Is God so disgusting and irrational?

[OtherSheep]

QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5775736, member: 59463"
the religion of Catholicism is contained in the catechism of the Catholic Church.
[/QUOTE
++++++
Catechism of the Catholic Church - Man

"I. WHERE SIN ABOUNDED, GRACE ABOUNDED ALL THE MORE ... Original sin - an essential truth of the faith"

That's Saul of Tarsus, straight up.

Which explains why you don't follow the Testament of God.

++++++
QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5775901, member: 59463"]
I also don't follow the disgusting Old Testament!
[/QUOTE
++++++

Isaiah 29:13 "And the Lord has said, 'This people draw nigh to Me with their mouth, and they honour Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me: but in vain do they worship Me, teaching the commandments and doctrines of men.'"

++++++
QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5775901, member: 59463"]
I don't worship idols, so you're very long post was totally pointless.
[/QUOTE
++++++

"In communion with the holy Mother of God"
Catechism of the Catholic Church - The way of prayer



The point of my "very long post" was to see what you "catholic religion" guys believe.
If you're an example of what's coming from Rome... thanx for the heads up.

 

[Spiderman]

QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5775736, member: 59463"
the religion of Catholicism is contained in the catechism of the Catholic Church.
[/QUOTE
++++++
Catechism of the Catholic Church - Man

"I. WHERE SIN ABOUNDED, GRACE ABOUNDED ALL THE MORE ... Original sin - an essential truth of the faith"

That's Saul of Tarsus, straight up.

Which explains why you don't follow the Testament of God.



Isaiah 29:13 "And the Lord has said, 'This people draw nigh to Me with their mouth, and they honour Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me: but in vain do they worship Me, teaching the commandments and doctrines of men.'"




"In communion with the holy Mother of God"
Catechism of the Catholic Church - The way of prayer



I'm glad you're calling that the catholic religion, so people won't be confused. The point of my "very long post" was to see what you guys are up to these days. If you're an example of what's coming from Rome these days... thanx

The Catholic Church says Mary is not a Deity

 

[OtherSheep]

The Catholic Church says Mary is not a Deity

Shrines with incense sure sounds like deity-worship.

Shrines to the Virgin Mary - Wikipedia

And so does praying to her so she'll pray for you.
If she ain't a deity, then you guys are working witchcraft.

 

[Spiderman]

Shrines with incense sure sounds like deity-worship.

Shrines to the Virgin Mary - Wikipedia

And so does praying to her so she'll pray for you.
If she ain't a deity, then you guys are working witchcraft.

Witchcraft is condemned by the Church. Burning incense in honor of a holy person is not a sin.

Israelites used to think God dwells in the Ark of the Covenant. Catholics believe Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant and temple where the spirit of God dwells.

She is not Divine, but she is filled with the spirit of God that is Divine. Catholics simply honor her as the mother of God.

Paul said "it is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me". Mary can say the same thing. She is believed to have been transformed into unity with God.

Scripture says we are all one body in Christ. When a person dies they do not cease to be a member of the body of Christ. We are all connected. We are connected with the souls in heaven.

Jesus worked his first miracle at the request of his mother. It was a miracle he did not want to work. He did it in obedience to his mother.

Catholics believe that when Mary asks her son to do something, he does it.

 

[OtherSheep]

Burning incense in honor of a holy person is not a sin.

Catholics believe Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant and temple where the spirit of God dwells.

She is believed to have been transformed into unity with God.

Catholics believe that when Mary asks her son to do something, he does it.

