Is belief in ghosts compatible with the Christian faith, or other religions?

[fallingblood]

Try reading for comprehension, they don't believe in ghosts, they believe in demons, they forbid seances etc. because they believe demons will be summoned, NOT earthly spirits.

So you're not going to provide any sources?

Also, unless you can prove that they forbid seances for the reason you stated, then it means nothing. The Spiritualist movement certainly would disagree with you.

 

[logician]

Why don't you take your own advice and read AND comprehend for once? Your name is quite the oxymoron when people take into account your posts and arguments, you know that? :areyoucra It was quite clear that Samuel was NOT a demon. He was a spirit in earthly form...a ghost. And unless you claim that Moses and Elijah were demons, and Jesus made a habit of conversing with demons in the presence of god...then they were ghosts too. You really are a brickwall aren't you?

Speaking of illogical, you make the same irrelevant post over and over, and it proves NOTHING about the compatibility of ghost believing-with Christianity. Moses and Elijaah weren't ghosts haunting houses, it was a supposed communion of prophets. The other reference was OT, not a reference to Christianity, and certainly says nothing about the current state of ghost belief and Christianity.:sleep:

 

[logician]

So you're not going to provide any sources?

Also, unless you can prove that they forbid seances for the reason you stated, then it means nothing. The Spiritualist movement certainly would disagree with you.

"
This warning was not always heeded: King Saul has the Witch of Endor invoke the shade of Samuel, from Sheol, using a magical amulet, for example. Later Christian writers rejected the idea that humans could bring back the spirits of the dead, and interpreted such shades as disguised demons, thus conflating necromancy with demon-summoning."

"Many medieval writers believed resurrection was impossible without the assistance of the Christian God. They translated the practice of divination as conjuring demons who took the appearance of spirits. The practice became known explicitly as demonic magic and was condemned by the Roman Catholic Church.[9] Though the practitioners of necromancy were linked by many common threads, there is no evidence that these necromancers were ever organized as a group."
"
Necromancy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
:sleep:http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/#cite_note-14

 

[Draka]

So, let's get this straight. Your argument is, yes, it did happen in the bible that way, it was written that way...BUT...some people later on DECIDED that they didn't like what it flat out said and DECIDED to INTERPRET it completely differently so that it would mean something else entirely and that something else entirely agrees with you, so you win, neener neener neener?


And WHY are you stuck on the haunted house thing anyway? Your whole argument was originally based on the belief in the existence of ghosts. Ghosts. Flat out...ghosts. Not where the ghosts may be. If the existence of ghosts is acknowledged then why does their location matter?

 

[logician]

And WHY are you stuck on the haunted house thing anyway? Your whole argument was originally based on the belief in the existence of ghosts. Ghosts. Flat out...ghosts. Not where the ghosts may be. If the existence of ghosts is acknowledged then why does their location matter?

Belief in ghosts in this case case applied to earth-bound ghosts, since that's the only place people might "perceive" them, either in haunted houses or elsewhere. We're not talking about ghosts in outer space here.

 

[Draka]

No, we're talking about ghosts...period. If ghosts exist then where else would we see them except where we live? Earth. If ghosts exist then it would stand to reason they exist no matter where they are...whether on a hill, in a graveyard, at a seance, or in a house. Since the bible acknowledges the existence of ghosts in both the OT and the NT then why does it matter where a ghost is? The point would be that they exist.

By your standards, if a Christian outright saw a ghostly apparition in a house...they could no longer be a Christian anymore since belief in ghosts and Christianity are "incompatible"? What about "knowledge" of ghosts and Christianity? What if one knew for a fact that ghosts exist, would it then negate all that is Christianity simply because you think they are "incompatible"?

 

[fallingblood]

"
This warning was not always heeded: King Saul has the Witch of Endor invoke the shade of Samuel, from Sheol, using a magical amulet, for example. Later Christian writers rejected the idea that humans could bring back the spirits of the dead, and interpreted such shades as disguised demons, thus conflating necromancy with demon-summoning."

"Many medieval writers believed resurrection was impossible without the assistance of the Christian God. They translated the practice of divination as conjuring demons who took the appearance of spirits. The practice became known explicitly as demonic magic and was condemned by the Roman Catholic Church.[9] Though the practitioners of necromancy were linked by many common threads, there is no evidence that these necromancers were ever organized as a group."
"
Necromancy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
:sleep:http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/#cite_note-14

This states that it is incompatible how? It states that the Roman Catholic Church forbid something they believed in. Not saying it is incompatible.

