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Is Jesus God?

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
Persons? Sure, I can go along with that. (Actually, when it gets right down to it, I don't believe you think the Father is a person at all. Wouldn't you say He's more of an invisible force than a person?) EIther way... Is each one fully God, independent of the others. Or do you need all three to have one God?
I do see the Father as a person, just as I see the Son and the Holy Spirit as persons.

God is a singular being who exists in a plural manner.

All three, Father, Son an Holy Spirit are ONE God. They are not three Gods. The three work together in complete unity, totally dependent on one another, and yet totally interdependent of each other.

I don't pretend to completely understand our triune God, but this is how I see it in the Scriptures.
 
Bible Student,
You must be a JW?

I do understand the things they teach you are true. They are in the bible. What is false, are the things they do not teach you.
Satan is not a dummy. The Watch Tower is some of his best work. Don’t lie, just don’t tell them everything.
We all know what a false prophet is; one who makes a prophecy that does not come true.

Those who lead the JW’s have made many prophesies over the years, and not one has come true. That would put them in the circle of false prophets. Here is my question: “Would God put false prophets over his people?” I think you would agree, “No he would not.”

The main scripture in the Bible is genesis 3:15. The complete Bible is about this scripture.
We both know the book of Genesis was written in Hebrew. Have you ever been told, “One word in genesis 3:15 in not a Hebrew word, but a Greek word? In English the word is seed.
God is asking Satan what he did with his seed. That Greek word means, “Sperm.” It is used for child and offspring also. In Greek it gives a clear understanding. In Hebrew it does not.


Little things left out can make a world of difference. Each and every time they (leaders) have made a prophecy, they claimed they got it from God. How many times can God be wrong? None…which means they did not get it from God.


The people (JW’s) are good people. But, like sheep, they are easily led. They are trained to spot a lie. They are not trained to spot what is left out. They are lulled into a false sense of security. When a prophecy does not come true, they are simply told, “”As we get nearer the end, the light gets brighter.


One of the big hooks is, “My people will be known by my name.” The JW’s have put the name Jehovah in the bible over 7,000 times. It is the only religion known by the name Jehovah. On the surface all must agree, this must be the true religion. The Jews agree, Gods name is Jehovah. Let’s undo some of Satan’s work here. God’s name is written YHWH in the scrolls. No way in ten Sundays does YHWH translate into Jehovah! But you say, “The Jews say it is right?” The word Jew comes from the tribe of Judah. There are 11 other tribes that make up Gods people…they don’t agree with this. Each of those tribes has their own name. The tribe of Judah has the world believing all 12 tribes are Jews…not so. The tribe of Judah are the people who killed Jesus. The Jews are in the holy land. Does that make them Gods people? Look at their flag. They say it has the Star of David on it. David never had a star. His son Solomon did. He got it from Bath-Sheba (a wife) who was into black magic. The star is from Egypt…it is the sign of Satan. Knowing that, would you still believe what the Jews say about Gods name? The other 11 tribes won’t say Gods name because they don’t know how to say it right.

I could go on and write a book about this, but it is a subject you have to search out, or not search out. Try this sometime: Tell your elders, You believe the Bible over the Watch Tower magazine, and other books. I think you will be in for a surprise.

The only way I can respond to that is like this.........

 

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
No sister,Revelation 1:8 does not pertain to Jesus Christ.It is speaking of Jehovah God the Almighty.In Revelation 1 it speaks of Jesus Christ being the first and the last.This does not mean he is God the Almighty.What it speaks of is Jesus Christ being the first human to be raised from the dead by God the Almighty to everlasting life,and the last to be resurrected by God personally.

Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, “the Faithful Witness,” “the firstborn from the dead,” and “the Ruler of the kings of the earth.”


When God the Almighty is called the first and the last,this refers to there not being a God before Him, and there will not be one after Him.In the book of Revelation we have Jesus Christ,John and Jehovah God speaking.