Jeremiah 51:21 "Did not the Lord remember the incense which ye burned in the cities of Juda, and in the streets of Jerusalem, ye, and your fathers, and your kings, and your princes, and the people of the land? and came it not into His heart? 22 And the Lord could no longer bear you, because of the wickedness of your doings, and because of your abominations which ye wrought; and so your land became a desolation and a waste, and a curse, as at this day; 23 because of your burning incense, and because of the things wherein ye sinned against the Lord: and ye have not hearkened to the voice of the Lord, and have not walked in His ordinances, and in His law, and in His testimonies; and so these evils have come upon you."
Queen of Heaven - Wikipedia

 

[Spiderman]

Jeremiah 51:21 "Did not the Lord remember the incense which ye burned in the cities of Juda, and in the streets of Jerusalem, ye, and your fathers, and your kings, and your princes, and the people of the land? and came it not into His heart? 22 And the Lord could no longer bear you, because of the wickedness of your doings, and because of your abominations which ye wrought; and so your land became a desolation and a waste, and a curse, as at this day; 23 because of your burning incense, and because of the things wherein ye sinned against the Lord: and ye have not hearkened to the voice of the Lord, and have not walked in His ordinances, and in His law, and in His testimonies; and so these evils have come upon you."
Queen of Heaven - Wikipedia

www.Idolphin.org/PDFs/The_Two_Babylons_pdf

You're acting ridiculous!

They were burning incense to Pagan deities.

The mother of Jesus is not a pagan deity.

Have you a lost the ability to reason?

You are quoting the Old Testament as if the Old Testament even matters.

I CAN GUARANTEE THAT YOU DO NOT FOLLOW THE OLD TESTAMENT!

give it a rest!

 

[OtherSheep]

++++++
QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5777115, member: 59463"]
Burning incense in honor of a holy person is not a sin.

Catholics believe Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant and temple where the spirit of God dwells.

She is believed to have been transformed into unity with God.

Catholics believe that when Mary asks her son to do something, he does it.
[/QUOTE
++++++

Bible Books, Chapters and Verses for these statements?
Since this is the area called Scriptural Debates, you must have Scriptural Support for each of your statements, ligically speaking.

I promise you that I can find Scriptures against each one of these statements of yours.
I encourage any courageous Protestant to do the research, and fight the persecution.

 

[Spiderman]

++++++
QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5777115, member: 59463"]
Burning incense in honor of a holy person is not a sin.

Catholics believe Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant and temple where the spirit of God dwells.

She is believed to have been transformed into unity with God.

Catholics believe that when Mary asks her son to do something, he does it.
[/QUOTE
++++++

Bible Books, Chapters and Verses for these statements?
Since this is the area called Scriptural Debates, you must have Scriptural Support for each of your statements, ligically speaking.

I promise you that I can find Scriptures against each one of these statements of yours.
I encourage any courageous Protestant to do the research, and fight the persecution.

The first miracle of Jesus was the wedding of Cana. His mother pointed out that they were running out of wine. Why don't you just look it up. Google the wedding at Cana. Jesus didn't want to work the miracle, he did it because his mother asked him to.

I said burning incense to a holy person is not a sin. Why don't you find a scripture verse that says it is.

The Catholic Church put your Bible together. It was the Catholic church that decided what the New Testament Canon would be. The Bible is a Catholic book.

Also, why don't you find a scripture verse that says the Bible is the sole rule of a person's theology. Why don't you find a scripture verse that says the Bible is the final Authority.

How do you even know that all the books in your Bible are the word of God?

If you don't trust the church then don't trust your Bible, because the Bible was Catholic many centuries before the first Protestant church was invented by man.

There is a reason protestantism is so divided and why the Catholic Church makes up the majority of Christians.

People are aware that protestantism didn't exist before the 16th century. Even a child who studies Elementary School history, can learn that protestantism was invented by man.

For roughly 1500 years, every Christian Church on Earth venerated the Virgin Mary and Saints.

I guess God did a really terrible job of shepherding his flock.

I'm not the one persecuting you. You're the persecutor because you're telling people that their faith is satanic.

All I'm doing is pointing out your errors. I'm not accusing any denomination of being satanic. but every Protestant denomination was invented by humans.

 

[OtherSheep]

They were burning incense to Pagan deities.

The mother of Jesus is not a pagan deity.

Have you a lost the ability to reason?

You are quoting the Old Testament as if the Old Testament even matters.

I CAN GUARANTEE THAT YOU DO NOT FOLLOW THE OLD TESTAMENT!

give it a rest!

You people have turned poor little Mary into a pagan deity, if only by giving her the title: Queen of Heaven. There's no way to avoid that connection. And with the attributes you have given her, her pagan heritage shines forth as brightly as the sun-cookie your replacement-Christ carries as his sceptre. And the hat of Dagon hasn't gone unnoticed, either. And yet y'all grovel at his feet like a pack of half-broke puppies.

Jesus has given His Sheep the authority to pray directly to the Father. There's no place for a go-between, in the writings of Jesus.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 15:9 "This people draweth nigh unto Me with their mouth, and honoureth Me with [their] lips; but their heart is far from Me. But in vain they do worship Me, teaching [for] doctrines the commandments of men."

Did you not see what happened to the city of Jerusalem? Do you think your "eternal city" of Rome will fare better for doing worse?

 

[Spiderman]

You people have turned poor little Mary into a pagan deity, if only by giving her the title: Queen of Heaven. There's no way to avoid that connection. And with the attributes you have given her, her pagan heritage shines forth as brightly as the sun-cookie your replacement-Christ carries as his sceptre. And the hat of Dagon hasn't gone unnoticed, either. And yet y'all grovel at his feet like a pack of half-broke puppies.

Jesus has given His Sheep the authority to pray directly to the Father. There's no place for a go-between, in the writings of Jesus.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 15:9 "This people draweth nigh unto Me with their mouth, and honoureth Me with [their] lips; but their heart is far from Me. But in vain they do worship Me, teaching [for] doctrines the commandments of men."

Did you not see what happened to the city of Jerusalem? Do you think your "eternal city" of Rome will fare better for doing worse?

You are being ridiculous.

Jesus is "King of Heaven". Jesus was called morning star. So was Satan. A person doesn't become suddenly evil because of a title that resembles something bad. If people believe that the mother of Jesus is a Queen in heaven, there is nothing idolatrous about it. All it means is that mary prays to God and helps people on earth. Your accusations are false and you don't even know if your Bible is true because the Bible comes from the Catholic Church. No where does the Church say Mary is a Deity, so you lose!

Not to mention, if a belief is not found in the Bible does that mean it is wrong?

 

[OtherSheep]

The first miracle of Jesus was the wedding of Cana. His mother pointed out that they were running out of wine. Why don't you just look it up. Google the wedding at Cana. Jesus didn't want to work the miracle, he did it because his mother asked him to.

Why would you think that Jesus would do for ANYone what was not within His Father's will?

2:4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? Mine hour is not yet come.

That hour of which Jesus speaks, is THE point of what you call His refusal. Jesus knew His words would be recorded, and He wanted us to know why He did what He did. The Holy Spirit is given to His sheep to remind us of what Jesus said and to teach us what Jesus means.

All go-betweens and commentaries are worse than useless.

I said burning incense to a holy person is not a sin. Why don't you find a scripture verse that says it is.

"and thou didst set before them Mine oil and Mine incense."(Ez16)

Incense was used in the Temple service, and offered only to God.
If you followed the Oldest Testament at all you would know this.

The Catholic Church put your Bible together. It was the Catholic church that decided what the New Testament Canon would be. The Bible is a Catholic book.

How do you even know that all the books in your Bible are the word of God?

There is a reason protestantism is so divided and why the Catholic Church makes up the majority of Christians.

The Bible canon, which you've admitted to be a Catholic creation, is responsible for the division in Protestantism... the means of that division is Saul of Tarsus and his friends... which is in fact the very reason they were canonized.

Also, why don't you find a scripture verse that says the Bible is the sole rule of a person's theology. Why don't you find a scripture verse that says the Bible is the final Authority.

14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.
6:44 No man can come to Me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto Me.
17:6 I have manifested Thy name unto the men which Thou gavest Me out of the world: Thine they were, and Thou gavest them Me; and they have kept Thy word.
5:6 Blessed [are] they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
(7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work anomia.)

If you don't trust the church then don't trust your Bible, because the Bible was Catholic many centuries before the first Protestant church was invented by man.

No, pad, you are wrong.

The Bible has always belonged to the children of Israel. Jesus quotes that original Bible, and says that He came only unto the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel. Jesus' words, as reported by His Disciples, have been added to that Oldest Testament. They are one complete word of God. Only His sheep hear only His voice.

