the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.”
A follower of Christ would not put their trust and hope in the things of this world, they would put their trust and hope in God. Jesus said we cannot be a slave for two masters so christians must make a decision as to which master they will slave for. Having involvement with the worlds pursuits would put as at odds with Godly pursuits. It would require neutrality in political affairs. Followers of Christ cannot slave for God and the world, they must choose one.



Identifying feature 5 found in Matthew 22:37-39
“You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind” and “you must love your neighbour as yourself.”
Love should be evident in a christians way of life. They should be peaceful with all people. Their actions toward their fellowman should always be governed by love and would overcome racial, cultural, and political barriers.


These five features are what you would expect to find in true christianity.

 

[savagewind]

a true christian must 'practice' it. This involves their whole way of life, including their attitude toward money, secular work, entertainment, worldly customs and celebrations, and marriage and other relationships with fellow humans.

Acts 15:9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith.[not works]

verse 10,11 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are."

Acts 15:19,20 It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.

Having involvement with the worlds pursuits would put as at odds with Godly pursuits. It would require neutrality in political affairs

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Romans 13:1

God arranges the athorities in their places giving them the power to act and influence but forbids God's own people to participate?

See Daniel and Joseph.

 

[kjw47]

Acts 15:9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith.[not works]

verse 10,11 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are."

Acts 15:19,20 It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Romans 13:1

God arranges the athorities in their places giving them the power to act and influence but forbids God's own people to participate?

See Daniel and Joseph.

The difference is that Daniel and Joseph were both servants of YHWH(Jehovah) and gave sound spiritual advice that Jehovah would approve of--and it was Gods will those events. For a purpose. And those kings were willing to listen, today not 1 would listen. That is why this will occur. rev 16)

God allows Govts but not one do his will.

 

[ChristineES]

Mar 9:38 John said to him, "Teacher, we saw someone casting out demons in your name, and we tried to stop him, because he was not following us."
Mar 9:39 But Jesus said, "Do not stop him, for no one who does a mighty work in my name will be able soon afterward to speak evil of me.
Mar 9:40 For the one who is not against us is for us.

These verses are very important. Because of these, I don't point to people of other denominations and say "that one is a true Christian" or "That one is not a true Christian". In my faith, I don't think we have time for "us vs. them" when it comes to Christianity.

 

[Pegg]

These verses are very important. Because of these, I don't point to people of other denominations and say "that one is a true Christian" or "That one is not a true Christian". In my faith, I don't think we have time for "us vs. them" when it comes to Christianity.

I agree that we should be focusing on ourselves and how we practice christianity and not on what others are doing.

So if we think of it that way, we should be able to look at Jesus teachings as I've posted above and know what we need to do in order to follow Jesus. And if our respective denominations are not helping us to do what we've been instructed, ask them why.

 

[Athan]

Every religion has its identifying features. I want to list the five identifying features of a true Christian believer. These features can be gleaned from the gospels in Jesus instructions about how to follow him.

Identifying feature 1 found in Matthew 7:21
“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.”
Its not enough to profess Christianity, a true christian must 'practice' it. This involves their whole way of life, including their attitude toward money, secular work, entertainment, worldly customs and celebrations, and marriage and other relationships with fellow humans.


Identifying feature 2 found in Luke 4:43
“To other cities I must declare the good news of the kingdom of God, because for this I was sent forth.”
Like Jesus, a true follower is one who also shares the message that Jesus shared. It was the message of the Kingdom. That kingdom was explained in Daniel 2:44 as a real heavenly rulership that would eventually take over the rulership of the earth. Jesus preached that this kingdom is mankinds only hope for salvation and included it in his model prayer "let your kingdom come"



Identifying feature 3 found in Matthew 6:9
“YOU must pray, then, this way: “‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified."
Jesus made Gods name known to his disciples and they were in turn to sanctify that name. This sanctification of Gods name was so important to Jesus that he made it the first priority in the Model Prayer. A follower of Christ would uphold and cherish the name of God, they would carry that name to others just as Jesus carried it to them.



Identifying feature 4 found in 1John 2:15
“Do not be loving either the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.”
A follower of Christ would not put their trust and hope in the things of this world, they would put their trust and hope in God. Jesus said we cannot be a slave for two masters so christians must make a decision as to which master they will slave for. Having involvement with the worlds pursuits would put as at odds with Godly pursuits. It would require neutrality in political affairs. Followers of Christ cannot slave for God and the world, they must choose one.



Identifying feature 5 found in Matthew 22:37-39
“You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind” and “you must love your neighbour as yourself.”
Love should be evident in a christians way of life. They should be peaceful with all people. Their actions toward their fellowman should always be governed by love and would overcome racial, cultural, and political barriers.


These five features are what you would expect to find in true christianity.

Too limiting. I like to use all the scriptures to help teach me how to be a good Christian.

 

[dawny0826]

These verses are very important. Because of these, I don't point to people of other denominations and say "that one is a true Christian" or "That one is not a true Christian". In my faith, I don't think we have time for "us vs. them" when it comes to Christianity.