May I ask you a question about Revelation 1:1? Who sent the angel to John?
 

Kolibri

Well-Known Member
No way in ten Sundays does YHWH translate into Jehovah!

Translate, yes. Tranliterate, no.
Let's look at other languages:
Languages and Dialects Containing the Divine Name in the Main Text of the Christian Greek Scriptures

Language or Dialect: Divine Name

Aneityum: Ihova

Arawak: Jehovah

Awabakal: Yehóa

Bangi: Yawe

Batak (Toba): Jahowa

Benga: Jěhova

Bolia: Yawe

Bube: Yehovah

Bullom So: Jehovah

Chácobo: Jahué

Cherokee: Yihowa

Chin (Hakha): Zahova

Chippewa: Jehovah

Choctaw: Chihowa

Croatian: Jehova

Dakota: Jehowa

Dobu: Ieoba

Douala: Yehowa

Dutch: Jehovah

Efate (North): Yehova

Efik: Jehovah

English: Jehovah

Éwé: Yehowa

Fang: Jehôva

Fijian: Jiova

French: IHVH, yhwh

Ga: Iehowa

German: Jehovah; Jehova

Gibario (dialect of Kerewo): Iehova

Grebo: Jehova

Hawaiian: Iehova

Hebrew: יהוה

Hindustani: Yihováh

Hiri Motu: Iehova

Ho-Chunk (Winnebago): Jehowa

Ila: Yaave

Iliku (dialect of Lusengo): Yawe

Indonesian: YAHWEH

Kala Lagaw Ya: Iehovan

Kalanga: Yehova; Yahwe

Kalenjin: Jehovah

Kerewo: Iehova

Kiluba: Yehova

Kipsigis: Jehoba

Kiribati: Iehova

Kisonge: Yehowa

Korean: 여호와

Kosraean: Jeova

Kuanua: Ieova

Laotian: Yehowa

Lele: Jehova

Lewo: Yehova

Lingala: Yawe

Logo: Yehova

Lomongo: Yawe; Yova

Lonwolwol: Jehovah

Lugbara: Yehova

Luimbi: Yehova

Luna: Yeoba

Lunda: Yehova

Luo: Yawe

Luvale: Yehova

Malagasy: Jehovah; Iehôvah

Malo: Iova

Marquesan: Iehova

Marshallese: Jeova

Maskelynes: Iova

Mentawai: Jehoba

Meriam: Iehoua

Misima-Paneati: Iehova

Mizo: Jehovan; Jihova’n

Mohawk: Yehovah

Mortlockese: Jioua

Motu: Iehova

Mpongwe (dialect of Myene): Jehova

Muskogee: Cehofv

Myene: Yeôva

Naga, Angami: Jihova

Naga, Konyak: Jihova

Naga, Lotha: Jihova

Naga, Mao: Jihova

Naga, Northern Rengma: Jihova

Naga, Sangtam: Jihova

Nandi: Jehova

Narrinyeri: Jehovah

Nauruan: Jehova

Navajo: Jîho’vah

Ndau: Jehova

Nembe: Jehovah

Nengone (or, Maré): Iehova

Ngando: Yawe

Ntomba: Yawe

Nukuoro: Jehova

Polish: Jehowa

Portuguese: Iáhve

Rarotongan: Jehova; Iehova

Rerep: Iova

Rotuman: Jihova

Sakao: Ihova; Iehova

Samoan: Ieova

Seneca: Ya’wĕn

Sengele: Yawe

Sesotho: Yehofa

Sie: Iehōva

Spanish: Jehová; Yahvé; YHWH; Yahweh

Sranantongo: Jehova

Sukuma: Yahuwa; Jakwe

Tahitian: Iehova

Teke-Eboo: Yawe

Temne: Yehṓfa; Yehofa

Thai: Yahowa

Toaripi: Jehova; Iehova

Tonga: Jehova

Tongan: Jihova; Sihova

Tswana: Jehofa; Yehova; Yehofa

Umbundu: Yehova

Uripiv: Iova

Wampanoag: Jehovah

Welsh: Iehofah

Xhosa: Yehova

Zande: Yekova

Zulu: Jehova; YAHWE

(In addition to those on this list, a number of languages and dialects use a form of the divine name in footnotes or in explanatory text.)
 