 

[osgart]

God made us a toxic, brutely violent and totally indifferent dust bomb to live on, we must be high on his priority list.

God made death, and the spectre of ceasing to exist.

God gave us the notion of eternal hell.

Its a good thing God didnt leave us without the knowledge to take care of ourselves.

We have an extraordinary waste system.

Viruses.

Bacteria.

Komodo dragons.

God must have been in one fowl mood making us this way. But its all to teach higher lessons.

Life is meant to be.

God makes very little personal appearances because God wants us to rely on ancient texts.

There is a time to kill in Ecclesiastes, but thou shalt not kill is one of the Ten Commandments. That should tell you something about God.

The Sermon on the Mount aint all that bad though.

Perhaps Satan rules the world with demonic power. Need to wait thousands of years before God removes him for good.

Anything is true except for the bible being a book of fables and myths.

Omnipresent, omnibenevolent, omniscient, and i still have no experience of God.

Would anyone mind telling me where God exists, how does God exist, and how they know for sure?

God the concept, i dont get it! I give up.

God existing though, sounds more like a terror then a friend.

 

[Spiderman]

Why would you think that Jesus would do for ANYone what was not within His Father's will?

2:4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? Mine hour is not yet come.

That hour of which Jesus speaks, is THE point of what you call His refusal. Jesus knew His words would be recorded, and He wanted us to know why He did what He did. The Holy Spirit is given to His sheep to remind us of what Jesus said and to teach us what Jesus means.

All go-betweens and commentaries are worse than useless.



"and thou didst set before them Mine oil and Mine incense."(Ez16)

Incense was used in the Temple service, and offered only to God.
If you followed the Oldest Testament at all you would know this.



The Bible canon, which you've admitted to be a Catholic creation, is responsible for the division in Protestantism... the means of that division is Saul of Tarsus and his friends... which is in fact the very reason they were canonized.



14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.
6:44 No man can come to Me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto Me.
17:6 I have manifested Thy name unto the men which Thou gavest Me out of the world: Thine they were, and Thou gavest them Me; and they have kept Thy word.
5:6 Blessed [are] they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
(7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work anomia.)



No, pad, you are wrong.

The Bible has always belonged to the children of Israel. Jesus quotes that original Bible, and says that He came only unto the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel. Jesus' words, as reported by His Disciples, have been added to that Oldest Testament. They are one complete word of God. Only His sheep hear only His voice.

Way to go, you didn't even refute anything I said.

The Israelites were burning incense to pagan gods. That's not what Catholics do.

And no, the first Christians were not Bible Christians. The Israelites had no New Testament.

The Catholic Church teaches that nobody goes to the father without Christ. the Catholic church does not teach that anyone can get to heaven without Christ.

The scripture verses you quoted do a very pathetic job of saying nothing whatsoever that has to do with refuting Catholic Doctrine.

Also, just because aabelief is not in the Bible, that does not make it false. Nothing in the Bible says that every belief you have needs to be in the Bible.

way to do a very pathetic job of defending yourself and attacking another faith.

 

[OtherSheep]

God made us a toxic, brutely violent and totally indifferent dust bomb to live on, we must be high on his priority list.

God made death, and the spectre of ceasing to exist.

God gave us the notion of eternal hell.

Its a good thing God didnt leave us without the knowledge to take care of ourselves.

We have an extraordinary waste system.

Viruses.

Bacteria.

Komodo dragons.

God must have been in one fowl mood making us this way. But its all to teach higher lessons.

Life is meant to be.

God makes very little personal appearances because God wants us to rely on ancient texts.

There is a time to kill in Ecclesiastes, but thou shalt not kill is one of the Ten Commandments. That should tell you something about God.

The Sermon on the Mount aint all that bad though.

Perhaps Satan rules the world with demonic power. Need to wait thousands of years before God removes him for good.

Anything is true except for the bible being a book of fables and myths.

Omnipresent, omnibenevolent, omniscient, and i still have no experience of God.

