Is Community a Part of Your Belief or Faith?

[SalixIncendium]

If your world view does not include a way of living, it’s an incomplete world view.

Not the point. One's worldview might include a way of living, but the question posed in the thread is whether or not this requires community.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Is your world no larger than you?

This depends on how one might perceive their temporal world based on one's experiences.

 

[SalixIncendium]

What are you ingesting, if not other living things? Or are not part of the community?

Right. I get that part. But does your world view (how you fit into the world) include other people who are also in the world?

(And the bulk of the rest of your posts ITT.)

Again, we're clearly confusing "community" with "society."

 

[sojourner]

Not the point. One's worldview might include a way of living, but the question posed in the thread is whether or not this requires community.

At its most basic level, one’s religion is how one lives within one’s world view. My contention is that one cannot have a world view that doesn’t take under consideration other people, for the world does contain other people.

 

[sojourner]

This depends on how one might perceive their temporal world based on one's experiences.

And yet, the world is necessarily larger than just the individual. Even a baby recognizes that. And one’s religion is, by definition, how one makes meaning of that world.

 

[sojourner]

Again, we're clearly confusing "community" with "society."

“Community” wasn’t defined at the outset. Nonetheless, a society is, by definition, community.

 

[stvdv]

Help me to understand why this is needed in some belief structures.

Great Saints live secluded in the Himalayas. This proves that Masters do not need a community. Community is needed for those who are in need.

 

[SalixIncendium]

At its most basic level, one’s religion is how one lives within one’s world view. My contention is that one cannot have a world view that doesn’t take under consideration other people, for the world does contain other people.

"Worldview" has be defined and redefined in this thread as one's conception or views. One can choose to live with within the confines of those conceptions or not (I know many who follow organized religion that do not). One's worldview does not necessarily define how one lives.

And yet, the world is necessarily larger than just the individual. Even a baby recognizes that.

You are, again, making a statement based on your experiences (and perhaps this baby you know) and not mine.

And one’s religion is, by definition, how one makes meaning of that world.

Again, no. I know many that go to church on Sunday (or simply do not even though their religion directs it) that sing the Lord's praises, step over the threshold of the church's door after the service and behave hypocritically.

“Community” wasn’t defined at the outset. Nonetheless, a society is, by definition, community.

Though community wasn't given a hard definition in the OP, the context was clear that its intended definition had to do with a group with similar worldviews, beliefs, or religion, and it was given a specific definition on page two of this thread, thus negating everything you wrote after the word "nonetheless."

But to break it down even further for you, the root word of community is commune. Below is the dictionary definition of the verb:

com·mune2
/kəˈmyo͞on/
verb
verb: commune; 3rd person present: communes; past tense: communed; past participle: communed; gerund or present participle: communing

1. share one's intimate thoughts or feelings with (someone or something), especially when the exchange is on a spiritual level.
   "the purpose of praying is to commune with God"
   synonyms: communicate, speak, talk, converse, interface More
2. feel in close spiritual contact with.
   "he spent an hour communing with nature on the bank of a stream"
   synonyms: empathize with, identify with, have a rapport with, feel at one with;

https://www.google.com/search?q=com...rome..69i57.1755j0j9&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

This is the intended usage of the word community in the previous post.

 

[sojourner]

One's worldview does not necessarily define how one lives

That’s not what I said, though. One always lives in the world that one perceives. One’s world view doesn’t necessarily define how one lives. But it does inform one’s perception.

You are, again, making a statement based on your experiences (and perhaps this baby you know) and not mine

No, I’m making a statement based on what we know of developmental psychology.

Again, no. I know many that go to church on Sunday (or simply do not even though their religion directs it) that sing the Lord's praises, step over the threshold of the church's door after the service and behave hypocritically

Again, so what? “Making meaning” and “behavior” are two different things.

Though community wasn't given a hard definition in the OP, the context was clear that its intended definition had to do with a group with similar worldviews, beliefs, or religion, and it was given a specific definition on page two of this thread, thus negating everything you wrote after the word "nonetheless."

Here (from Google):
com·mu·ni·ty
/kəˈmyo͞onədē/
noun

1. 1.
   a group of people living in the same place or having a particular characteristic in common.
   
   so·ci·e·ty
   /səˈsīədē/
   noun
   1. 1.
      the aggregate of people living together in a more or less ordered community.
      
      Notice how the word “community” appears in the definition for “society.” Thus, by definition, a society is community.

 

[SalixIncendium]

That’s not what I said, though. One always lives in the world that one perceives. One’s world view doesn’t necessarily define how one lives. But it does inform one’s perception.

No, I’m making a statement based on what we know of developmental psychology.

Again, so what? “Making meaning” and “behavior” are two different things.