May I ask you a question about Revelation 1:1? Who sent the angel to John?

Lets find out.....

1 A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel and presented it in signs through him to his slave John, 2 who bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave, yes, to all the things he saw.

All angels have been placed under Jesus' authority.It was Jesus who sent the angel.

Ps.Notice how it makes a distinction between the two when it states John bore witness.

"who bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave, yes, to all the things he saw.
 
Last edited:
Translate, yes. Tranliterate, no.
Let's look at other languages:
Languages and Dialects Containing the Divine Name in the Main Text of the Christian Greek Scriptures

Language or Dialect: Divine Name

Aneityum: Ihova

Arawak: Jehovah

Awabakal: Yehóa

Bangi: Yawe

Batak (Toba): Jahowa

Benga: Jěhova

Bolia: Yawe

Bube: Yehovah

Bullom So: Jehovah

Chácobo: Jahué

Cherokee: Yihowa

Chin (Hakha): Zahova

Chippewa: Jehovah

Choctaw: Chihowa

Croatian: Jehova

Dakota: Jehowa

Dobu: Ieoba

Douala: Yehowa

Dutch: Jehovah

Efate (North): Yehova

Efik: Jehovah

English: Jehovah

Éwé: Yehowa

Fang: Jehôva

Fijian: Jiova

French: IHVH, yhwh

Ga: Iehowa

German: Jehovah; Jehova

Gibario (dialect of Kerewo): Iehova

Grebo: Jehova

Hawaiian: Iehova

Hebrew: יהוה

Hindustani: Yihováh

Hiri Motu: Iehova

Ho-Chunk (Winnebago): Jehowa

Ila: Yaave

Iliku (dialect of Lusengo): Yawe

Indonesian: YAHWEH

Kala Lagaw Ya: Iehovan

Kalanga: Yehova; Yahwe

Kalenjin: Jehovah

Kerewo: Iehova

Kiluba: Yehova

Kipsigis: Jehoba

Kiribati: Iehova

Kisonge: Yehowa

Korean: 여호와

Kosraean: Jeova

Kuanua: Ieova

Laotian: Yehowa

Lele: Jehova

Lewo: Yehova

Lingala: Yawe

Logo: Yehova

Lomongo: Yawe; Yova

Lonwolwol: Jehovah

Lugbara: Yehova

Luimbi: Yehova

Luna: Yeoba

Lunda: Yehova

Luo: Yawe

Luvale: Yehova

Malagasy: Jehovah; Iehôvah

Malo: Iova

Marquesan: Iehova

Marshallese: Jeova

Maskelynes: Iova

Mentawai: Jehoba

Meriam: Iehoua

Misima-Paneati: Iehova

Mizo: Jehovan; Jihova’n

Mohawk: Yehovah

Mortlockese: Jioua

Motu: Iehova

Mpongwe (dialect of Myene): Jehova

Muskogee: Cehofv

Myene: Yeôva

Naga, Angami: Jihova

Naga, Konyak: Jihova

Naga, Lotha: Jihova

Naga, Mao: Jihova

Naga, Northern Rengma: Jihova

Naga, Sangtam: Jihova

Nandi: Jehova

Narrinyeri: Jehovah

Nauruan: Jehova

Navajo: Jîho’vah

Ndau: Jehova

Nembe: Jehovah

Nengone (or, Maré): Iehova

Ngando: Yawe

Ntomba: Yawe

Nukuoro: Jehova

Polish: Jehowa

Portuguese: Iáhve

Rarotongan: Jehova; Iehova

Rerep: Iova

Rotuman: Jihova

Sakao: Ihova; Iehova

Samoan: Ieova

Seneca: Ya’wĕn

Sengele: Yawe

Sesotho: Yehofa

Sie: Iehōva

Spanish: Jehová; Yahvé; YHWH; Yahweh

Sranantongo: Jehova

Sukuma: Yahuwa; Jakwe

Tahitian: Iehova

Teke-Eboo: Yawe

Temne: Yehṓfa; Yehofa

Thai: Yahowa

Toaripi: Jehova; Iehova

Tonga: Jehova

Tongan: Jihova; Sihova

Tswana: Jehofa; Yehova; Yehofa

Umbundu: Yehova

Uripiv: Iova

Wampanoag: Jehovah

Welsh: Iehofah

Xhosa: Yehova

Zande: Yekova

Zulu: Jehova; YAHWE

(In addition to those on this list, a number of languages and dialects use a form of the divine name in footnotes or in explanatory text.)
Where's the Greek translation?
 

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
