Is Bill O'Reilly correct about the African-American culture and race?

[InformedIgnorance]

People blame society's problems on everyone else, while their greed and unethical actions go unchecked.

Corrected. It is hardly whites alone, so many groups do this - the lovely self-serving, self-righteous, ethnocentric perception of reality driven by maximizing one's own condition.

 

[tumbleweed41]

Or, if you blame social problems on a single race, you are racist or bigot, or both.


It is a typical ploy to blame social ills on the "other". Throughout American history, those who wish to control the masses find a scapegoat to focus attention away from the real issues.
Past scapegoats have been, blacks, Irish, Catholics, Chinese, American Indians, Mexicans, immigrants in general, Italians, Socialists, Muslims, etc, etc, etc...

Whites blame society's problems on everyone else, while their greed and unethical actions go unchecked.

See what you did there?
Making a gross over-generalization of 'whites' puts you on the same level as those I was speaking of.

 

[Revoltingest]

Whites blame society's problems on everyone else...

We do? Don't be hate'n & generaliz'n about us.
I'm one, & I've long been blaming fellow white folk for consequences of their shortcomings.
But black folk deserve some blame too.
We can't take the simplistic Spike Lee view they're above criticism, & have no responsibility for their own difficulties.
Ain't nobody perfect.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

I never said that other races aren't responsible for their own wrong actions. If it seemed that I implied this, that wasn't my intention. But white people have a sense of superiority, and it's ingrained into our minds. Most of us do well to ignore it and not act on it, but it is there, no matter how subtle.

History is always the great teacher. Whites brought blacks over as slaves, and even after they finally gained their freedom, it was still an uphill battle. Even after desegregation, they still have to fight twice as hard as we do to accomplish anything. They've been kept down for so long, by us, that it's become part of their psyche. Most whites and blacks are well-meaning, hard working, honest people, who could care less about divisions between the races, and have no real issue living next to each other. Even still, there's still this degree of separation between the two. Blacks aren't responsible for any of our problems, especially as a race, however, we're at least partly responsible for theirs. This doesn't absolve them from their unwholesome actions, but it doesn't mean we're guilt-free either.

As such, black people live in a perpetual state of limbo, always having to look over their shoulders to see who's watching. They have to settle for menial jobs, poor housing, with almost no hope of a better future. Meanwhile, whites don't have to deal with the same types of things, at least not on the scale that black people do. Why are the prisons filled with blacks? Because they see no other way to gain. The Buddha said that crime is caused mainly by poverty. Blacks, due to the fact that they have a much harder time accomplishing greater things than whites, are at a much greater risk of living in poverty. So some see crime as the only alternative, because they haven't been given much else of a choice.

What about the whites, and their crimes? Extortion, money laundering, tax evasion-what's generally labeled as "white collar" crimes. And these are hardly prosecuted. Whites have a much easier time getting away with crimes of a much higher caliber. Whites even have a better chance of getting off on a minor crime that blacks wouldn't stand a chance of escaping.

I'll stand by my statement. History, psychology, and statistics substantiates it.

 

[LuisDantas]

If O'Reilly were a serious man, rather than just a TV pundit, he would have mentioned that a main reason so few Black families have a father is the war on drugs.

Uh? How so?

He would also have used in his little speech far fewer logical fallacies. But one cannot expect much of a pundit.

I wouldn't trust O'Reiily's judgement if my life depended on it (come to think of it, particularly if it did), but he may be right even while being dishonest in his omissions and biases here.

 

[LuisDantas]

Those put in prison by the 'war on drugs' are disproportionately people of colour, thus the war on drugs contributes quite significantly to children of colour being raised by a single parent or by a guardian.

Though call. There is probably a lot to that, but what is one to do?

 

[YmirGF]

Though call. There is probably a lot to that, but what is one to do?

It's sort of like a variation of the chicken and the egg. Drug use and selling was epidemic before the so-called "war on drugs". Do you start a 10 Trillion dollar drug rehab program?

 

[LuisDantas]

It's sort of like a variation of the chicken and the egg. Drug use and selling was epidemic before the so-called "war on drugs". Do you start a 10 Trillion dollar drug rehab program?

Excuse me? I don't follow. I feel that I simply do not know something relevant that you are assuming that I know already.



On a related note, I was thinking about Sunstone's previous post on this matter.

It seems to me that if arresting a parent due to (real or perceived) involvement with drug trade is by no means a good thing, it hardly follows that drug enforcement should be deemphasized.

For one thing, leaving aside the mishandling that may happen, it is not like having free parents that deal with drug trade or use is something to be tolerated.

It seems to me that racism is however something of a self-fulfilling prophecy; people who are mistrusted and marginalized will of course turn to drugs and other crime to a greater degree than those who are promptly accepted by society.

So yes, Bill O'Reilly is a racist idiot and a hypocrite, but it does not follow that this specific statement of his is _wrong_.

 

[Falvlun]

Ain't nobody perfect.

That's the take home message. Black people do bad things and white people do bad things. The point though is that black people don't do bad things because they are black, just like white people don't do bad things just because they are white.

