muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Nobody, I hope. I don't agree with anything on large scales..
..climate change is very real, remember?
Why are they poor in the first place?
Pride comes before a fall.
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If God existed would there be proof?
- Thread starter Trailblazer
- Start date
..climate change is very real, remember?
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Usury is not trade.
Money should not be regarded as a commodity to make a profit on.
Trade is when one exchanges money for goods, or goods for goods. Making an unreasonable profit from your fellow man is against "loving your brother as yourself".
Interest charges vary widely from card issuer to card issuer. Often, there are "teaser" rates or promotional APR in effect for initial periods of time (as low as zero percent for, say, six months), whereas regular rates can be as high as 40 percent.
Credit card - Wikipedia
It is a racket. When I was growing up,, the vast majority of people used to get their wages in cash weekly.
Now, we have large-scale global monopolies, which are effectively financial institutions .. they effectively control governments around the world.
When people are in debt, they should be helped and not driven into greater debt by exhorbitant interest rates.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Yes but think of the fun we will have foraging for food in small feral groups, through the ruins of civilisation. No more annoying science, or medicine, no electricity or technological gizmos, we can fashion clothes from the animals we kill, freeze around a fire in winter, and drop like flies of malaria and dysentery in the summer.
No more atheism, logic or philosophy, back the tribal shaman, and unbridled superstition, monsters hiding in every unseen germ.
No wonder he is keen to bring this cataclysm on. And of course greed will be settled there and then, probably with a sharp stick, fists or a blunt instrument. Best of all, no more usury.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Except superstition obviously..That's just rank whataboutism. I shan't even feign surprise you have ignored another question about your facile notions on usury.
Then I suggest you tread carefully.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Are you referring to me, or Mr. Putin?No wonder he is keen to bring this cataclysm on. And of course greed will be settled there and then, probably with a sharp stick, fists or a blunt instrument. Best of all, no more usury.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Well there will be plenty more homeless poor people to help, after you eradicate credit, and they can't borrow to buy a home or anything else. It'll be a riot I'm sure, since you're plan is to replace it with absolutely nothing.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
You of course, Putin's egregious actions are a fraction of the threat your idea poses.
JonSL
Member
there is proof. but we have to do the work. If you want to prove, beyond a doubt, that a surgical procedure is effective, you can take the time, study in college and medical school and become a surgeon. And then, when you engage that surgical procedure, you will have direct proof.
The religious analogy, according to the monastic community, is to engage prayer and religious disciplines at the level of a monastic...all day long, for years and years.
And that process, over time, allows one to understand the truth and proof.
But why would God necessarily allow proof of his existence, merely through some academic debate that could take only 5 minutes? Is it His responsibility, somehow, to make it that easy?
as far as proof goes?
The Vatican science council literally has hundreds of members who are Nobel Prize Winners in science.
A number of the greatest scientific minds in history believe in God.
That would include Ben Franklin, Isaac Newton, Nikolai Tesla and Albert Einstein.
And a book came out about 15 years ago, which studied belief in the scientific community. That book concluded that belief in God in the scientific community is about the same as the general public.
So. If science itself, as a discipline, easily dismissed belief in God and religion, you would only have a few fringe scientists who believed in God.
And, you have to remember, those folks are like us. They have gone through the same thoughts we have. How can you reconcile God’s existence with all the endless suffering.
They went through all the doubts and criticisms and their conclusions are that God exists.
Then, you have professional scientific studies that have confirmed the medical benefits of acupuncture, Hatha Yoga, and hypnotism. All those disciplines were created through spiritual experience and intuition, not through science. Yet science holds them as valid. So, that goes to some credence to the spiritual practices being able to produce proveable results.
And there have also been extensive scientific studies proving ESP.
And, whether they will admit it publicly or not, law enforcement has been using psychics in investigations for decades. And, for thousands of years, royal courts used psychics.
So, that is some evidence that science and faith are not in conflict.
The religious analogy, according to the monastic community, is to engage prayer and religious disciplines at the level of a monastic...all day long, for years and years.
And that process, over time, allows one to understand the truth and proof.
But why would God necessarily allow proof of his existence, merely through some academic debate that could take only 5 minutes? Is it His responsibility, somehow, to make it that easy?
as far as proof goes?
The Vatican science council literally has hundreds of members who are Nobel Prize Winners in science.
A number of the greatest scientific minds in history believe in God.
That would include Ben Franklin, Isaac Newton, Nikolai Tesla and Albert Einstein.
And a book came out about 15 years ago, which studied belief in the scientific community. That book concluded that belief in God in the scientific community is about the same as the general public.