Bible Student, post: 4163329, member: 54450"]Your interpretation of that passage is not correct sister.It is a misconception based on a mistranslation.If we go to the original language it was written in,Koine Greek,and see what it really is saying,we can come to fully understand the truth.I will use the Emphatic Diaglott to prove my point.

Since you and other JW's seem to hold the Emphatic Diaglott is such high esteem, I thought you might be interested in reading what Dr. Griesbach,whose Greek text is in the ED, had to say about Jesus.
  1. Griesbach: Dr. J. J. Griesbach (whose Greek text - not the English part - is used in the Emphatic Diaglott): "So numerous and clear are the arguments and testimonies of Scriptures in favor of the true Deity of Christ, that I can hardly imagine how, upon the admission of the Divine authority of Scripture, and with regard to fair rules of interpretation, this doctrine can by any man be called in doubt. Especially the passage, John 1:1-3, is so clear and so superior to all exception, that by no daring efforts of either commentators or critics can it be snatched out of the hands of the defenders of the truth."
You might also be interested to know that the translator of the ED, Benjamin Wilson, translated John 1:1. "...and the word was God."
 
Since you and other JW's seem to hold the Emphatic Diaglott is such high esteem, I thought you might be interested in reading what Dr. Griesbach,whose Greek text is in the ED, had to say about Jesus.
  1. Griesbach: Dr. J. J. Griesbach (whose Greek text - not the English part - is used in the Emphatic Diaglott): "So numerous and clear are the arguments and testimonies of Scriptures in favor of the true Deity of Christ, that I can hardly imagine how, upon the admission of the Divine authority of Scripture, and with regard to fair rules of interpretation, this doctrine can by any man be called in doubt. Especially the passage, John 1:1-3, is so clear and so superior to all exception, that by no daring efforts of either commentators or critics can it be snatched out of the hands of the defenders of the truth."
You might also be interested to know that the translator of the ED, Benjamin Wilson, translated John 1:1. "...and the word was God."
Thanks.
 

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
Lets find out.....

1 A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel and presented it in signs through him to his slave John, 2 who bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave, yes, to all the things he saw.

All angels have been placed under Jesus' authority.It was Jesus who sent the angel.

Ps.Notice how it makes a distinction between the two when it states John bore witness.

"who bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave, yes, to all the things he saw.

Very good! For the second time today, we agree. It was Jesus who sent the angel to John.

May I ask a second question? Why does the NWT translate Revelation 22:6 saying it was Jehovah who sent his angel to show the things which must shortly take place when Revelation 1:1 clearly says Jesus is the one who sent the angel to John?

6 He said to me: “These words are faithful* and true;+ yes, Jehovah,* the God who inspired the prophets,+ has sent his angel to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place.
 
This is interesting.....

