Is hell fair?

[Francine]

Q. Say someone died 6,000 years ago, and went to this eternal hell. Then they will be always 6,000 years ahead of an unsaved person who dies today. Don't you think 6,000 years of extra torture is unfair of God?

I answer that,

After another six thousand years, the first person will have 12,000 years of torture, and the second will have 6,000 years of torture. That means the first person will have twice as much torture as the second person.

Another six thousand years after that, the first person will have 18,000 years of torture, and the second person will have 12,000 years of torture. That means the first person will have (18,000/12,000)= 1.5 times as much torture as the second person.

Say a million years have gone by. The first person will have 1,006,000 years of torture, divided by the million years of torture of the second person, for a ratio of 1.006.

You see that as you approach infinity, the amount of torture the second person suffers approaches the same amount of torture the first person suffers. So it is fair of God after all.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that God is fair. I believe that word is only used in scripture as an adverb as in "fair weather" or "fair women."

 

[Francine]

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that God is fair. I believe that word is only used in scripture as an adverb as in "fair weather" or "fair women."

But the bible does say that God is just.

Isa.45:[21] Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

 

[Darkness]

Hell itself is the ultimate evil. It matters not if a person is punished an extra 6,000 years. The entire idea is a nightmare from a sick and depraved sadistic God, who cannot stand one jot of independent thought.

Why do you think Lucifer rebelled against God?

 

[PureX]

You see that as you approach infinity, the amount of torture the second person suffers approaches the same amount of torture the first person suffers. So it is fair of God after all.

Approaches equality, but never achieves it. It's sophistry.

 

[Scott C.]

You see that as you approach infinity, the amount of torture the second person suffers approaches the same amount of torture the first person suffers. So it is fair of God after all.

In other words, if one spends infinite time in hell, It doesn't matter when he starts, since (infinity + 6,000) = (infinity + 12,000) = infinity.

The question I have for you is what does a person need to do, not do, believe, not believe in order for the justice of God to dictate that one deserves to suffer for an infinite period of time? Curious on your Catholic (renegade?) view on the subject.

 

[McBell]

{sarcasm}
Of course hell is fair.
How can anything be unfair if endorsed by a "Just" Deity.
Just take slavery for example....
{/sarcasm}

 

[Hope]

Q. Say someone died 6,000 years ago, and went to this eternal hell. Then they will be always 6,000 years ahead of an unsaved person who dies today. Don't you think 6,000 years of extra torture is unfair of God?

I answer that,

After another six thousand years, the first person will have 12,000 years of torture, and the second will have 6,000 years of torture. That means the first person will have twice as much torture as the second person.

Another six thousand years after that, the first person will have 18,000 years of torture, and the second person will have 12,000 years of torture. That means the first person will have (18,000/12,000)= 1.5 times as much torture as the second person.

Say a million years have gone by. The first person will have 1,006,000 years of torture, divided by the million years of torture of the second person, for a ratio of 1.006.

You see that as you approach infinity, the amount of torture the second person suffers approaches the same amount of torture the first person suffers. So it is fair of God after all.

My understanding is that time in hell is not equivalent to time here in our physical universe. So judging someone's "years" in hell by time here on earth is completely fallacious, and makes the argument irrelevant. I don't believe any one person will spend any more "time" in hell than anyone else.

 

[McBell]

In other words, if one spends infinite time in hell, It doesn't matter when he starts, since (infinity + 6,000) = (infinity + 12,000) = infinity.

The question I have for you is what does a person need to do, not do, believe, not believe in order for the justice of God to dictate that one deserves to suffer for an infinite period of time? Curious on your Catholic (renegade?) view on the subject.

But if infinity truly does have to go both ways, then one cannot spend infinity in hell.

 

[Buttercup]

Hell is not fair if you realize a 20 year old who dies in a car accident and has decided Jesus is bunk ends up there.

We are to believe this person spends the entirety of eternity away from God because of a measly ignorant two decades on earth? And, that's a loving God?

 

[Scott C.]

But if infinity truly does have to go both ways, then one cannot spend infinity in hell.