So. If science itself, as a discipline, easily dismissed belief in God and religion, you would only have a few fringe scientists who believed in God.
And, you have to remember, those folks are like us. They have gone through the same thoughts we have. How can you reconcile God’s existence with all the endless suffering.
They went through all the doubts and criticisms and their conclusions are that God exists.
Then, you have professional scientific studies that have confirmed the medical benefits of acupuncture, Hatha Yoga, and hypnotism. All those disciplines were created through spiritual experience and intuition, not through science. Yet science holds them as valid. So, that goes to some credence to the spiritual practices being able to produce proveable results.
And there have also been extensive scientific studies proving ESP.
And, whether they will admit it publicly or not, law enforcement has been using psychics in investigations for decades. And, for thousands of years, royal courts used psychics.
So, that is some evidence that science and faith are not in conflict.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Utter nonsense. Not one citation in your entire post of outlandish claims either.
You demonstrated no evidence at all, you just made a long list of unevidenced claims?
JonSL
Member
just because I did cite references, does not mean I cannot cite references.
I was pre-med. Got into Cornell. Became a math major.
I was also a lab assistant in a pollution research project at Kean College in 1978.
I know how to professionally reference information.
It does not mean that I want to spend 2 hours in research, just to post a blurb online.
If you want some professional references for religion, you can find them through the Vatican science council, if you like.
I know Johns Hopkins once did a study on the effectiveness of prayer on cardiac patients.
If you want to contact them for details, feel free.
I was pre-med. Got into Cornell. Became a math major.
I was also a lab assistant in a pollution research project at Kean College in 1978.
I know how to professionally reference information.
It does not mean that I want to spend 2 hours in research, just to post a blurb online.
If you want some professional references for religion, you can find them through the Vatican science council, if you like.
I know Johns Hopkins once did a study on the effectiveness of prayer on cardiac patients.
If you want to contact them for details, feel free.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
It's not my idea, of course .. it is G-d's word.
The term "putinism" was first used in the article by Andrey Piontkovsky published on 11 January 2000 in Sovetskaya Rossiya and placed on the Yabloko website on the same day. He characterized putinism as "the highest and final stage of bandit capitalism in Russia, the stage where, as one half-forgotten classic said, the bourgeoisie throws the flag of the democratic freedoms and the human rights overboard; and also as a war, "consolidation" of the nation on the ground of hatred against some ethnic group, attack on freedom of speech and information brainwashing, isolation from the outside world and further economic degradation"
Putinism - Wikipedia
..and I'm the enemy?
I have no power .. I have no money .. all power is with G-d.
ppp
Well-Known Member
Sure it is. It is just not a form of trade you approve of.
ppp
Well-Known Member
Mmmm. Paradise.Yes but think of the fun we will have foraging for food in small feral groups, through the ruins of civilisation. No more annoying science, or medicine, no electricity or technological gizmos, we can fashion clothes from the animals we kill, freeze around a fire in winter, and drop like flies of malaria and dysentery in the summer.
No more atheism, logic or philosophy, back the tribal shaman, and unbridled superstition, monsters hiding in every unseen germ.
No wonder he is keen to bring this cataclysm on. And of course greed will be settled there and then, probably with a sharp stick, fists or a blunt instrument. Best of all, no more usury.
ppp
Well-Known Member
What he advocates for is akin the the emptying of Phnom Penh. People just don't learn.
"It's as good a guess as any" isn't exactly much to get people out of bed early on Sunday morning for church.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Yet you didn't, and have failed to do so again, very tellingly.
Well done. then you should be able to Google an appeal to authority fallacy.
I once drank 15 pints of Guinness in a single day, and walked home.
Ok, you prefer to make relentless unevidenced claims, and then double down with unevidenced claims about how well educated you claim to be, but tellingly don't see the lack of relevance.
If you want to see those claims of yours debunked, then you can google it.
Largest Study of Prayer to Date Finds It Has No Power to Heal...
Or you could show their peer reviewed findings, then explain why no single news channel is running the banner headline "prayer scientifically proven to work"?
Sheldon
Veteran Member
More importantly you haven't even the most basic grasp of economics, yet want to make strident claims that usury should be eradicated, even though that would destroy global economies, with no understanding of the consequences. The red herring of your Putin link is pretty funny though.
So when credit is destroyed, and currency becomes worthless, can you explain what system you are replacing it with? Or are we all to fight it out in the ruins of civilisation? I am starting to think that is your primary desire anyway, and the unfairness of usury is irrelevant.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
He doesn't even understand usury, judging from his posts.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
Those who don't learn from history, etc etc...