"a - tetragrammaton appeared in both Hebrew Scriptures and in Greek translations of the Hebrew Scriptures

b - Jesus spoke the tetragrammaton when reading in Synagogue (described in Luke 4)

c - Matthew, because it was authored in Hebrew, would have included the tetragrammaton when quoting Old Testament Scriptures that included it. When Matthew was translated into Greek, the tetragrammaton "was left untranslated in the Greek text according to the practice of that time".

d - "Sometime during the second or third century C.E. the scribes removed the Tetragrammaton from both the Septuagint and the Christian Greek Scriptures and replaced it with 'Kyrios'...or 'Theos' ""

Why Does Jehovah's Name Never Appear in the Greek New Testament, but it's in the New Testament of the NWT?

full



full



full



Why Does Jehovah's Name Never Appear in the Greek New Testament, but it's in the New Testament of the NWT?
 
Very good! For the second time today, we agree. It was Jesus who sent the angel to John.

May I ask a second question? Why does the NWT translate Revelation 22:6 saying it was Jehovah who sent his angel to show the things which must shortly take place when Revelation 1:1 clearly says Jesus is the one who sent the angel to John?

6 He said to me: “These words are faithful* and true;+ yes, Jehovah,* the God who inspired the prophets,+ has sent his angel to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place.

Well you have to remember,it is the President who is the Commander in chief,but he has his officers directing commands to the other soldiers.Like wise it is Jehovah who has all authority.Jesus is a servant of Jehovah God and all the angels too.

"(Revelation 22:6, 7) All the wonderful promises of Revelation will really be fulfilled! Speaking in the name of Jesus, the angel declares that Jesus is coming soon, “quickly.” This must be Jesus’ coming “as a thief” to destroy Jehovah’s enemies and usher in the grand and happy climax of Revelation. (Revelation 16:15, 16) We should, therefore, conform our lives to the words of “this scroll,” Revelation, to be pronounced happy at that time"


Notice it says worship God and not Jesus.

"2 After such a richness of revelation, it is understandable that John felt overwhelmed: “Well, I John was the one hearing and seeing these things. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel that had been showing me these things. But he tells me: ‘Be careful! Do not do that! All I am is a fellow slave of you and of your brothers who are prophets and of those who are observing the words of this scroll. Worship God.’ (Revelation 22:8, 9;"


WOL


  • 2 Timothy 3:16
    16 All Scripture is inspired of God+ and beneficial for teaching,+ for reproving, for setting things straight,* for disciplining in righteousness,

Jesus is not God.Rev 1:1 says God gave it to Jesus.


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him"
Jesus takes his commands from God.
 

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
This is interesting.....

"a - tetragrammaton appeared in both Hebrew Scriptures and in Greek translations of the Hebrew Scriptures

b - Jesus spoke the tetragrammaton when reading in Synagogue (described in Luke 4)

c - Matthew, because it was authored in Hebrew, would have included the tetragrammaton when quoting Old Testament Scriptures that included it. When Matthew was translated into Greek, the tetragrammaton "was left untranslated in the Greek text according to the practice of that time".

d - "Sometime during the second or third century C.E. the scribes removed the Tetragrammaton from both the Septuagint and the Christian Greek Scriptures and replaced it with 'Kyrios'...or 'Theos' ""

A = true
The Hebrew Scriptures contain the tetragrammation. There have been fragments of the Septuagint found which contain the tetragrammation. The Greek New Testament, however, does not.

B = false
It is an unprovable assumption.
Where in Luke 4 is the mention of the tetragrammation.
C. false
There is no tangible evidence of a Hebrew gospel of Matthew.
D. false
This is another unprovable assumption.
It suggests an international conspiracy which too place over centuries. An impossible and ridiculous assertion!
 

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
Well you have to remember,it is the President who is the Commander in chief,but he has his officers directing commands to the other soldiers.Like wise it is Jehovah who has all authority.Jesus is a servant of Jehovah God and all the angels too.

