If We All Became Atheists?

[firedragon]

Everyone is born atheist. Some are taught to believe.

Research shows otherwise.

 

[firedragon]

Everyone is born without belief in gods

Can you show evidence? There's evidence to the contrary.

 

[Balthazzar]

We can find plenty of entirely made-up gods in fiction. They're still gods even though they're fictional.

Super hero's.

Honestly, I think Thor was a persona applied to thunder and Zues a persona applied to lightening, and stories were written about these personifications. This doesn't negate the possible attribution being applied to people who have lived. Jesus was the personification of a God, also. and understood by everyone to have been fully human, so applying the divine to people is common and I will presume an expected practice.

 

[PureX]

I disagree where it comes to critical thinkers who can’t form a positive opinion about religious claims due to them lacking evidence. They are further deemed implausible since their supernatural nature is something that isn’t observed as real.

Believers csn form positive opinions because they aren’t following evidence nor reasoning. Whatever they think is true and valid comes from a non -rational approach.

"Critical thinking" is a cognitive system that you have chosen to believe is "the pathway to truth". There were other options. You just didn't choose them. And now, having chosen this one, you are picking the "evidence" that springs from it, and that supports it, while you are rejecting any other evidence as being invalid because it did not spring from it, nor supports it. This is a clear case of confirmation bias. And it is commonplace within any number of possible cognitive systems of thought we might choose to adopt.

 

[Secret Chief]

I would say yes, they are vegetarian until indoctrinated ro meat by their parents

I think you're on thin ice here. As you know, we are born as omnivores.

 

[Secret Chief]

Would someone who eats nothing but dairy products be considered a vegetarian?

Rhetorical question?

Dairy-only is a vegetarian diet.

 

[England my lionheart]

What would be the pros and cons?

So the Ahmadi's concept of peace is to convert everyone to Islam and unite the Islamic world.
I was wondering if this would work for atheism?
Certainly not any forced conversion. Just a movement to evolve beyond religion.
Understanding atheism doesn't deny God. Atheism only recognizes man's ignorance about God.
What atheism does deny is all messengers of God. I suppose a few people might be reluctant to let go of their favored messengers.

IMO, there'd be nothing lost which couldn't be accomplished by other means.

My take on this is that the word of a god doesn’t come from a human.

 

[ChristineM]

I think you're on thin ice here. As you know, we are born as omnivores.

Yes but until an infant is given meat it is vegetarian.

 

[Secret Chief]

Yes but until an infant is given meat it is vegetarian.

Ok, but my point is that it is being claimed that we are born an atheist. By the same token we are born an omnivore.

 

[ChristineM]

Ok, but my point is that it is being claimed that we are born an atheist. By the same token we are born an omnivore.

Thanks, i thought you were against being born lacking belief in god or gods

 

[Secret Chief]

Thanks, i thought you were against being born lacking belief in god or gods

Ok now I'm confused. I just mean humans are evolved to be able to digest meat, dairy and plant food. Nothing to do with beliefs.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

But all you are saying here is that you cannot choose to believe something that you have already chosen not to believe. I agree. But I am pointing out to you that this is ALL YOUR CHOICE. Your "evidence" is just your justification for the choice you made. It's 'circular' reasoning. "I believe it is so because the evidence says it is so" - "The evidence says it is so because I believe the evidence is so".

No, that is not what I have ever said. I don't choose to believe the evidence the evidence convinces me or it does not convince me. I do not choose to believe the evidence or not. No one does.

"I believe that having no evidence that Bigfoot exists is evidence that Bigfoot does not exist". See? ... You are choosing both the evidence and the conclusion. This is circular reasoning. It's like saying, "I believe that God wrote the Bible because the Bible says that God wrote it and I believe what the Bible says. You are choosing both the evidence (the Bible) and the conclusion (that God wrote it) and then using the conclusion to justify the evidence, and the evidence to justify the conclusion.

No, that is flawed reasoning. I have never said this either. Lack of good evidence of the existence of bigfoot is only a good reason to not believe bigfoot exists, but is is not a good reason to believe bigfoot does not exist. Those are two different conclusions.

We need to step outside the prison cell of our own circular reasoning. No evidence of Bigfoot is just no evidence. It supports no conclusion. If we believe that no evidence proved there is no Bigfoot that is purely our choice. The Bible is not the evidence of it's own divinity unless we choose to believe that it is. The point here is that our belief is not reality or truth. It is simply our choosing to hold some idea up as being reality and truth.

AGAIN, I never said anything like this. Please read what I have actually said. I NEVER said our belief makes things true or untrue. This is the second time I have said this to you now.

It's a stupid question. Please stop asking it.

Why is it a stupid question? It is exactly what I am talking about. Can you believe the moon is made of cheese? If not, then that proves the point I am making.

 

[ChristineM]

Ok now I'm confused. I just mean humans are evolved to be able to digest meat, dairy and plant food. Nothing to do with beliefs.

You included atheism in your post i replied to that

 

[Secret Chief]

You included atheism in your post i replied to that

Ok I'm just going to have a beer now.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Nonsense.

I don't disagree with what you said. I just wanted you to see how it feels when someone calls what you say nonsense.

My mathematics Master at Pickering College in Newmarket, Ontario, where I went to high school, was the author of Canada's first "New Math" textbook. His name was Keith McLaren. He had two favourite expressions he used when students made egregious errors: "Horsefeathers, Sir!" and "Nonsense, Sir!"

I was, of course, the recipient of those assessments of my answers on several occasions.

I was never happier at any time in my life, than when I was attending that boys boarding school, and in fact I was quite fond of Mr. McLaren.

Old habits die hard.

 

[We Never Know]

Can you show evidence? There's evidence to the contrary.

Can you shown evidence a day, a week or a month old baby has belief in a god?

 

[PureX]

No, that is not what I have ever said. I don't choose to believe the evidence the evidence convinces me or it does not convince me. I do not choose to believe the evidence or not. No one does.

No, that is flawed reasoning. I have never said this either. Lack of good evidence of the existence of bigfoot is only a good reason to not believe bigfoot exists, but is is not a good reason to believe bigfoot does not exist. Those are two different conclusions.

AGAIN, I never said anything like this. Please read what I have actually said. I NEVER said our belief makes things true or untrue. This is the second time I have said this to you now.

For some reason you are refusing to take responsibility for your own beliefs. But that is not an issue for me to address.

I understand that facts are facts. But that is all they are. Whatever beliefs you are building them into is YOUR OWN DOING. So take responsibility for that, and wallah! You will magically realize that you are, in fact, in control of those beliefs.

 

[ChristineM]

Ok I'm just going to have a beer now.

I can have that effect on some people, enjoy.

 

[F1fan]

"Critical thinking" is a cognitive system that you have chosen to believe is "the pathway to truth".

What alternative cognitive system do you use to make this conclusion?

If critical thinking is flawed then what is better?

 

[Heyo]

Fair enough. I genuinely cannot recall who claimed it but I have previously been told on RF (by a self-identified atheist) that yes a rock is an atheist. I think it was said with a straight face.

That might have been me. I may be in the process of arguing myself out of that position.
It all depends on the exact formulation. As a counterargument to the category error, one could say that belief requires mental capacity, but non belief does not.