Is this the simplest and strongest argument of all for not believing in religions?

[suzy smith]

If the God of the bible or the Quran was all powerful then he would have no need whatsoever for prophets. He would just contact us directly and save all the misunderstanding we have today about religion. This makes even more sense now as all he needs is our email address.
But if religion is man made then self proclaimed prophets would be inevitable. You would expect nothing else.
So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.
I came to this forum because I am fascinated my mans ability to believe in religion.

Or am I missing something here?

 

[thau]

If the God of the bible or the Quran was all powerful then he would have no need whatsoever for prophets. He would just contact us directly and save all the misunderstanding we have today about religion. This makes even more sense now as all he needs is our email address.
But if religion is man made then self proclaimed prophets would be inevitable. You would expect nothing else.
So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.
I came to this forum because I am fascinated my mans ability to believe in religion.

Or am I missing something here?

Yes, you are.

If God’s primary or only objective was to make humanity aware of Him then He would have just placed us in heaven to begin with as he did with the angels.

Clearly there is a reason that God is only partially known or understood here on earth. And that is because humanity is subject to some trial or mission.

I maintain that what sacrifice and goodness we generate is very pleasing to God. I also maintain that enough has been revealed where it is no great mystery who God is or what He is asking of us.

I also maintain there are countless ulterior motives that people (like you?) do all they can to believe or pretend this God does not exist or is so unknown you have no idea what to do. Consequently, they (you) feel justified to do as you please.

Our faith is not a blind faith. It is a belief that some things are as told or will be as promised, but it is based on those things we have already been given or known. And that is where the arguments usually begin, and end.

 

[Falvlun]

I think this may only disprove a fair-minded God who desires a personal relationship with humans.

There could be Gods out there who could care less what humans think of him/she/it, and how they behave.

There could also be Gods out there who very much care what humans do, but who have an estranged sense of fairness, justice, or humor from our own.

 

[Quintessence]

We also find lots of religions that don't orient themselves around prophets who claim to be speaking for the gods and instead encourage direct connections with the sacred, the greater, the whatever-you-want-to-call-it instead of the g-word.

 

[Falvlun]

Gotta remember that the Christian narrative of who God is isn't the only one out there.

 

[suzy smith]

I think this may only disprove a fair-minded God who desires a personal relationship with humans.

There could be Gods out there who could care less what humans think of him/she/it, and how they behave.

There could also be Gods out there who very much care what humans do, but who have an estranged sense of fairness, justice, or humor from our own.

Gotta remember that the Christian narrative of who God is isn't the only one out there.

I was aiming my comment at the God of the Bible and the Quran.
I thought Jehovah did want a close personal relationship with his people?

 

[Falvlun]

I was aiming my comment at the God of the Bible and the Quran.
I thought Jehovah did want a close personal relationship with his people?

Your title comes off that you'd like to extrapolate this to make a generalized statement regarding belief in god and religion.

But, if you are restricting this to just Allah and the Christian God, then I think it's a fair point.

Many things that God does just do not make sense in relation to his supposed desires and goals.

 

[suzy smith]

Your title comes off that you'd like to extrapolate this to make a generalized statement regarding belief in god and religion.

But, if you are restricting this to just Allah and the Christian God, then I think it's a fair point.

Many things that God does just do not make sense in relation to his supposed desires and goals.

Thank you, I should have worded it clearer.
And I was only referring to man made religion, not God

 

[Revoltingest]

Thank you, I should have worded it clearer.
And I was only referring to man made religion, not God

Still....both religion & non-religious belief in gods is a very foreign (to me) way of thinking.
I don't feel the need nor do I see any evidence. But since believers can be smart & sane, I
conclude that their brains are wired differently.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

If the God of the bible or the Quran was all powerful then he would have no need whatsoever for prophets. He would just contact us directly and save all the misunderstanding we have today about religion. This makes even more sense now as all he needs is our email address.
But if religion is man made then self proclaimed prophets would be inevitable. You would expect nothing else.
So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.
I came to this forum because I am fascinated my mans ability to believe in religion.

Or am I missing something here?

I'd say this a stronger argument for not believing in prophets.