Here (from Google):
com·mu·ni·ty
/kəˈmyo͞onədē/
noun

1. 1.
   a group of people living in the same place or having a particular characteristic in common.
   
   so·ci·e·ty
   /səˈsīədē/
   noun
   1. 1.
      the aggregate of people living together in a more or less ordered community.
      
      Notice how the word “community” appears in the definition for “society.” Thus, by definition, a society is community.

I've defined and redefined for you both the terms "worldview" and "community" using dictionary definitions for the purpose of this thread. Since you are clearly here stubbornly inject your own dictionary definitions and argue based on those rather than contribute something useful to the actual topic presented by the OP, we can be done now.

 

[Rival]

A community is a subset of a society... so of course society and community are tied together in this way, but not the same thing.

 

[sojourner]

I've defined and redefined for you both the terms "worldview" and "community" using dictionary definitions for the purpose of this thread. Since you are clearly here stubbornly inject your own dictionary definitions and argue based on those rather than contribute something useful to the actual topic presented by the OP, we can be done now.

IOW, “I clearly did not win the argument, so I’m going to blame it all on you, pick up my marbles, and go home.”

I’m “stubbornly injecting” dictionary definitions so we can all come to a clear understanding of what we’re talking about. If you don’t want to be clear, that’s your problem, not mine. A society is, by definition, community. So your argument that we’re talking about society, not community is a bogus argument. My intention here is to get the OP to see the bigger picture of what constitutes community, because I think that, that way, the poster might be able to better answer her/his own question. I’m not sure, in the grand scheme, that we are able to separate our beliefs from a world view that clearly includes other people.

 

[sojourner]

A community is a subset of a society... so of course society and community are tied together in this way, but not the same thing.

Since religion is generally a cultural expression, I’d say that, generally, religion includes community, as it’s an outgrowth of community, in several different ways.

 

[Rival]

Since religion is generally a cultural expression, I’d say that, generally, religion includes community, as it’s an outgrowth of community, in several different ways.

Yes, I would agree. I was just using my faith and others as counterexamples as faiths that do not require community.

 

[sojourner]

Yes, I would agree. I was just using my faith and others as counterexamples as faiths that do not require community.

Your use of the word “require” is interesting. I suppose it would depend on what you mean by “require.” I would argue that, while no others may be necessary to perform ritual, to formulate and put into practice belief, to identify core tenets and motivations for some religious systems, those systems do, on some level, depend upon community, because each individual is inexorably part of some community, whether it be a tightly-defined and identifiably unique grouping, or a very broad identification, such as “member fo the human race.” Additionally, because each is part of some community, that community acts as a reflector of the individual to that individual — even if the individual is a “loner.” S/he still identifies and defines her or himself based upon such a community, and that identity and definition inform and influence religious belief/practice, if even on an intuitive, or even genetic level. IOW, I don’t think one can escape the human community on every level that affects one. Therefore, I’d conclude that community — as an inseparable aspect of one — is “required” on some level for all religious expressions.

But, that being said, I’d also say that my first sentence is also true: some religious expressions do not require a tightly defined community of like-practicing people in order to function, at least externally.

 

[Rival]

Your use of the word “require” is interesting. I suppose it would depend on what you mean by “require.” I would argue that, while no others may be necessary to perform ritual, to formulate and put into practice belief, to identify core tenets and motivations for some religious systems, those systems do, on some level, depend upon community, because each individual is inexorably part of some community, whether it be a tightly-defined and identifiably unique grouping, or a very broad identification, such as “member fo the human race.” Additionally, because each is part of some community, that community acts as a reflector of the individual to that individual — even if the individual is a “loner.” S/he still identifies and defines her or himself based upon such a community, and that identity and definition inform and influence religious belief/practice, if even on an intuitive, or even genetic level. IOW, I don’t think one can escape the human community on every level that affects one. Therefore, I’d conclude that community — as an inseparable aspect of one — is “required” on some level for all religious expressions.

But, that being said, I’d also say that my first sentence is also true: some religious expressions do not require a tightly defined community of like-practicing people in order to function, at least externally.

I refer to my original point that, in order to follow my particular faith, others are not required. Others are not required for a G-d belief, or the ability to follow the Laws, albeit some will not be applicable.

 

[bobhikes]

Can you believe in G-d on a desert island?

There you go.

The isolation from community will drive you crazy. There are plenty of scientific studies that support this.

 

[bobhikes]

I think you are confusing the terms "community" and "society." They are not the same.

How do you define community? For me it could be a family, a club, or a religion and I have a very loose definition for family.

 

[Rival]

The isolation from community will drive you crazy. There are plenty of scientific studies that support this.

Yes but that's not the point. The point is that it is possible to believe in G-d without other people. We agree on this!

 

[bobhikes]

*points to custom title* (the one below my username)

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You have some need of community. You aren't a hermit all the time.