"(Revelation 22:6, 7) All the wonderful promises of Revelation will really be fulfilled! Speaking in the name of Jesus, the angel declares that Jesus is coming soon, “quickly.” This must be Jesus’ coming “as a thief” to destroy Jehovah’s enemies and usher in the grand and happy climax of Revelation. (Revelation 16:15, 16) We should, therefore, conform our lives to the words of “this scroll,” Revelation, to be pronounced happy at that time"


Notice it says worship God and not Jesus.

"2 After such a richness of revelation, it is understandable that John felt overwhelmed: “Well, I John was the one hearing and seeing these things. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel that had been showing me these things. But he tells me: ‘Be careful! Do not do that! All I am is a fellow slave of you and of your brothers who are prophets and of those who are observing the words of this scroll. Worship God.’ (Revelation 22:8, 9;"


WOL


  • 2 Timothy 3:16
    16 All Scripture is inspired of God+ and beneficial for teaching,+ for reproving, for setting things straight,* for disciplining in righteousness,

Jesus is not God.Rev 1:1 says God gave it to Jesus.


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him"
Jesus takes his commands from God.
You just finished telling me that it was Jesus who sent His angel to God. When you see the contradiction in the NWT, you come up with an elaborate explanation to wipe out what you so rightly and adamantly stated about John 1:1. Can you not see what Watchtower does to people?

You end up denying the truth you were able to discover on your own with the guidance of the Holy Spirit about John 1:1 by simply reading the Bible without Watchtower assistance. Rather than admit the NWT is incorrect in its translation of Rev. 22:6, you try to expain away what you discovered in Rev. 1:1.

Why would you defend the NWT if you are not a JW? Do you really think it's okay for Rev. 22:6 to contradict Rev. 1:1 in the NWT?
 
You just finished telling me that it was Jesus who sent His angel to God. When you see the contradiction in the NWT, you come up with an elaborate explanation to wipe out what you so rightly and adamantly stated about John 1:1. Can you not see what Watchtower does to people?

You end up denying the truth you were able to discover on your own with the guidance of the Holy Spirit about John 1:1 by simply reading the Bible without Watchtower assistance. Rather than admit the NWT is incorrect in its translation of Rev. 22:6, you try to expain away what you discovered in Rev. 1:1.

Lol...Wow! Hey Katie,I am not trying to do anything.I answered you.If it is not the answer you want,well I am sorry about that.
 
Proverbs 8:
Proverbs 8:

Proverbs 8:22-36

VERSE 35 - For whoever finds Me finds life,
and obtains favor from the LORD;




John 5:39-40, Jesus said, "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life."

John 10:10, Jesus said, "The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly."

John 14:6, Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

1 Cor. 1:30, It is because of Him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God-- that is our righteousness, holiness and redemption.
 
Proverbs 8:22-36

VERSE 35 - For whoever finds Me finds life,
and obtains favor from the LORD;




John 5:39-40, Jesus said, "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life."

John 10:10, Jesus said, "The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly."

John 14:6, Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

1 Cor. 1:30, It is because of Him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God-- that is our righteousness, holiness and redemption.

Yes,Jehovah sent Jesus.Jehovah is God.
 

katiemygirl

CHRISTIAN
Lol...Wow! Hey Katie,I am not trying to do anything.I answered you.If it is not the answer you want,well I am sorry about that.
Hey Bible Student, I thank you for answerin my questions and for being polite and respectful about it. It just bothers me that you couldn't trust your own interpretation of Rev. 1:1. You were dead on with it. But as soon as you saw the contradiction with Rev. 22:6, you backed off. You may not believe it, but I really do care about you and others. I'm not trying to get you to agree withh everything I say. I just pray that you will put Watchtower on the back burner and read nothong but the Bible. Trust the Holy Spirit to lead you to the truth. You just proved that He led you to the truth of Rev. 1:1 without Watchtower. I must admit, I was feeling very happy for you.
 
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