Would anyone mind telling me where God exists, how does God exist, and how they know for sure?

God the concept, i dont get it! I give up.

God existing though, sounds more like a terror then a friend.

Satan does rule this world, and gives the kingdoms of the world to those who will worship him. That should tell you something about all of the rulers of the world, including the religious ones.

But the Sermon on the Mount is the heart of the Kingdom Gospel. His yoke is easy and His burden is light. People who cannot do Matthew 5-7 just aren't trying very hard.
The reason why God seems like such a terror is because, obviously, most people aren't trying very hard.
Jesus says He disciplines those He loves. If you're undisciplined, you aren't trying at all.

If ye love Me, keep My Commandments, is what Jesus tells us.
Don't make men your father/teacher/master, is what Jesus tells us.
How many people do you think are trying at all, osgart?

 

[Spiderman]

Satan does rule this world, and gives the kingdoms of the world to those who will worship him. That should tell you something about all of the rulers of the world, including the religious ones.

But the Sermon on the Mount is the heart of the Kingdom Gospel. His yoke is easy and His burden is light. People who cannot do Matthew 5-7 just aren't trying very hard.
The reason why God seems like such a terror is because, obviously, most people aren't trying very hard.
Jesus says He disciplines those He loves. If you're undisciplined, you aren't trying at all.

If ye love Me, keep My Commandments, is what Jesus tells us.
Don't make men your father/teacher/master, is what Jesus tells us.
How many people do you think are trying at all, osgart?

I started a thread for people like you:
Dear hateful Protestants

You are full of hateful, judgmental, bigoted hypocrisy that you got from your bloodthirsty, bigoted, ancient text that you don't even know is true..

 

[OtherSheep]

It runs rampant in Protestantism.

attacking another faith.

hypocrisy

If you consider attacking another faith to be wrong, then why do you make that the theme of your OPs? And since you guys are the ones who canonized Saul of Tarsus, how can you complain about the results of the false belief system you guys set up?

And no, the first Christians were not Bible Christians. The Israelites had no New Testament.

"I will raise up to them a prophet of their brethren, like thee; and I will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them as I shall command Him. 19 And whatever man shall not hearken to whatsoever words that prophet shall speak in My name, I will take vengeance on him..."--Deuteronomy 18

"He that rejecteth Me, and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."--John 12

Nothing in the Bible says that every belief you have needs to be in the Bible.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber."--John 10

"But the prophet whosoever shall impiously speak in My name a word which I have not commanded him to speak, and whosoever shall speak in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die."--Deuteronomy 18

 

[Spiderman]

If you consider attacking another faith to be wrong, then why do you make that the theme of your OPs? And since you guys are the ones who canonized Saul of Tarsus, how can you complain about the results of the false belief system you guys set up?



"I will raise up to them a prophet of their brethren, like thee; and I will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them as I shall command Him. 19 And whatever man shall not hearken to whatsoever words that prophet shall speak in My name, I will take vengeance on him..."--Deuteronomy 18

"He that rejecteth Me, and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."--John 12



"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber."--John 10

"But the prophet whosoever shall impiously speak in My name a word which I have not commanded him to speak, and whosoever shall speak in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die."--Deuteronomy 18

Hard to talk to you when you are so extremely irrational.

You're quoting the Old Testament and you don't even follow its instructions.

you haven't shown one scripture verse that says that every belief must be found in scripture to be true.

God has even commanded dis -obedience to his word.

My only attacks against protestantism is towards the Protestants who are hateful bigots like yourself.

For the Protestants who are not hateful bigots, I respect their decision to be Protestant.

your pitiful attempts to show me that the Bible is the final Authority (and the scriptures you quoted) are absolutely pathetic and didn't refute anything I said.

your inability to reason and the things you say are so ridiculous and irrelevant that I can't believe I'm wasting my time conversing with some bigot who has no ability to reason.

 

[OtherSheep]

QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5778030, member: 59463"]

You're quoting the Old Testament and you don't even follow its instructions.

you haven't shown one scripture verse that says that every belief must be found in scripture to be true.

