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Is it time for a visit from God?
- Thread starter pdoel
- Start date
blueman
God's Warrior
God continually provides us with wisdom, even in these modern times. When you allow Christ to be your Lord and Saviour, the process of renewing your mind and character to be Christ-like allows you to assess and live your life according to the will of God. God still speaks to us today through His Word, through prayer, the Holy Spirit, our circumstances in life and through the church. Through the Holy Spirit, which resides in us, God is able to help us confirm what is right and wrong and outside of His sovereign will. Just because science, medicine and technology have advanced and presented new things for us to consider, we have no excuse if we do not lean on God to determine whether or not certain actions are sin or part of His divine purpose. He provides us with tools as mentioned above to guide us, even in the 21st century 
I'll try to give an easy answer:Bouncing Ball said:
Option 1: Outside a universe
Suppose the universe exists of 3 perfect spheres inside a box with laws that completely define the direction in which the spheres will move according to their speed and angle of bumping into one another. 'perfect' means that there are no microscopic differences or irregularities that would ultimately result in 'chaotic' (unpredictable) events.
If I am an observer, and at some point I know the position, speed, and direction of movement of the balls, then I can entirely predict what's going to happen in 3 seconds, 3 years or 3000000 years. This is all assuming that the way I observe does not influence the box (the universe in this case).
This will similarly apply to a more 'common' universe where all laws are deterministic.
Option 2: inside the universe.
"Knowing" the positions and states of all atoms requires computation. Computation requires matter. No computer could compute the positions and states of all the atoms (let's ignore sub-atomic) it holds, because it requires more space to store and compute the information, leading to a necessity for more atoms, resulting in more parameters to be known, needing even more space to store this information, etc...
Therefore, no creature can 'know' the exact state of itself.
Stating that 'God is perfect' and can do it anyway, is pointless. It is as much as saying "God can make a square circle". It is logically impossible, and therefore not even a fair question to ask of god (similar to the question "can god make sth he cannot undo").
The only LOGICAL way for god to predict the future of the universe is to not be a part of it.
Hope this is clear.(this argument requires a deterministic universe of course)
joeboonda
Well-Known Member
3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
(King James Bible, 2 Timothy)
I have the Bible, and I have the Holy Spirit, and I have a brain, slightly damaged, but still works a bit, I know God cares about every detail of our lives, But if a new 'prophet' wants to come and tell us what God thinks about artificial insemenation, surrogate parents, fertility drugs, and cloning, then he is welcome to say what he will. I will measure his statements by God's Word if he speaks on doctrine. These technologies are not wrong, unless used wrong. If someone is unsure, try them out, see how it works out for you, if all goes well, fine, if not, then examine what was done and the motive. Think we need a prophet to tell us if cars, microwaves, computers, light-bulbs, surgery, doctors, organ transplants, high-blood pressure medicine, tylenol, gatorade, or any new thing we learn to do is wrong? A brain, the Holy Spirit, a conscience, the Bible, some statistics, and information, and I can probably figure it out. Thus saith the prophet:
I. Thou shalt insemenate another woman, only artificially, otherwise, you are committing adultery.
II. Thou mayest haveth surrogate parents, only if thou observe law number I.
III. Thou mayest make fertillity drugs, but if thou produceth babies with two heads, thou shalt learn to make them better.
IV. Thou mayest clone a sheep for thy good pleasure, to do with as thou wilt, but if thou shalt clone an army of evil warriors for the intent of world domination, I will destroy thee.
V. Thou shalt insert whatever new law thy new prophet makes up in this slot here_____________.
VI. Thou must join the Holy Empire.
VII. There is only one Great and Holy Empire.
VIII. Thou shalt be greatly rewarded and shalt become a God to rule over the new technologies of new worlds, and make new laws for cloning sheep and servants and thine ox and thine *** and thy neigbor's ox and *** and thy neighbor's wife and thy neighbor's wife's *** and anything that is thy neighbor's.
IX. There is only one penalty in the Great and Holy Empire, the penalty of death.
X. I Thy God am a loving and just God, therefore, if thou shalt fall under the penalty of death, have no fear, for I, the Lord thy God, hast cloned thee, and called thee by thy name, and thou shalt have many sons and daughters and clones in the land which I have given thee.