I agree with you.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

These five features are what you would expect to find in true christianity.

Why only those five? There are many other commandments from Jesus to his disciples or God to his followers (e.g. the command to perform ritual foot-washing). What makes the particular features you listed different from the other ones described in the Bible?

 

[Pegg]

Why only those five? There are many other commandments from Jesus to his disciples or God to his followers (e.g. the command to perform ritual foot-washing). What makes the particular features you listed different from the other ones described in the Bible?

those five are basic requirements of all christians. They are like the important ingredients in a cake. If you want to make a macaroon, you have to use egg whites, castor sugar and almond meal. Without those as the base ingredients, you wont have a macaroon.

and its the same with christianity....without one of these five base ingredients, you wont really be following Christ.


With regard to ritual footwashing, we dont find any of the writings of the apostles make mention of actual foot washing as a requirement. But what we do see them instructing christians is to be 'humble'

Romans 12:10 In brotherly love have tender affection for one another. In showing honor to one another take the lead.

Galatians 5:13 YOU were, of course, called for freedom, brothers; only do not use this freedom as an inducement for the flesh, but through love slave for one another.
1 Peter 5:5 In like manner, YOU younger men, be in subjection to the older men. But all of YOU gird yourselves with lowliness of mind toward one another, because God opposes the haughty ones, but he gives undeserved kindness to the humble ones

The lesson Jesus gave was not a requirement that they wash each others feet, but a lesson in humility and service. Jesus wanted them to remain humble and not view themselves as superior to others and not to set themselves up as lords over their brothers. The work of footwashing was done by slaves, not by the master of the house. By Jesus washing their feet, he showed that even though he was their master, he was also their slave and so they should likewise keep that mental attituded about their own service to each other.
Matthew 20:25 But Jesus, calling them to him, said: “YOU know that the rulers of the nations lord it over them and the great men wield authority over them
This is not the way among YOU; but whoever wants to become great among YOU must be YOUR minister,

 

[JayJayDee]

These verses are very important. Because of these, I don't point to people of other denominations and say "that one is a true Christian" or "That one is not a true Christian". In my faith, I don't think we have time for "us vs. them" when it comes to Christianity.

I don't think it is a case of finger pointing or "us" and "them". It is a case of telling it like it is, no matter if you step on people's toes to point out the obvious. It's not about one being more sanctimonious than another, but better to have a sore toe than lose your salvation. Jesus did not hesitate to step on the toes of those who should have known better. Lives were at stake. (Matt 23:33) All Jesus asks us to do is evaluate what we believe and practice honestly and by using Bible teachings.

Church going folk are not generally taught to study God's word and adhere to ALL its teachings. They seem to have an attitude that 'if I show up for church once a week and sing praises to God and have a minister/pastor/priest give me a nice sermon and pray on my behalf, then that lets me off the hook for all the other things I "ought to do", like preaching the kingdom at every opportunity, staying married to the one to whom you made vows of "till death do us part" and divorce only on the grounds of a mate's adultery. These are not deemed 'necessary things' that a Christian "ought" to do these days, because they do not fit in with the current lifestyle....yet every one of them was commanded by Christ. We cannot pick and choose what bits of Christianity suit us and conveniently ignore the rest.

There seems to be no discipline administered in the churches either. Yet the apostle Paul clearly outlined what was to be done with unrepentant sinners. They were not to sit as members in good standing in the congregation, making a mockery of God's laws. The admonition was to "remove" them from fellowship after lovingly counseling them and giving them opportunity to repent and seek God's forgiveness. (Gal 6:1; 1 Cor 5:9-13) Judging within the congregation was authorized by God and the necessary discipline was to be administered in the hope of preventing that one from losing their salvation. Should we be less diligent about such things because we live in immoral times? I would think we need to be more diligent about them. (Gal 6:7-10) :sad:

All we can do is point out the truth from God's word and hope that honest hearts are listening. We have examples in times past where warning was given, but no one took any notice. They were happy to just maintain the status quo. (Matt 24:37-39)

History repeats.....

 

[CG Didymus]

those five are basic requirements of all christians. They are like the important ingredients in a cake. If you want to make a macaroon, you have to use egg whites, castor sugar and almond meal. Without those as the base ingredients, you wont have a macaroon.

and its the same with christianity....without one of these five base ingredients, you wont really be following Christ.

Hey Pegg, How do you feel about Jesus saying "those who have believed" from Mark 16:16-18? It does say, "those who have believed" will have these accompanying signs, but only a few extreme believers think they are for today and for all Christians.

 

[Pegg]

Hey Pegg, How do you feel about Jesus saying "those who have believed" from Mark 16:16-18? It does say, "those who have believed" will have these accompanying signs, but only a few extreme believers think they are for today and for all Christians.

