Islam and the Bible

[Mujahid Mohammed]

I was just asking Booko where in the Bible it says to expect Muhammed, which was a response to the post of yours.

My post was in response to people saying the bible is perfect and free of defect. In relation to the statement about Muhammed being mentioned that has nothing to do with my quote.

 

[Mujahid Mohammed]

That's how you perceive it because you happen to be Muslim. If all these people begin converting to Buddhism, will you suddenly admit that Buddhism must be the truth? Of course not.

No, I am saying it in relationship to the media hype. Everyone thinks we as muslims are evil, we beat and oppress women, and we hate america. With all the negative talk more people (especially women) are entering the religion . It should be the opposite. This is what I am talking about. The really astonishing number of people especially women entering the religion even with the negative publicity.

No where in the verse does it say that. It says that those who believe in the Quran (Muslims), and Jews, and Christians, and Sabians, if they "work righteousness" and believe in Allah and the Last Day, have nothing to fear.

you forgot believe in the Jewish scriptures. Which is part of the revelations that were revealed and we believe in them in there original. If they had the original and followed it. This would not be an issue.

The verse does not say that they have to have either of those things.
"Allah" is the name that Arabic-speaking Christians and Jews use of God, and did even before Muhammad; they most certainly believe in "Allah." Also, I've never met a Christian who didn't believe in a final day of judgement by God. Such people, according to the Quran, have nothing to fear.

You are right but you have to remember that many Christians I know claim Allah is some made up God unknown to them that their Arab speaking brothers are talking about the same thing. Many Christians believe in many things that are different then what Jesus and his followers were doing. If they truly believed in Allah and the last day they would want death as Allah says. Some Christians believe Jesus is God and he will be doing the judging and not God. The Quran is speaking about the conditions of the heart and understanding of what is true belief. Also as I have said many times. People interpret what the verse on what they know and understand if you know nothing about the history of the revelation. Who it is addressing, when it was revealed, who witnessed it, and what events happened to cause it. Without these things as well as knowledge of the arabic language mistakes in understanding the verses often happen. That is why it is important for non arabic speaking muslims to know or have access to someone who knows arabic. Look at that verse in relation to all the others. the work is comprehensive. Know who the verse was talking about. Know the history of the religion. Understand what is Islam. Know what are deeds of righteousness and what is sinnful in islam.

 

[HopefulNikki]

No, I am saying it in relationship to the media hype. Everyone thinks we as muslims are evil, we beat and oppress women, and we hate america. With all the negative talk more people (especially women) are entering the religion . It should be the opposite. This is what I am talking about. The really astonishing number of people especially women entering the religion even with the negative publicity.

I hate to break it to you, but this is basically just a result of Western (or at least American) mindset. Maybe you're not aware of this, but in our society, we love counter-culture movements. If it questions and defies authority, if it goes against the mainstream, if it makes people stop and look...we love it. America is at war in Muslim nations, and thus many people are becoming attracted to this "taboo" religion. Again, as a Muslim you perceive this as divine direciton, but there's no reason to assume that.

you forgot believe in the Jewish scriptures.

No I didn't. I specifically mentioned the Jews. Btw, it doesn't simply say "believe" in the Jewish Scriptures, it says "follow" the Jewish Scriptures...which obviously, the Jews do.

Which is part of the revelations that were revealed and we believe in them in there original. If they had the original and followed it. This would not be an issue.

No, it would still be an issue. You're basically saying that this verse means, "Jews, Christians, etc. have nothing to fear if they believe everything that Muslims believe." If they believed everything that Muslims believed exactly, they would BE Muslims. The only way this verse makes sense by mentioning mutiple distinct religious groups together, is by recognizing the obvious implication of the text that one can be a devout Christian or follower of the Jewish Scriptures and have nothing to fear from the Muslim God. If it was simply saying that everyone has to be Muslim, it would be pointless to mention Jews. Chrsitian, or Sabians.

You are right but you have to remember that many Christians I know claim Allah is some made up God unknown to them that their Arab speaking brothers are talking about the same thing. Many Christians believe in many things that are different then what Jesus and his followers were doing. If they truly believed in Allah and the last day they would want death as Allah says.