(King James Bible, 2 Timothy)
I have the Bible, and I have the Holy Spirit, and I have a brain, slightly damaged, but still works a bit, I know God cares about every detail of our lives, But if a new 'prophet' wants to come and tell us what God thinks about artificial insemenation, surrogate parents, fertility drugs, and cloning, then he is welcome to say what he will. I will measure his statements by God's Word if he speaks on doctrine. These technologies are not wrong, unless used wrong. If someone is unsure, try them out, see how it works out for you, if all goes well, fine, if not, then examine what was done and the motive. Think we need a prophet to tell us if cars, microwaves, computers, light-bulbs, surgery, doctors, organ transplants, high-blood pressure medicine, tylenol, gatorade, or any new thing we learn to do is wrong? A brain, the Holy Spirit, a conscience, the Bible, some statistics, and information, and I can probably figure it out. Thus saith the prophet:
I. Thou shalt insemenate another woman, only artificially, otherwise, you are committing adultery.
II. Thou mayest haveth surrogate parents, only if thou observe law number I.
III. Thou mayest make fertillity drugs, but if thou produceth babies with two heads, thou shalt learn to make them better.
IV. Thou mayest clone a sheep for thy good pleasure, to do with as thou wilt, but if thou shalt clone an army of evil warriors for the intent of world domination, I will destroy thee.
V. Thou shalt insert whatever new law thy new prophet makes up in this slot here_____________.
VI. Thou must join the Holy Empire.
VII. There is only one Great and Holy Empire.
VIII. Thou shalt be greatly rewarded and shalt become a God to rule over the new technologies of new worlds, and make new laws for cloning sheep and servants and thine ox and thine *** and thy neigbor's ox and *** and thy neighbor's wife and thy neighbor's wife's *** and anything that is thy neighbor's.
IX. There is only one penalty in the Great and Holy Empire, the penalty of death.
X. I Thy God am a loving and just God, therefore, if thou shalt fall under the penalty of death, have no fear, for I, the Lord thy God, hast cloned thee, and called thee by thy name, and thou shalt have many sons and daughters and clones in the land which I have given thee.
I'm wondering how anyone would ever recognize the 'new prophet'. He/she would probably be seen as someone who wants to start a new sect. If he/she would come up with some miracles as means of proof of identity, we'd probably think that David Copperfield's notebook got stolen...joeboonda said:
pdoel
Active Member
Very true. The one thing that confuses me is why does God send different messages?blueman said:God continually provides us with wisdom, even in these modern times. When you allow Christ to be your Lord and Saviour, the process of renewing your mind and character to be Christ-like allows you to assess and live your life according to the will of God. God still speaks to us today through His Word, through prayer, the Holy Spirit, our circumstances in life and through the church. Through the Holy Spirit, which resides in us, God is able to help us confirm what is right and wrong and outside of His sovereign will. Just because science, medicine and technology have advanced and presented new things for us to consider, we have no excuse if we do not lean on God to determine whether or not certain actions are sin or part of His divine purpose. He provides us with tools as mentioned above to guide us, even in the 21st century
I struggled for many years with being gay. Did all I could to try and "change myself". Prayed, begged for help, asked to just be normal. Nothing ever changed. I was depressed, sad, miserable, etc. etc. etc.
Then, one day after praying, I suddenly realized something. Maybe I WAS the person God wanted me to be. Maybe God hadn't answered my prayers because being gay was the purpose God had chosen for me. The more I thought on it, the more I realized that God loves all his creatures, he created us all the same. There's no question in my mind that God answered my prayer in the way that HE intended, not the way that I was asking. He works in mysterious ways.
However, where the confusion comes in, is while I am quite certain that God answered my prayers, I know there are people out there who feel God has spoken to them and told them that I am an abomination.
So, while many of us feel we've "heard from God", I don't understand why he'd give us all a different message.
sandy whitelinger
Veteran Member
Perhaps God has already had his say in all this.pdoel said:
Romans 1:20-25:
"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen."
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I seek clarity in the Trinity? Now we're both missing each other points!Victor said:That went over my head..
Wooofff, one less thing to debate out...
PS - You sure seek plenty of clarity in the Trinity...
So, Victor, when did you want to have our one-on-one debate?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I don't think he'd necessarily come up with some miracles. A prophet is, after all, not a soothsayer of some kind. And God wouldn't call him to perform magic tricks. A prophet would lead people towards God. Lives would be made better because of him. In other words, you would know him by the fruits he produced. If he was a fake, sooner or later people would catch on. Everything he said would be forgotten within a relatively short period of time after he died and there would be somebody new in line to take his place.flupke said:
i dont think so, those who will inherit the earth will be alive for ever with death a thing of the past.............But the meek ones themselves will possess the earth,Toad said:
And they will indeed find their exquisite delight in the abundance of peace psalm 37;11 and no more death to hinder them........As the last enemy, death is to be brought to nothing 1 corinthians 15;26