I dont think Jesus actually said that and I dont believe those verses are supposed to be there. That is from the long conclusion passage which is not found in some earlier manuscripts. Two of the oldest and most highly regarded Bible manuscripts, the Vatican 1209 and the Sinaitic, do not contain this section; in them, Mark’s Gospel ends at verse eight.
The long endins is not found in the ancient Syriac, Armenian and Ethiopic versions either. Several scholars also agree that the long ending was not written by Mark but was added in much later, ie Dr. Westcott, Tregelles, Tischendorf, Griesbach and Goodspeed.


If those verses were true, then christians should be able to drink poison and survive. Does it really seem to you that those verses are fair dinkum?

 

[Shermana]

Personally I think there is actually very good argument that the long ending of Mark was in fact original, and the arguments against it are kinda weak altogether, even as far as manuscript evidence goes, as much as I like Goodspeed and Griesbach and such, and as much as I appreciate Eusebius's evidence for the "In my name" version of Matthew 28:19, I think in this case they're wrong. If anything, it is the majority of Christian churches who have much to lose from this being the case, since it kinda proves the acid test that they're...not...real...believers.


The Ending of Mark (Mark 16:9-20)

 

[Pegg]

Personally I think there is actually very good argument that the long ending of Mark was in fact original, and the arguments against it are kinda weak altogether, even as far as manuscript evidence goes, as much as I like Goodspeed and Griesbach and such, and as much as I appreciate Eusebius's evidence for the "In my name" version of Matthew 28:19, I think in this case they're wrong. If anything, it is the majority of Christian churches who have much to lose from this being the case, since it kinda proves the acid test that they're...not...real...believers.


The Ending of Mark (Mark 16:9-20)

time-line is a very strong and indisputable line of evidence

What other explanation could there be for the oldest manuscripts to omit those verses, but young manuscripts to add them in?

 

[ChristineES]

Recognizing a true Christian, I believe, requires more than just looking at certain verses. You have to watch a person's actions, as well. For example, if a person calls himself or herself a Christians and goes around saying hateful things, you might start having doubts.
But, as I've said many times here, only God can see our hearts.

 

[Shermana]

time-line is a very strong and indisputable line of evidence

What other explanation could there be for the oldest manuscripts to omit those verses, but young manuscripts to add them in?

Ummm no, time line is not "indisputable" whatsoever, especially when the earliest KNOWN copy is from the 4th century. Any bible scholar worth their salt will tell you that earlier does not always equate to better, and that Patristic references often times trump anything else.

My personal assessment is that younger copies simply had access to better source material and versions, and that the older copies may have been copying from a different, flawed version, either from a codex that had the last page dropped out, or deliberately dropped out because too many wannabe-Christians were experimenting with poison. Read the article.

 

[Xian Catalyst]

First you have to define what a Xian is. Put 100 people in a room who claim to be Xians, then pass them a card to define what that means, if you quizzed them past the cliche's, you'd have no less than 135 definitions.

The best definition I've seen of "TRUE CHRISTIAN" is, "You are not one, cause you don't agree with me!"

And I'm not meaning to rain on your parade here Pegg, I realize minus the term you have a good thought going here. But I don't think it can really get anywhere until the WHAT IS part is answered. First on CHRISTIAN, then on true...

 

[Xian Catalyst]

Ummm no, time line is not "indisputable" whatsoever, especially when the earliest KNOWN copy is from the 4th century. Any bible scholar worth their salt will tell you that earlier does not always equate to better, and that Patristic references often times trump anything else.

My personal assessment is that younger copies simply had access to better source material and versions, and that the older copies may have been copying from a different, flawed version, either from a codex that had the last page dropped out, or deliberately dropped out because too many wannabe-Christians were experimenting with poison. Read the article.

Ok, add this, to corroborate her comments, in the early father's discussions on Trinity, some of those "added verses" would have REALLY REALLY helped their cases and made them easier to establish trinity.

And, yet, they didn't mention them.

And as best we know (granting we don't know what is lost and we haven't seen) the verses mentioning trinitarian type comments, ONLY appear after the doctrine was established, else they would have SURELY USED THEM WHEN MAKING THEIR CASE!

 

[savagewind]

The best definition I've seen of "TRUE CHRISTIAN" is, "You are not one, cause you don't agree with me!"

And I'm not meaning to rain on your parade here Pegg, I realize minus the term you have a good thought going here. But I don't think it can really get anywhere until the WHAT IS part is answered. First on CHRISTIAN, then on true...

What won't get anywhere before what is answered?

Is what needs answering 'what is a CHRISTIAN?' and 'what is true?'

You are talking to a Jehovah's Witness who is Pegg. They know what a Christian is and they know what is true.

 

[Xian Catalyst]

What won't get anywhere before what is answered?

Is what needs answering 'what is a CHRISTIAN?' and 'what is true?'

You are talking to a Jehovah's Witness who is Pegg. They know what a Christian is and they know what is true.

No offense S.W. but I haven't found any group that because of their denominational beliefs knew the truth on everything. In fact what i've found is the stronger the denominational claim is, the more stubborn and not easy to talk WITH they will be.

Pegg seems fine with me. Let's let her behavior and her words identify her and define her. Fair enough?