Is Islam Responsible for the Charlie Hebdo Murders?

[jonathan180iq]

This particular group also has a sizable minority with expansionist aims that may one day have access to weapons of mass destruction, even nuclear arms. Under those circumstances, is it possible or even advisable to simply put the ideology on ignore mode?

I think that's a bit of an alarmist worry. But still, no. That's not what I'm saying. You don't ignore that there is a problem, you just have to find a way to practically and pragmatically address it. Our current method of doing so has more to do with playing the same game, rather than being above the petty game to start with.

 

[faroukfarouk]

So, I would argue that these evil, misguided interpretations held by the terrorists aren't really Islamic Ideologies. In reality, they seem to be misinterpretations of Islamic Ideology, much like how slavery was defended by Biblical adherents in the 19th century in the US.

But, honestly, I enjoy discussing this because I still don't understand why Muslims feel the need/responsibility to defend Muhammad's image. Isn't God capable of handling this himself? Further, why would Islam expect the rest of the world to see an issue with pictures of Muhammad, when this kind of expectation is not held by other religions?

Let me be clear, I think that it is debatable that the cartoons were inappropriate, but inappropriate things are shown in the media every day. I am just having a hard time understanding why there is so much outrage over this.

Hello leibowde84
Let me ask you a question.
If CH drew insulting cartoons of Mary (peace and blessings upon her) and also degrading cartoons of Jesus(PBBUH).
As a devout Christian what would your reaction be?

 

[gsa]

I think that's a bit of an alarmist worry. But still, no. That's not what I'm saying. You don't ignore that there is a problem, you just have to find a way to practically and pragmatically address it. Our current method of doing so has more to do with playing the same game, rather than being above the petty game to start with.

I don't know that it is alarmist. But in general I agree with the need to address Islamism pragmatically.

There is an open question when it comes to how to do that, though. I think that isolating the Saudis and other Wahhabists in the Gulf is a necessary condition for reform, for example. And we are a long way from doing that, although Europe seems to be getting ahead of the curve.

 

[leibowde84]

Hello leibowde84
Let me ask you a question.
If CH drew insulting cartoons of Mary (peace and blessings upon her) and also degrading cartoons of Jesus(PBBUH).
As a devout Christian what would your reaction be?

Ignore them. There are tons of cartoons published every day of this nature. The difference is that Christians, for the most part, seem to be mature enough to ignore them. It isn't our job to stick up for God. God is more than capable of handling his own affairs. There is and will never be any honor in claiming to speak for God or using violence to "defend his honor." Both are immoral.

 

[Rival]

A guy shoved a crucifix in his own urine and called it "**** Christ" and nobody had to die. Why don't Muslims freak out when someone draws Yeshua, or Moshe, if all the Prophets are to be held in high regard?

 

[leibowde84]

Hello leibowde84
Let me ask you a question.
If CH drew insulting cartoons of Mary (peace and blessings upon her) and also degrading cartoons of Jesus(PBBUH).
As a devout Christian what would your reaction be?

I see a lot of things that offend me and my beliefs, but it is every person's god-given right (imho) to be able to express their disgust of religious beliefs. There is nothing that bothers me about that.

 

[gsa]

Hello leibowde84
Let me ask you a question.
If CH drew insulting cartoons of Mary (peace and blessings upon her) and also degrading cartoons of Jesus(PBBUH).
As a devout Christian what would your reaction be?

CH insulted Christianity all the time, yet no Christian extremists attacked it or physically threatened it (they did try to stop publication in court, unsuccessfully). What does the difference in response suggest to you?

 

[leibowde84]

CH insulted Christianity all the time, yet no Christian extremists attacked it or physically threatened it (they did try to stop publication in court, unsuccessfully). What does the difference in response suggest to you?

Adult = going to court
Childish = rioting in the streets for attention ... which ended up almost being hilarious, yet quite disturbing.

 

[Salvador]

I think that it was wrong for Charlie Hebdo to have offended Muhammad who is very widely revered as a great prophet by millions of Muslims. Perhaps, Charlie Hebdo had crossed the line between freedom of speech and hate speech. The religious satire magazine had received many advanced warnings of dire consequences from some Muslims who had warned the magazine publishers that they would come under attack if they published cartoons which mocked Muhammad or Islam. The religious satire magazine should have expected that it would have come under attack by some outraged Muslims who would be deeply offended by satirical images of Muhammad or Islam. I think the Charlie Hebdo incident is a lesson for everybody that nobody should mock or make fun of the very powerful religion of Islam or its great prophet Muhammad (PBUH). I believe that Western civilization and the Islamic world should allow one another to live and let live in peace.

 

[gsa]

I think that it was wrong for Charlie Hebdo to have offended Muhammad who is very widely revered as a great prophet by millions of Muslims. Perhaps, Charlie Hebdo had crossed the line between freedom of speech and hate speech. The religious satire magazine had received many advanced warnings of dire consequences from some Muslims who had warned the magazine publishers that they would come under attack if they published cartoons which mocked Muhammad or Islam. The religious satire magazine should have expected that it would have come under attack by some outraged Muslims who would be deeply offended by satirical images of Muhammad or Islam. I think the Charlie Hebdo incident is a lesson for everybody that nobody should mock or make fun of the very powerful religion of Islam or its great prophet Muhammad (PBUH). I believe that Western civilization and the Islamic world should allow one another to live and let live in peace.

I disagree.

 

[gsa]

Adult = going to court
Childish = rioting in the streets for attention ... which ended up almost being hilarious, yet quite disturbing.

I actually think it is more like this:

Adult=Ignoring blasphemy.

Childish=Going to court to stop blasphemy or protesting blasphemy.

Criminal=Rioting and murder.

 

[leibowde84]

I think that it was wrong for Charlie Hebdo to have offended Muhammad who is very widely revered as a great prophet by millions of Muslims. Perhaps, Charlie Hebdo had crossed the line between freedom of speech and hate speech. The religious satire magazine had received many advanced warnings of dire consequences from some Muslims who had warned the magazine publishers that they would come under attack if they published cartoons which mocked Muhammad or Islam. The religious satire magazine should have expected that it would have come under attack by some outraged Muslims who would be deeply offended by satirical images of Muhammad or Islam. I think the Charlie Hebdo incident is a lesson for everybody that nobody should mock or make fun of the very powerful religion of Islam or its great prophet Muhammad (PBUH). I believe that Western civilization and the Islamic world should allow one another to live and let live in peace.

I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous. You are blaming CH for drawing a cartoon. Isn't the real problem that Muslims allow themselves to get so worked up over a drawing. These things are only going to get worse. Sure, I would prefer everyone to be civil, but that just isn't realistic. We need to end this feeling that Islam is off limits. No other religion is.

 

[leibowde84]

I actually think it is more like this:

Adult=Ignoring blasphemy.

Childish=Going to court to stop blasphemy or protesting blasphemy.

Criminal=Rioting and murder.

Ahh ... I forgot about the third one.

 

[Salvador]

I disagree.

I've made some few different assertions. Which of my statements do you not agree with?

 

[Salvador]

I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous. You are blaming CH for drawing a cartoon. Isn't the real problem that Muslims allow themselves to get so worked up over a drawing. These things are only going to get worse. Sure, I would prefer everyone to be civil, but that just isn't realistic. We need to end this feeling that Islam is off limits. No other religion is.

Well, if it makes some Muslims feel better that nobody draws a cartoon of their Holy prophet, then that's not asking too much. I could live with that simple demand. It's not as though there were some Muslims who are attempting to impose Sharia law upon Western civilization.

 

[gsa]

I've made some few different assertions. Which of my statements do you not agree with?

All but the third and final sentences.

 

[gsa]

Well, if it makes some Muslims feel better that nobody draws a cartoon of their Holy prophet, then that's not asking too much. I could live with that simple demand. It's not as though there were some Muslims who are attempting to impose Sharia law upon Western civilization.

It is an attempt to apply sharia by intimidation; they're nothing more than thugs. Is that really how most Muslims want the West to view them?

 

[leibowde84]

Well, if it makes some Muslims feel better that nobody draws a cartoon of their Holy prophet, then that's not asking too much. I could live with that simple demand. It's not as though there were some Muslims who are attempting to impose Sharia law upon Western civilization.

You are being unrealistic. Of course, I have no problem not drawing Muhammad, just as you don't. But, that has absolutely nothing to do with what we are talking about. The internet is available for free spreading of these kinds of publications. As long as they get a reaction, people will keep creating them. Thinking that criticism of Muhammad is going to magically stop is irrational. There is absolutely no reason to assume that there is any way to stop these kinds of cartoons or insults to Islam.

Also, we should not stand by when people try to use religious sentiments to justify violence. We cannot bow down to terrorism like that. Is it really acceptable to expect us all to expect violence for drawing a freaking cartoon?! Is that a precedent that we really want to set?

 

[faroukfarouk]

I see a lot of things that offend me and my beliefs, but it is every person's god-given right (imho) to be able to express their disgust of religious beliefs. There is nothing that bothers me about that.

Note in Islamic law any disgusting or offensive insult to any of the Prophets is an act of blasphemy.We,In Islam,respect and regard Mary and Jesus(PBBUT) in very high esteem.Now If any of them would have been insulted in disgusting cartoons then the Muslims would have reacted in the same way as that of our Prophet Muhammad(PBBUH).
Note CH were warned,not once nor twice but many times,but their refusal in retracting their disgusting behaviour caused their own deaths.In religion you have to be very careful so far as crossing the red line.CH crossed it and paid a small price.
If you examine the cause then you understand the effect.
The question that intellectual minds should ask is what was CH intent in drawing those disgusting cartoons?

 

[Jumi]

Daesh/ISIS is the reason for CH murders. That's also why they attacked the grocery store.