Hmmm, I'll have to think about that one...

 

[Hope]

Another thought occurred to me: many Christians believe that right now no one is in hell. Until Christ returns, those who die go either to Hades (which is hell-like, but not technically hell) or to Paradise (which is heaven-like, but not technically "heaven"). According to this belief, no one truly enters hell till after Christ's second coming and the great Judgment.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

But if infinity truly does have to go both ways, then one cannot spend infinity in hell.

PRECISELY!! :bow:




Peace,
Mystic

 

[Nanda]

So it is fair of God after all.

Punishing someone for an infinite amount of time based on their behavior during an extremely finite lifetime, frought with uncertainty, seems hardly fair. (It's kind of like torturing an infant for not learning calculus. We send those kind of people to jail.)

 

[w00t]

If there really is such a place as hell, then no it isn't fair, if people are supposed to abide there forever and ever. God should do a spell there himself he is more evil than any human has ever been!

 

[Popeyesays]

Would you mind defining "hell". I don't believe in it.

Regards,
Scott

 

[Azakel]

Another thought occurred to me: many Christians believe that right now no one is in hell. Until Christ returns, those who die go either to Hades (which is hell-like, but not technically hell) or to Paradise (which is heaven-like, but not technically "heaven"). According to this belief, no one truly enters hell till after Christ's second coming and the great Judgment.

I don't see how Hades fits in since it has nothing to do with Christianity at all.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

But if infinity truly does have to go both ways, then one cannot spend infinity in hell.

Infinity is a concept, not a specific number. Anything that goes on forever is "infinite" even if it's bigger than something else that goes on forever.

Infinity plus 6000 is still infinity... but it's 6000 more than what you started with.

Infinity times two is still infinity... but it's twice as big as what you started with.

Infinity times infinity is still infinity... but it's infinitely times as big as what you started with.

Take the equation 2x / y; if you set x and y both to infinity, your answer is two, not one.

Imagine you have two people who start walking in opposite directions at the same speed on an infinitely large surface. After an infinite amount of time, what's the distance between the two people (let's call it 'A')? It's infinite. How far is it from one person to the starting point (let's call it 'B')? It's infinite. What's A minus B? It's infinite.

Just because one thing is infinite (e.g. from the beginning of time to the end of time, assuming that time has existed and will exist forever) doesn't mean it's equal to another infinite thing (e.g. from now to the end of time) - in fact, in that case, they're different by an infinite amount of time.

And to the OP, 6000 years will always be 6000 years, no matter how large a number you're comparing it to. 6000 may be an infinitessimal fraction of a billion, a trillion, or any other arbitrarily large number (even infinitely large), but it never suddenly becomes zero just because you compare it to some huge interval of time; it's always 6000 years.

However, all of this only touches slightly on what's wrong with the idea of Hell, IMO.

 

[blackout]

Punishing someone for an infinite amount of time based on their behavior during an extremely finite lifetime, frought with uncertainty, seems hardly fair. (It's kind of like torturing an infant for not learning calculus. We send those kind of people to jail.)

Good illustration!

This eternal hell fire thing is a psycopathic, evil,
and outright ridiculous concept.
(ie worthy of ridicule)

Strip away the doctrine...
and the obvious insanity of the whole
horrible eternal torture thing,
(as punishment for "following" the wrong rulebook?)
just stares you in the face.

Perhaps I should put out 20 game rule books
(with no pictures)
for my 4 year old...
and hand her the game of life...
and expect her to pick out the right rule book,
and figure out how to play and win the game.

then when she fails...
I'll beat her black and blue
and torture her every day of her miserable little existance
for failing.

Oh but then that wouldn't be very FAIR
now would it...
if her sisters and brother died BEFORE her!
She would have to endure MORE years of beatings than them!

The whole thing is twisted and screwy.

 

[Francine]

Infinity times two is still infinity... but it's twice as big as what you started with.

Not so. Suppose you wanted to get back to the first infinity you had before you doubled it. You divide infinity by two, and what do you get? Infinity!