Is metaphysical naturalism a worldview that is ultimately based on faith?

[prometheus11]

Gambit, physics makes, records, and compares measurements. Physicists are only able to measure physical changes in time. Physics provides no commentary on what cannot be measured. Physicists allow what scenarios seem most likely based on all the measurements they make of changes witnessed in the physical world.

 

[Gambit]

Gambit, physics makes, records, and compares measurements. Physicists are only able to measure physical changes in time. Physics provides no commentary on what cannot be measured. Physicists allow what scenarios seem most likely based on all the measurements they make of changes witnessed in the physical world.

So, does this mean that physics deals only with physical? Or, does it mean that physics also deals with some other than the physical?

 

[Gambit]

Based on Merriam-Webster's definition of the term (see below), "physics" deals only with the physical.

Full Definition of physics

1. 1 : a science that deals with matter and energy and their interactions
   
   
2. 2 a : the physical processes and phenomena of a particular system b : the physical properties and composition of something

(source: Merriam-Webster: physics)

 

[prometheus11]

So, does this mean that physics deals only with physical? Or, does it mean that physics also deals with some other than the physical?

I tried to be clear. Physics makes measurements on physical matter. Consistent measurements allow for the best possible explanations. (Theories like the Theory of Gravity). Physicists know certain measurements concerning masses remain constant and so they name that action.

Think of it like naming hurricanes. Hey, there's a wall of wind and water. Going 114 mph. Must be a storm. Let's name it Karla.

Does that help?

 

[Gambit]

I tried to be clear.

It doesn't appear that you are trying hard enough. But it doesn't matter. Physics deals only with the physical (hence it's name).

 

[prometheus11]

I'd say the same to you.

Do you contend that physics should reject the idea of gravity because gravity is only the best theory for measurements of moving physical masses?

 

[Gambit]

I'd say the same to you.

Do you contend that physics should reject the idea of gravity because gravity is only the best theory for measurements of moving physical masses?

Is gravity physical or nonphysical?

 

[prometheus11]

Is gravity physical or nonphysical?

We don't know. We know it affects physical matter, so we measured its effect and named it.

Do you think educated people are bothered by that fact?

 

[Gambit]

We don't know. We know it affects physical matter, so we measured its effect and named it.

So, the nonphysical can possibly interact with the physical?

Do you think educated people are bothered by that fact?

Some educated materialists might be.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Based on Merriam-Webster's definition of the term (see below), "physics" deals only with the physical.

It says 1 : a science that deals with matter and energy and their interactions.

 

[Gambit]

It says 1 : a science that deals with matter and energy and their interactions.

Do you believe that matter and energy are nonphysical?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Do you believe that matter and energy are nonphysical?

I think they have observable effects.

 

[prometheus11]

So, the nonphysical can possibly interact with the physical?

I have no idea. If you define force fields like gravity and electromagnetism as "non physical" then you are making that claim.

Some educated materialists might be.

No. You don't seem to understand what materialism is.

 

[Willamena]

"The existence and properties of dark matter are inferred from its gravitational effects on visible matter, on radiation, and on the large-scale structure of the universe." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_matter

Just so.

 

[Willamena]

In what sense?

*shrug* In what sense is it not?

 

[Willamena]

So, does physics also deal with the nonphysical?

Everything does. Everything symbolic in nature is nonphysical. Meaning is nonphysical, as is sense, relation, story, prediction, mathematics... the list is endless.

 

[Gambit]

Everything does. Everything symbolic in nature is nonphysical. Meaning is nonphysical, as is sense, relation, story, prediction, mathematics... the list is endless.

Why call it physicalism if it holds the nonphysical is as ontologically real as the physical?

 

[raw_thought]

Is metaphysical naturalism (materialism) a worldview that is ultimately based on faith?

Meta -physics is meta. In other words a higher level of abstraction. Physics asks what are the laws of physics. Metaphysics asks why are the laws of physics the way they are. Unfortunately ,the new age movement has taken over the word. The "metaphysics " section of the book store HAS NOTHING to do with metaphysics . Crystals, spoon bending...etc are as metaphysical as car repair.

 

[raw_thought]

"Only matter exists" is a metaphysical claim.

 

[Gambit]

Meta -physics is meta. In other words a higher level of abstraction. Physics asks what are the laws of physics. Metaphysics asks why are the laws of physics the way they are. Unfortunately ,the new age movement has taken over the word. The "metaphysics " section of the book store HAS NOTHING to do with metaphysics . Crystals, spoon bending...etc are as metaphysical as car repair.

I employing the term "metaphysics" here to refer to a branch of philosophy that is concerned with the ultimate nature of reality.