 

[Revoltingest]

That's the take home message. Black people do bad things and white people do bad things. The point though is that black people don't do bad things because they are black, just like white people don't do bad things just because they are white.

True dat.

 

[LuisDantas]

That's the take home message. Black people do bad things and white people do bad things. The point though is that black people don't do bad things because they are black, just like white people don't do bad things just because they are white.

Yes... but isn't it also true to some degree that people may be pushed into crime and other bad behavior due to social and racial expectations?

 

[YmirGF]

Excuse me? I don't follow. I feel that I simply do not know something relevant that you are assuming that I know already.

Apparently so, Luis.

It seems to me that if arresting a parent due to (real or perceived) involvement with drug trade is by no means a good thing, it hardly follows that drug enforcement should be deemphasized.

Exactly. What I was meaning is that drug use and selling of drugs was already epidemic when the "war on drugs" festivities began. It was a response, though not a very good one, to an existing problem. Though the "war on drugs" has probably aggravated the existing problems there is still little effort to combat the underlying circumstances behind drug abuse. The thing is, as you intimated, how do you fix this? Hence, my suggestion of a $10,000,000,000,000 drug rehab program (nation-wide).

It seems to me that racism is however something of a self-fulfilling prophecy; people who are mistrusted and marginalized will of course turn to drugs and other crime to a greater degree than those who are promptly accepted by society.

Especially when doing so is the easier, though much more risky approach to financial stability. If you are thinking about selling heroin to buy dinner, you probably already have larger problems than drugs and ethics. What role does ones personal attitude have to play in all this? For example, how do you get to the place that says selling heroin or crack cocaine is OK?

So yes, Bill O'Reilly is a racist idiot and a hypocrite, but it does not follow that this specific statement of his is _wrong_.

I agree. Though O'Bill is pretty far down my list of go-to people... in fact, he's not on this list, at all... there is some truth in what he is saying. In many ways he is as guilty of spinning things or ginning things up, as Obama is.

 

[ignition]

Those put in prison by the 'war on drugs' are disproportionately people of colour, thus the war on drugs contributes quite significantly to children of colour being raised by a single parent or by a guardian.

That's true but who's fault is that? Blacks should not be dealing with drugs when they know it's illegal and harmful. Also, like O'Reilly said, young black guys are TEN times more likely to commit a crime than whites and hispanics combined, I think it kind of puts things into perspective and it is understandable why Zimmerman decided to follow Trayvon. I don't agree with O'Reilly 95% of the time, but I think he's spot on here.

 

[ignition]

You cannot just turn a blind eye to a culture of crime and drugs. Black Americans do have some cultural issues that need to be sorted out, otherwise they will never progress.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

That's true but who's fault is that? Blacks should not be dealing with drugs when they know it's illegal and harmful. Also, like O'Reilly said, young black guys are TEN times more likely to commit a crime than whites and hispanics combined, I think it kind of puts things into perspective and it is understandable why Zimmerman decided to follow Trayvon. I don't agree with O'Reilly 95% of the time, but I think he's spot on here.

Not ten times more likely to commit a crime; ten times more likely to get locked up for it. That's a prime example of how O'Reilly twists statistics to promote his racist agenda.

 

[YmirGF]

Not ten times more likely to commit a crime; ten times more likely to get locked up for it. That's a prime example of how O'Reilly twists statistics to promote his racist agenda.

That may be, but it's not like O'Bill is the only one messing with statistics, now, is it?

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

That may be, but it's not like O'Bill is the only one messing with statistics, now, is it?

He's definitely not the only person that does it. I just call out bull **** when I see it, and at that moment it was coming from that "evidence" for Bill O'Reilly's hate speech.

 

[ignition]

Not ten times more likely to commit a crime; ten times more likely to get locked up for it. That's a prime example of how O'Reilly twists statistics to promote his racist agenda.

Fair point. But still, TEN times more likely to be imprisoned? That's an off-the-charts ratio. The judicial system might be biased against blacks, but they cannot be so biased as to produce a ridiculous ratio like that. That's an unforgivable number of young black guys being locked up, they need to take a long hard look what the hell they're doing.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Fair point. But still, TEN times more likely to be imprisoned? That's an off-the-charts ratio. The judicial system might be biased against blacks, but they cannot be so biased as to produce a ridiculous ratio like that. That's an unforgivable number of young black guys being locked up, they need to take a long hard look what the hell they're doing.

I'm in no way saying that the people being arrested aren't at fault (although some of them actually aren't), but there is definitely a racial bias from law enforcement. And yes, it is possible to be racist enough to get that ratio, because it's happening as we speak.

 

[YmirGF]

I'm in no way saying that the people being arrested aren't at fault (although some of them actually aren't), but there is definitely a racial bias from law enforcement. And yes, it is possible to be racist enough to get that ratio, because it's happening as we speak.

C'mon... if you know that one particular group, say Latvian Lesbian Midgets was prone to a particular activity, if you encountered such people would you not stop them to check what they were doing? Is that unreasonable? Is it unfair to go with what the stats already indicate is a problem area? Is it unethical to target that area? :sorry1: