Is it time for a visit from God?

[pdoel]

As I'm sure everyone is aware, there are lots of debates going on these days on different subject as to what is a Sin, what isn't. What is God's plan. Are we living the life God intended, etc.

It got me wondering. The Bible was written thousands of years ago. There are things going on today that the people back then would never even have dreamed of. Fertility drugs, test tube babies, surrogate mothers, clones, etc. There's really nothing in the Bible that discusses these matters, mainly because the people back then had no idea these were even possible.

However, if God is all knowing as most of us believe, God definitely knew these were possible. Which got me wondering. Is this a hole in the idea of God? If these are Sins, why aren't they mentioned in the Bible? And why would God even allow us to find out these possibilities? Or why would God even design a world in which such sins were possible?

Think about some of the issues:

1. If having sex with someone other than your spouse is a sin, would being inseminated by another man's sperm be considered adultery?
2. What role does a surrogate mother have in a child's life? Why is this not addressed in the Bible?
3. If we are to accept children as God decides to give them to us, is it a Sin to conceive by artificial means, such as by fertility drugs. In a way, you're playing God in that situation.
4. Clones. Do clones have souls? Who are their parents? Are clones liable for the same rules as the rest of us?

Now, I realize that these things weren't even dreamt of back then. However, it's just another example of how evolved our civilation has become since the time the Bible was written. It would have blown their minds if God sent down a message saying that clones were a Sin. Maybe it's a sin, and God figured they wouldn't understand. Which makes you wonder. Now that these are possibilites, is it time for God to send some updates?

Or could this all just be proof that there is no God?

 

[SoyLeche]

As I'm sure everyone is aware, there are lots of debates going on these days on different subject as to what is a Sin, what isn't. What is God's plan. Are we living the life God intended, etc.

It got me wondering. The Bible was written thousands of years ago. There are things going on today that the people back then would never even have dreamed of. Fertility drugs, test tube babies, surrogate mothers, clones, etc. There's really nothing in the Bible that discusses these matters, mainly because the people back then had no idea these were even possible.

However, if God is all knowing as most of us believe, God definitely knew these were possible. Which got me wondering. Is this a hole in the idea of God? If these are Sins, why aren't they mentioned in the Bible? And why would God even allow us to find out these possibilities? Or why would God even design a world in which such sins were possible?

Think about some of the issues:

1. If having sex with someone other than your spouse is a sin, would being inseminated by another man's sperm be considered adultery?
2. What role does a surrogate mother have in a child's life? Why is this not addressed in the Bible?
3. If we are to accept children as God decides to give them to us, is it a Sin to conceive by artificial means, such as by fertility drugs. In a way, you're playing God in that situation.
4. Clones. Do clones have souls? Who are their parents? Are clones liable for the same rules as the rest of us?

Now, I realize that these things weren't even dreamt of back then. However, it's just another example of how evolved our civilation has become since the time the Bible was written. It would have blown their minds if God sent down a message saying that clones were a Sin. Maybe it's a sin, and God figured they wouldn't understand. Which makes you wonder. Now that these are possibilites, is it time for God to send some updates?

Or could this all just be proof that there is no God?

I think you already know the answer that the LDS people will give you on this one

 

[michel]

As I'm sure everyone is aware, there are lots of debates going on these days on different subject as to what is a Sin, what isn't. What is God's plan. Are we living the life God intended, etc.

It got me wondering. The Bible was written thousands of years ago. There are things going on today that the people back then would never even have dreamed of. Fertility drugs, test tube babies, surrogate mothers, clones, etc. There's really nothing in the Bible that discusses these matters, mainly because the people back then had no idea these were even possible.

However, if God is all knowing as most of us believe, God definitely knew these were possible. Which got me wondering. Is this a hole in the idea of God? If these are Sins, why aren't they mentioned in the Bible? And why would God even allow us to find out these possibilities? Or why would God even design a world in which such sins were possible?

Think about some of the issues:

1. If having sex with someone other than your spouse is a sin, would being inseminated by another man's sperm be considered adultery?
2. What role does a surrogate mother have in a child's life? Why is this not addressed in the Bible?
3. If we are to accept children as God decides to give them to us, is it a Sin to conceive by artificial means, such as by fertility drugs. In a way, you're playing God in that situation.
4. Clones. Do clones have souls? Who are their parents? Are clones liable for the same rules as the rest of us?

Now, I realize that these things weren't even dreamt of back then. However, it's just another example of how evolved our civilation has become since the time the Bible was written. It would have blown their minds if God sent down a message saying that clones were a Sin. Maybe it's a sin, and God figured they wouldn't understand. Which makes you wonder. Now that these are possibilites, is it time for God to send some updates?

Or could this all just be proof that there is no God?

Very good topic, and thread!

The way I look at it is - God gave man the ability to invent and learn; with every new invention comes the ability to use the novelty for good or bad........nothing has really changed, the moral doubts and questions still exist; they just become more and more intricate.


I don't think it is time for a visit.we know the rules, they haven't changed.


My rule of thumb with deciding on these matters is "What do I think Christ would have thought of this ?"........it works for me.

 

[cardero]

Currently there are some people who are confronting GOD with many personal questions and sharing these results with others. Your feelings about these subjects is one of the very reasons that I acquired an audience with GOD. There were many things that I thought were not covered in the Bible.

• Why am I here?
• What is the role of a new mate to a child in the life of a divorced parent?
• Does GOD have any regrets?
• How does GOD feel about the Columbine High Schools Incident and what can our society do to prevent such incidents in the future?
• What is the Truth about music?
• How does GOD feel about technology?
• What is in store for the new millennium?
• What is the deal with animals?
• Is there life outside of our universe?
• What is the equation of the superstring theory?
• Why is there no proof of the missing link or a transitional period of mankind or animals, for that matter.
• Why are there so many different opinions among believers on what the Bible says and/or means?
• What is a good exercise program for me?

Now if there were other people that could fill in the gaps that I missed because of my understanding I would be interested in reviewing the outcome.

 

[Ulver]

Well in Islam they say Muhammad was the last prophet, so we're stuck with what we have it would seem. In terms of christianity, it's hard to pick out a false prophet from the real deal. Not sure if there are meant to be any more after Jesus.... (kind of odd/funny how that would relate to Islam then).

The fact that many faiths have lacked Prophets or Messengers in the past 2000-1300 or so years is interesting and makes a bit of a point about religion. Though the Mormons have a living Prophet, which perhaps hits upon even more of the subject and it's relation to religion.

 

[Katzpur]

As I'm sure everyone is aware, there are lots of debates going on these days on different subject as to what is a Sin, what isn't. What is God's plan. Are we living the life God intended, etc.

It got me wondering. The Bible was written thousands of years ago. There are things going on today that the people back then would never even have dreamed of. Fertility drugs, test tube babies, surrogate mothers, clones, etc. There's really nothing in the Bible that discusses these matters, mainly because the people back then had no idea these were even possible.

However, if God is all knowing as most of us believe, God definitely knew these were possible. Which got me wondering. Is this a hole in the idea of God? If these are Sins, why aren't they mentioned in the Bible? And why would God even allow us to find out these possibilities? Or why would God even design a world in which such sins were possible?

Think about some of the issues:

1. If having sex with someone other than your spouse is a sin, would being inseminated by another man's sperm be considered adultery?
2. What role does a surrogate mother have in a child's life? Why is this not addressed in the Bible?
3. If we are to accept children as God decides to give them to us, is it a Sin to conceive by artificial means, such as by fertility drugs. In a way, you're playing God in that situation.
4. Clones. Do clones have souls? Who are their parents? Are clones liable for the same rules as the rest of us?

Now, I realize that these things weren't even dreamt of back then. However, it's just another example of how evolved our civilation has become since the time the Bible was written. It would have blown their minds if God sent down a message saying that clones were a Sin. Maybe it's a sin, and God figured they wouldn't understand. Which makes you wonder. Now that these are possibilites, is it time for God to send some updates?

Or could this all just be proof that there is no God?

And what makes you think that anybody in his right mind would recognize a mere human being as a legitimate prophet anyway? God gave us the Bible and that's all we need. The Bible is not only inerrant but perfectly clear in everything it says, leaving no possibility for multiple (and perhaps incorrect) interpretations. Furthermore, the Bible covers everything that's important, and the questions you've posed are really pretty insignificant in the overall scheme of things. :biglaugh:

Obviously, God stopped updating us a long time ago because (1) He became incapable of doing so, (2) He doesn't really care about us like He used to care about His children, (3) We are way, way too advanced to need His input any more.

 

[Aqualung]

And what makes you think that anybody in his right mind would recognize a mere human being as a legitimate prophet anyway? God gave us the Bible and that's all we need. The Bible is not only inerrant but perfectly clear in everything it says, leaving no possibility for multiple (and perhaps incorrect) interpretations. Furthermore, the Bible covers everything that's important, and the questions you've posed are really pretty insignificant in the overall scheme of things. :biglaugh:

Obviously, God stopped updating us a long time ago because (1) He became incapable of doing so, (2) He doesn't really care about us like He used to care about His children, (3) We are way, way too advanced to need His input any more.

Nice post! You covered all the bases in that one.

 

[flupke]

[*]If having sex with someone other than your spouse is a sin, would being inseminated by another man's sperm be considered adultery?
[*]What role does a surrogate mother have in a child's life? Why is this not addressed in the Bible?
[*]If we are to accept children as God decides to give them to us, is it a Sin to conceive by artificial means, such as by fertility drugs. In a way, you're playing God in that situation.
[*]Clones. Do clones have souls? Who are their parents? Are clones liable for the same rules as the rest of us?
[/list]

Now, I realize that these things weren't even dreamt of back then. However, it's just another example of how evolved our civilation has become since the time the Bible was written. It would have blown their minds if God sent down a message saying that clones were a Sin. Maybe it's a sin, and God figured they wouldn't understand. Which makes you wonder. Now that these are possibilites, is it time for God to send some updates?

Or could this all just be proof that there is no God?

It strongly indicates that the bible is the word of men and not the word of God. It doesn't disprove the existence of a god, but it provides evidence against the existence of the christian god.

Also, in the statement "God should have known" lie 2 contradictions:

1) No creature can predict the future of a universe if that creature is part of the same universe. If God is part of the universe (and, given the fact that he intervened multiple times in the bible; so use the broad definition of a universe), then god can LOGICALLY NOT KNOW what's going to happen. This logical proof was used to refute the definition of determinism according to Laplace (the monster that could predict everything provided it knew the position of everything).

2) If God can predict the future, then God can predict all what we are going to do and say, in which case there would be no need for God to put us on a test and see who he will send to heaven or to hell. This is not a real contradiction, but it is by the least pointless.

 

[pdoel]

1) No creature can predict the future of a universe if that creature is part of the same universe. If God is part of the universe (and, given the fact that he intervened multiple times in the bible; so use the broad definition of a universe), then god can LOGICALLY NOT KNOW what's going to happen. This logical proof was used to refute the definition of determinism according to Laplace (the monster that could predict everything provided it knew the position of everything).

Now, if you think about it, your explanation here goes against Intelligent Design. The basis of Intelligent Design is that God created this perfect universe. That he was able to create a system that can support itself, where things have an explanation, creatures can sustain themselves, reproduce, etc. etc. etc. If God is that intelligent, and was able to put so much thought into the creation of the universe, how could he have missed so many situations that could go against his grand design? This is the part that, if you really really really think about it, makes you wonder if there really is a God.

If the universe was created through Intelligent Design, and God created things to be as he wanted them to be, and was able to put so much thought into it. Then how could he have missed things that would allow us to create clones. That would allow us to play God and create children in unconventional ways? It may not seem like a big deal. But it really is, and goes back to some of the questions I asked. Do clones have souls? Will they be able to enter the Kingdom of God? So many questions that man has no answer for.

 

[BucephalusBB]

1) No creature can predict the future of a universe if that creature is part of the same universe.

can you please give me an explaination of that, because i think you can..

 

[may]

As I'm sure everyone is aware, there are lots of debates going on these days on different subject as to what is a Sin, what isn't. What is God's plan. Are we living the life God intended, etc.

It got me wondering. The Bible was written thousands of years ago. There are things going on today that the people back then would never even have dreamed of. Fertility drugs, test tube babies, surrogate mothers, clones, etc. There's really nothing in the Bible that discusses these matters, mainly because the people back then had no idea these were even possible.

However, if God is all knowing as most of us believe, God definitely knew these were possible. Which got me wondering. Is this a hole in the idea of God? If these are Sins, why aren't they mentioned in the Bible? And why would God even allow us to find out these possibilities? Or why would God even design a world in which such sins were possible?

Think about some of the issues:

1. If having sex with someone other than your spouse is a sin, would being inseminated by another man's sperm be considered adultery?
2. What role does a surrogate mother have in a child's life? Why is this not addressed in the Bible?
3. If we are to accept children as God decides to give them to us, is it a Sin to conceive by artificial means, such as by fertility drugs. In a way, you're playing God in that situation.
4. Clones. Do clones have souls? Who are their parents? Are clones liable for the same rules as the rest of us?

Now, I realize that these things weren't even dreamt of back then. However, it's just another example of how evolved our civilation has become since the time the Bible was written. It would have blown their minds if God sent down a message saying that clones were a Sin. Maybe it's a sin, and God figured they wouldn't understand. Which makes you wonder. Now that these are possibilites, is it time for God to send some updates?

Or could this all just be proof that there is no God?

well when we think about it , everything was very good in the beginning , until Adam and eve went their own way, that is why humans now have to make out many plans to try and correct the imperfection in us, but if we had left it in Gods hands instead ,we would not be in the very imperfect state we are in now .we are in a dieing state now full of imperfection no wonder man is trying his best to get a person to live forever.
The Bible book of Revelation foretells a time when God will intervene in human affairs. Of that time, we read: "[God] will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away." These sweeping changes will not come as a result of the scientific breakthroughs of humans, many of whom do not even admit the existence of God, much less praise him. No, the passage continues: "The One [Jehovah God] seated on the throne said: ‘Look! I am making all things new.’"—Revelation 21:4, 5 so it is all trial and error as far as humans are concerned. but in the mean time i suppose we should try our best to live to Gods standards laid out in the bible and have a clear concience with God by not violating bible principles, as for fertility treatment i would think that some treatments would be ok but then other parts may not be ok but at the end of the day perfection and the getting rid of death itself will only come throught God

The Bible book of Genesis says that after creating life on earth, "God saw everything he had made and, look! it was very good." (Genesis 1:31) The first human couple were genetically perfect. It was because they rebelled against God that they brought imperfection and death upon themselves and their offspring.—Genesis 3:6, 16-19; Romans 5:12

What we can be sure of, however, is that no therapy conceived by man will eliminate sickness and death. (Psalm 146:3, 4) Only our Creator has the power to do that.

 

[WeAreAllOne]

Obviously, God stopped updating us a long time ago because (1) He became incapable of doing so,

I really doubt he became incapable, that would imply something so easy and simple for God before, became impossible. How do you explain that?

(2) He doesn't really care about us like He used to care about His children

You don’t really believe this do you? How could you go to church every Sunday and worship a being you believe doesn’t care about you?

(3) We are way, way too advanced to need His input any more.

Now this one is laughable. Our technology has advanced for sure, but we still have wars, there are still people starving, intolerance and hatred are still an everyday norm. We are no more advanced spiritually and morally and we were when the Bible was written!

This is a really good topic

 

[SoyLeche]

I really doubt he became incapable, that would imply something so easy and simple for God before, became impossible. How do you explain that?


You don’t really believe this do you? How could you go to church every Sunday and worship a being you believe doesn’t care about you?


Now this one is laughable. Our technology has advanced for sure, but we still have wars, there are still people starving, intolerance and hatred are still an everyday norm. We are no more advanced spiritually and morally and we were when the Bible was written!

This is a really good topic

I'm pretty sure she was being sarcastic in all 3 of those.

 

[Unedited]

Maybe the update is stuck in a mental hospital somewhere.

 

[WeAreAllOne]

I'm pretty sure she was being sarcastic in all 3 of those.

oh.. well... I feel stupid....:bonk:

 

[michel]

Currently there are some people who are confronting GOD with many personal questions and sharing these results with others. Your feelings about these subjects is one of the very reasons that I acquired an audience with GOD. There were many things that I thought were not covered in the Bible.

• Why am I here?
• What is the role of a new mate to a child in the life of a divorced parent?
• Does GOD have any regrets?
• How does GOD feel about the Columbine High Schools Incident and what can our society do to prevent such incidents in the future?
• What is the Truth about music?
• How does GOD feel about technology?
• What is in store for the new millennium?
• What is the deal with animals?
• Is there life outside of our universe?
• What is the equation of the superstring theory?
• Why is there no proof of the missing link or a transitional period of mankind or animals, for that matter.
• Why are there so many different opinions among believers on what the Bible says and/or means?
• What is a good exercise program for me?

Now if there were other people that could fill in the gaps that I missed because of my understanding I would be interested in reviewing the outcome.

What about the answer to the questions ?

 

[Bangbang]

well when we think about it , everything was very good in the beginning , until Adam and eve went their own way, that is why humans now have to make out many plans to try and correct the imperfection in us, but if we had left it in Gods hands instead ,we would not be in the very imperfect state we are in now .we are in a dieing state now full of imperfection no wonder man is trying his best to get a person to live forever.

What we can be sure of, however, is that no therapy conceived by man will eliminate sickness and death. (Psalm 146:3, 4) Only our Creator has the power to do that.

Please show us the proof.

 

[Toad]

may said:

The Bible book of Revelation foretells a time when God will intervene in human affairs. Of that time, we read: "[God] will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.

Will that be because (gasp!) we'll all be dead?
Peace on earth, at last!!!

 

[Katzpur]

I really doubt he became incapable, that would imply something so easy and simple for God before, became impossible. How do you explain that?

Hmmm. Gosh, I don't think I can!

You don’t really believe this do you? How could you go to church every Sunday and worship a being you believe doesn’t care about you?

No I don't really believe this.

Now this one is laughable. Our technology has advanced for sure, but we still have wars, there are still people starving, intolerance and hatred are still an everyday norm. We are no more advanced spiritually and morally and we were when the Bible was written!

Yes it is, isn't it. :biglaugh: I had hoped that my entire post would be seen as laughable. (I was being sarcastic, but I hope I made my point.)

This is a really good topic

I think so, too.

 

[WeAreAllOne]

Katzpur, sorry, it was a long night. still not quite there I guess.