IN Hell there is no fire....just a separartion from Love

[Kingfrog]

I do not believe Hell is fire in a real sense for a few reasons the first being our nervous system is what allows us to feel the agony of pain. Souls are without body therefore without the physiology needed to feel pain. HOWEVER....the soul is where one feels LOVE. As far too few know there is no feeling like being in love. You cannot describe it in physiological terms yet it does affect our physiology. We cannot create that! WE CANNOT CREATE LOVE WE CANNOT DISMISS IT. It can only come from one place...LOVE. God is LOVE That is our existence in heaven......simply perpetual love. Now all of us can remember a time of the LOSS of LOVE. The separation of LOVE from your life though death or just permanent separation. That deep pain and personal agony is not physical and cannot be extinguished with any application to the physical body. All kinds of Substances can Cover it up awhile, one can sleep but upon the light of day it returns, it still there. The pain of separation.

That in my opinion is what Hell will be. Living in the pain of immediate separation from love.........which is God. A pain that cannot cease but though God's interference. Much deeper and painful than fire....



Comments?

 

[Scuba Pete]

Yeah, I think fire has been used as an allegory rather than as a reality.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

There are many folks who would agree with you. BTW, welcome to RF!

Some people also would elaborate by suggesting that this goes in line with the philosophy that the opposite of love isn't hate, but indifference. That, however, is perhaps most true in the eyes of the beholder. To the recipient, the opposite of joy, bliss, and comfort is most certainly pain and suffering.

What I would need is the answer to how capable is the love generated, offered, and received by humans? How does human/humane love qualify? And under what circumstances? If placing one's God's love toward oneself as the most important priority in helping to shape one's personal fate, of what importance does one place his or her own love toward others?

And, how can this be measured if there is any importance (God's love and/or human love)?

FWIW, my questions are entirely rhetorical, although I like to read other folks' answers if they are urged to indulge me.




Peace,
Mystic

 

[Katzpur]

Kingfrog,

This Mormon agrees with you.

 

[lunamoth]

I agree that being in the presence of God is being in the presence of perfect love, and if there is separation it comes not from God choosing to be apart from us, but us choosing to be apart from God, or more likely hanging on to things that keep us from entering into that perfect love.

Hellfire is metaphore, I think, but I think that our judgement will not so much come from God judging us, but from a kind of clarity from which we are spared during this life. The fire is clarity in understanding exactly how all of our actions have effected others, the suffering we've inflicted wittingly or unwittingly. And at the same time as seeing exactly how we've loved and failed to love others, we see how others have loved and failed to love us...total clarity on our fragility, our vulnerability, our selfishness, as well as our virtues. We will see exactly how we are all really one and we'll experience that knowledge of suffering as pain of separation...and at the same time healing and love.

 

[Kingfrog]

Even the least spiritual among us can understand the pain of fire. Thats why I believe it's ametaphor for the loss of love. We have all had the experience of the loss of love whether a girl or a life. The initial pain is....well I would rather die in a fire becasue at least it will stop hurting when I'm dead....

The soul however never dies and could be in that pain of separation from love (God) for an eternity. That's why I need so much to seek and find God' I have seen Him work in my life many times, Yet I have a constant battle with intellect which is the spiritual Devil (suffering soul) This spirit uses intellect to deny my belief as it attempted with Jesus. And as we all know misery LOVEs company. I fight this everyday which I guess is why God lead me to the Book A Case for Faith and this very forum.........

Thank You God................................again.

 

[Sunstone]

Both heaven and hell are metaphors. But so is God.

 

[Katzpur]

Both heaven and hell are metaphors. But so is God.

What is God a metaphor for, Phil?

 

[Kingfrog]

What is God a metaphor for, Phil?

That was my question.

In my 50 years of doubt and seeking experience I have found those who do not believe in God are more self involved and extraordinarily proud of their their own intellect. Which in itself flies in the face of an open mind which can only be filled with more intelligence and wisdom.

 

[Sunstone]

What is God a metaphor for, Phil?

So far as I can figure it out, Katz, God is a metaphor for a kind of awareness in which there is no division between subject and object. Among other things, when there is no division between subject and object in perception there is a perception, sense, or feeling of "Oneness". Some people choose to call that Oneness, God.