God has even commanded dis -obedience to his word.

your pitiful attempts to show me that the Bible is the final Authority
[/QUOTE
{four comments, four replies, in order}

Prove that I don't follow the Oldest Testemant or be called a false witness, straight up.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber."--John 10 {meaning: The words that Jesus spoke are the way in through the door of the sheep... Jesus is the door of the sheep. No one but sheep can enter. And only His sheep know His voice, and will follow no other... no stranger}

You're confusing the First Law with the Second Law... i.e., Deuteronomy is Holy Land Law. {meaning: A Holy People for a Holy Land is the mandate. No one but Holy people could live there, according to the Law. That same Law will be in effect during the Kingdom Age, and the actions will be judged before they happen... the Law will be written on the hearts of all of the people of Israel. Keeping bad people from hurting His sheep is at least half of the reason God wrote the Law of Moses.
In fact, the people who don't like laws must be wanting to injure other people.}

"But the prophet whosoever shall impiously speak in My name a word which I have not commanded him to speak, and whosoever shall speak in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die."--Deuteronomy 18 {meaning: If God didn't say it, it came from someone else. The people who pretend to represent God, and say things that God never sent them to say... these are false prophets. The test of a true prophet is that he cannot diminish what previous prophets have said. Jesus is a true prophet of God. He didn't come to abolish the Law but to confirm it, and explain it by way of the heart. His prophecy of the fall of the Temple came to pass, making Him a verified prophet. Anyone who takes away from the Law of Moses is a false prophet, by default.}

an irrational bigot who condemns those who do not believe what you believe?

you do not know that the Bible is true
and you quote the Old Testament and you don't even follow its instructions.

You insist that God is a hateful bigot.

Isn't the theme of these two threads a condemnation of those who do not believe what you believe? IOW, I'm rubber you're glue...

You don't know that the Bible is true? You poor child!
But how on earth can you know that I don't follow the instructions of the Oldest Testament? Without evidentiary support, you'll be a false witness... the burden of proof is on you, pad.

What you think about the Oldest Testament is directly oposed to what I think about the Testaments of God. IOW, don't apply your thoughts to me.

 

[OtherSheep]

QUOTE="PopeADope, post: 5778030, member: 59463"]
You're quoting the Old Testament and you don't even follow its instructions.
[/QUOTE

Prove that I don't follow the Oldest Testemant or be called a false witness.

Keep in mind that Jesus fulfilled every part of Temple Law... which is a large part {} of the reason for His advent... since He knew the Temple was just about to fall, leaving the children of Israel no way to atone for their sins. Jesus fulfilled the Sacrificial System of the Law, becoming both scapegoat and the Lamb of God.
{the other part is His explanation of the Law of Moses, and His life as our example}

People who trust in Jesus have been freed of the sins they did before they began to trust Him and keep His Commandments. The sins they commit afterwards are to be apologized for, to the injured party. Jesus says this and so does the letter of John. Believe Jesus, means believe what He says, and showing that you believe Him by keeping His Commandments. Belief that doesn't keep the Commandments... is the seed that falls on bad soil... and the rain will carry it off, along with the sand upon which his faith-system has been built.

I am well aware that some people here do know these things and don't need my poor words to tell them. But I also know that many haven't begun to think for themselves... I hope this helps them.

 

[osgart]

Satan does rule this world, and gives the kingdoms of the world to those who will worship him. That should tell you something about all of the rulers of the world, including the religious ones.

But the Sermon on the Mount is the heart of the Kingdom Gospel. His yoke is easy and His burden is light. People who cannot do Matthew 5-7 just aren't trying very hard.
The reason why God seems like such a terror is because, obviously, most people aren't trying very hard.
Jesus says He disciplines those He loves. If you're undisciplined, you aren't trying at all.

If ye love Me, keep My Commandments, is what Jesus tells us.
Don't make men your father/teacher/master, is what Jesus tells us.
How many people do you think are trying at all, osgart?

I can not speak for all other people. I have met non believers who are decent people.

How do you know you are right about God being real? I have tried very hard to make sense of it, and it just does not make any sense. I dont see anything obviously real about it