More so, your source suggests that the belief in zombies is compatible with Christianity. The belief in spirits (who, unbeknownst to the conjurer, are demons) is compatible. Also, the belief in necromancers, witches, demon conjurers, magicians, etc are compatible, but ghosts aren't?

 

[logician]

No, we're talking about ghosts...period. If ghosts exist then where else would we see them except where we live? Earth. If ghosts exist then it would stand to reason they exist no matter where they are...whether on a hill, in a graveyard, at a seance, or in a house. Since the bible acknowledges the existence of ghosts in both the OT and the NT then why does it matter where a ghost is? The point would be that they exist.

By your standards, if a Christian outright saw a ghostly apparition in a house...they could no longer be a Christian anymore since belief in ghosts and Christianity are "incompatible"? What about "knowledge" of ghosts and Christianity? What if one knew for a fact that ghosts exist, would it then negate all that is Christianity simply because you think they are "incompatible"?

The point is not whether they do exist, or someone believes they exist, the point is whether the belief itself is compatible with the mainstream Christian beliefs of heaven and hell. It isn't.

BTW Purgatory isn't ghosts haunting a house, it's more like "hell lite":

"Pain and fire
Purgatory is a cleansing that involves painful temporal punishment, associated with the idea of fire such as is associated with the idea of the eternal punishment of hell.[31] Several Church Fathers regarded 1 Corinthians 3:10-15 as evidence for the existence of an intermediate state in which the dross of lighter transgressions will be burnt away, and the soul thus purified will be saved.[31] Fire was the Bible-inspired image ("We went through fire and through water")[32] that Christians used for the notion of after-life purification"

And more to the point:

"In 1999 Pope John Paul II declared that the term Purgatory does not indicate a place, but "a condition of existence".[16]"

which goes against the notion that purgatory could be human spirits residing on earth.


:sleep:

 

[logician]

This states that it is incompatible how? It states that the Roman Catholic Church forbid something they believed in. Not saying it is incompatible.

Actually, it doesn't, they believe anything summoned to be a demon, not a human spirit residing on earth.

 

[Draka]

The point is not whether they do exist, or someone believes they exist, the point is whether the belief itself is compatible with the mainstream Christian beliefs of heaven and hell. It isn't.

BTW Purgatory isn't ghosts haunting a house, it's more like "hell lite":

"Pain and fire
Purgatory is a cleansing that involves painful temporal punishment, associated with the idea of fire such as is associated with the idea of the eternal punishment of hell.[31] Several Church Fathers regarded 1 Corinthians 3:10-15 as evidence for the existence of an intermediate state in which the dross of lighter transgressions will be burnt away, and the soul thus purified will be saved.[31] Fire was the Bible-inspired image ("We went through fire and through water")[32] that Christians used for the notion of after-life purification"

And more to the point:

"In 1999 Pope John Paul II declared that the term Purgatory does not indicate a place, but "a condition of existence".[16]"

which goes against the notion that purgatory could be human spirits residing on earth.


:sleep:

I never said purgatory was ghosts residing on Earth :areyoucra . There you go, making stuff up again or do you really have that much of a problem with reading comprehension?

And you can say that it's not compatible until your lips turn olive green and develop wings...doesn't mean you're right. It means that you keep changing your meanings and moving your goalposts and ignoring the facts. Not a surprise coming from you though. Just par for the course really.

 

[logician]

I never said purgatory was ghosts residing on Earth :areyoucra . There you go, making stuff up again or do you really have that much of a problem with reading comprehension?

And you can say that it's not compatible until your lips turn olive green and develop wings...doesn't mean you're right. It means that you keep changing your meanings and moving your goalposts and ignoring the facts. Not a surprise coming from you though. Just par for the course really.

I didn't say you brought up purgatory, fallingblood did:

"Fallingblood 4/21 11:05

Have you ever looked into what those believers think about ghosts?

Catholics have purgatory. Some believe that purgatory is here on Earth, and that explains ghosts. Completely compatible. ":sleep:

...

 

[fallingblood]

I didn't say you brought up purgatory, fallingblood did:

"Fallingblood 4/21 11:05

Have you ever looked into what those believers think about ghosts?

Catholics have purgatory. Some believe that purgatory is here on Earth, and that explains ghosts. Completely compatible. ":sleep:

...

So then it had nothing to do with what Draka said, and basically, not a refutation at all.

 

[Crypto2015]

I have already discussed this. The fact that evolution can explain the origin of morality does not justify our moral principles. Do you eat as much fat as you can? Trying to eat as much fat as you can is also a psychological trait derived from evolution. However, no one in his right mind would say that eating as much fat as you can is reasonable.