 

[Sunstone]

In my 50 years of doubt and seeking experience I have found those who do not believe in God are more self involved and extraordinarily proud of their their own intellect. Which in itself flies in the face of an open mind which can only be filled with more intelligence and wisdom.

Pure bunk. In my 51 years of casually and occasionally noticing things about people, I've seen that some of the nicest, most generous, loving, and compassionate people I've met have been atheists and agnostics. I have also seen that people who demonize atheists and agnostics are usually petty little jerks.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I have also seen that people who demonize atheists and agnostics are usually petty little jerks.

Extraordinary. The same can be said about those who vilify theists.

 

[Sunstone]

Extraordinary. The same can be said about those who vilify theists.

Of course. Although I think the issue is more one of demonization and not mere vilification.

 

[logician]

I do not believe Hell is fire in a real sense for a few reasons the first being our nervous system is what allows us to feel the agony of pain. Souls are without body therefore without the physiology needed to feel pain. HOWEVER....the soul is where one feels LOVE. As far too few know there is no feeling like being in love. You cannot describe it in physiological terms yet it does affect our physiology. We cannot create that! WE CANNOT CREATE LOVE WE CANNOT DISMISS IT. It can only come from one place...LOVE. God is LOVE That is our existence in heaven......simply perpetual love. Now all of us can remember a time of the LOSS of LOVE. The separation of LOVE from your life though death or just permanent separation. That deep pain and personal agony is not physical and cannot be extinguished with any application to the physical body. All kinds of Substances can Cover it up awhile, one can sleep but upon the light of day it returns, it still there. The pain of separation.

That in my opinion is what Hell will be. Living in the pain of immediate separation from love.........which is God. A pain that cannot cease but though God's interference. Much deeper and painful than fire....



Comments?

What I want to know is where is all this godly LOVE we are being separated from. Take a look around you, you are living in dream world.

 

[agent_smith]

Wake up call!

Hell is fictional.

 

[Sunstone]

Wake up call!

Hell is fictional.

Have you read the thread?

 

[Kingfrog]

Pure bunk. In my 51 years of casually and occasionally noticing things about people, I've seen that some of the nicest, most generous, loving, and compassionate people I've met have been atheists and agnostics. I have also seen that people who demonize atheists and agnostics are usually petty little jerks.

I said nothing of compassion,niceness,generous, loving and all other wonderful human attributes. I do find those who depend solely on their own logical intellect more closed minded. Not only do they refuse to even seek an answer, they flat out deny it based on their own intellect which they hold in high regard. IN such high regard that they do not even seek another truth other than their own. It takes a lot of seeking to find God. Its easy to dismiss His existence, My dog can and does do that!

That said its far easier to disprove God's existence based on limited understanding to those people. I do not see anyone demonizing atheists and agnostics. Except when they oppose those who do believe the right to pray in a public building.

 

[Kingfrog]

Pure bunk. In my 51 years of casually and occasionally noticing things about people, I've seen that some of the nicest, most generous, loving, and compassionate people I've met have been atheists and agnostics. I have also seen that people who demonize atheists and agnostics are usually petty little jerks.

I said nothing of compassion,niceness,generous, loving and all other wonderful human attributes of non believers!! I do find those who do not believe and who depend solely on their own logical intellect more closed minded to what cannot be seen or understood by them becasue its beyond "logical comprehension". Not only do they refuse to even seek an answer, they flat out deny it based on their own intellect which they hold in high regard.

That said its far easier to disprove God's existence based on limited understanding to those people. I do not see anyone demonizing atheists and agnostics. Except when they oppose those who do believe the right to pray in a public building.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Of course. Although I think the issue is more one of demonization and not mere vilification.

It still goes both ways. There is a continual condescension by many theists and atheists more than either vilification or demonizing. That is, it's a general intolerance by many of each side for the beliefs of the other side.

It's epidemic and we should take care to not exacerbate the situation.

 

[Scuba Pete]

What I want to know is where is all this godly LOVE we are being separated from. Take a look around you, you are living in dream world.

Karma... you get back what you put in. I am surrounded by love. I wonder why you seem to be surrounded by hate?