 

[Caladan]

If the God of the bible or the Quran was all powerful then he would have no need whatsoever for prophets. He would just contact us directly and save all the misunderstanding we have today about religion. This makes even more sense now as all he needs is our email address.
But if religion is man made then self proclaimed prophets would be inevitable. You would expect nothing else.
So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.
I came to this forum because I am fascinated my mans ability to believe in religion.

Or am I missing something here?

There is also the assumption above that you assume to understand the cultural context or even jargon that some of these prophets used or the topics they addressed in their respective regions during their time.

 

[columbus]

If the God of the bible or the Quran was all powerful then he would have no need whatsoever for prophets. He would just contact us directly and save all the misunderstanding we have today about religion. This makes even more sense now as all he needs is our email address.
But if religion is man made then self proclaimed prophets would be inevitable. You would expect nothing else.
So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.
I came to this forum because I am fascinated my mans ability to believe in religion.

Or am I missing something here?

You are missing something.
The PoE is the top argument. This one is #2.

The lack of willingness on the part of the Abrahamic god to tell us what we should know, without needing human mouthpieces, is a relic of ancient cultures. They simply didn't have the concept of mass communication. So the premise that God was dependent on prophets made sense to them. The only way people had then was someone telling them each individually.

I think the first useful miracle would be getting the info God wants us to know, in a form everyone can understand. It would not interfere with our free will to know what God wants, rather than what somebody says God wants. It's the only way for me to Choose God, and God knows that.

Tom

 

[Alceste]

The best evidence for me is that people are very easily fooled, but the massive contradictions between the Christian / Muslim God's purported desires and his behavior are a very close second. Maybe it is tied with the observation that many ordinary humans are far more moral / good / loving / benevolent / wise / generous / compassionate than this particular God, who is claimed to be perfect. For example, I don't believe I've ever met anyone who would arbitrarily condemn others to eternal torture. That's a pretty massive moral failing on God's part. Even devout believers usually balk at the question of who should be sent to hell, saying something along the lines of "that's not for me to decide", or "it's not my place to judge". The fact is, the thought of torture makes most of us extremely uncomfortable, and we want nothing to do with it. In that respect, we are morally superior to God. Therefore, claims about the Christian / Muslim God being the ultimate arbiter of morality simply cannot be true.

 

[Jainarayan]

There could be Gods out there who could care less what humans think of him/she/it, and how they behave.

There could also be Gods out there who very much care what humans do, but who have an estranged sense of fairness, justice, or humor from our own.

Deism.

 

[bobhikes]

If the God of the bible or the Quran was all powerful then he would have no need whatsoever for prophets. He would just contact us directly and save all the misunderstanding we have today about religion. This makes even more sense now as all he needs is our email address.
But if religion is man made then self proclaimed prophets would be inevitable. You would expect nothing else.
So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.
I came to this forum because I am fascinated my mans ability to believe in religion.

Or am I missing something here?

Unless God values belief. God could as you say just reveal himself to everybody and in Eden he did. That didn't work to well. Maybe his followers need to redeem themselves through belief. I believe this is what Jesus teaches. I do not know about Islam.

 

[Valjean]

God's deliberately obscure and uncommunicative to test our faith.reach:

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Wow, Suzy! Way to ignore the vast majority of the world's religions! Most of the world's religious traditions don't have prophets and "holy books".

 

[idav]

So what do we find? Lots and lots of prophets throughout history claiming to be from [their] God.

Religion is about taking someone specifics word for it. These days people take it to a more personal level which amounts to what your asking about, god reaching everyone personally. Even with that it is amazing that people connected to god all come up with different answers. Lack of communication skills should be the last thing a super powerful being should have to worry about. Yes it's a very good argument against a personal type deity.

 

[suzy smith]

Wow, Suzy! Way to ignore the vast majority of the world's religions! Most of the world's religious traditions don't have prophets and "holy books".

Wow saint_frankenstein! Way to ignore what I said.
I was aiming my comment at the God of the Bible and the Quran as is clearly seen in my thread and a later comment.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I was aiming my comment at the God of the Bible and the Quran as is clearly seen in my thread and a later comment.
Wow saint_frankenstein! Way to ignore what I said.

Then you should change your thread title. It says "...for not believing in religions". It doesn't say "...for not believing in Abrahamic religions".