So if you don't want to die, then you're not being a devout Muslim, in your view?

Some Christians believe Jesus is God and he will be doing the judging and not God.

Isn't it true that in Islam you believe that Jesus will return and will at least aid in ruling and judging the world? This is basically the same thing that Christians believe, although they may exalt Jesus higher. However, surely Muhammad knew these Christian beliefs when he taught about them, and when he taught that Christians have nothing to fear.

 

[TashaN]

where in the Bible it says to expect Muhammed

Mohammed in the bible !
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19750

All Prophets including Jesus prayed to God the same as Muslism pray now ! (in the bible itself)
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22286


Peace and blessing,

The Truth

 

[Hacker]

True but it is why these people are coming to Islam. Because it is the truth. And not because all the cool kids are doing it.

Please tell me how you know Islam is the truth? I'm not saying I disbelieve you, I REALLY want to know how you "know."

The verse is saying you must believe in all the revalations. Do Christians and Jews believe in the Quran. Do they have the original uncorrupted scriptures given to them by their messenger. They do not believe in Allah and many deny the Last Day.

Why is it that Christian and Jews are reluctant to accepting the QUaran as the truth?

The Quran is specific. There are reasons for the revalation and it is addresses certain people as well as events. These things one must know in order to interpret it correctly. Many do not and this is the problem

Why is it a problem?

 

[Bro_Grace]

I’m new here. This is just my eleventh post and first topic of real discussion. This is just the sort of topic to which I have an interest. The root of my basic overstanding is that there is only one true God. This one God is known by many different men by many different names. The true God is the same God of Christians, Hebrews, Islam and all mankind.

When it comes to holy books or books containing the inspired word of God, I accept the Triunity as truth. The Triunity as I overstand it is the Tanakh or Old Testament, the books referred to as the New Testament and the Qur'ān. Many people spend a lot of time pondering the differences from passage to passage, chapter to chapter, book to book and Qur'ān to Old and New to Old Testaments. My challenge has been to look to overstand where they all agree. Many times this has caused me to reject the interpretations I had been taught as a child.

My circumstance puts me at a disadvantage. I can’t read modern or ancient Hebrew and have to accept some interpretation of the Tanakh or Old Testament into English. The same is true when it comes to Greek and the New Testament and Arabic and the Qur'ān. Personally I can’t depend on any particular passage or chapter of any book as a total guide. I depend on my limited but inspired overstanding of the Triunity and trust God first.

Bro Grace

 

[Mujahid Mohammed]

Would you mind directing to the place where it says that? I know it's a common enough belief with Muslims, but I'd like to see what it says in the Qu'ran if possible.

Verses 5:12-18, verses 2:75 to name just a few I hope it helps

 

[Mujahid Mohammed]

I hate to break it to you, but this is basically just a result of Western (or at least American) mindset. Maybe you're not aware of this, but in our society, we love counter-culture movements. If it questions and defies authority, if it goes against the mainstream, if it makes people stop and look...we love it. America is at war in Muslim nations, and thus many people are becoming attracted to this "taboo" religion. Again, as a Muslim you perceive this as divine direciton, but there's no reason to assume that.

Some may choose to enter islam for this reason the majority do not. Ask them to tell you there stories. There are many. Islam is a sincere religion one must be sincere in there reasons for becoming muslim or their Islam will not be accepted because the intention is wrong.

No I didn't. I specifically mentioned the Jews. Btw, it doesn't simply say "believe" in the Jewish Scriptures, it says "follow" the Jewish Scriptures...which obviously, the Jews do. No, it would still be an issue. You're basically saying that this verse means, "Jews, Christians, etc. have nothing to fear if they believe everything that Muslims believe."

No, there were Christians in the time of Jesus, who submitted themselves to Allah and followed His Messenger Jesus. Islam is not just a noun but a verb as well. If you submit to God you are a muslim. If Jesus did everything God asked he is a muslim. A muslim means one who submits to God. This is what we mean. if as a jew or christian you followed the prophets and the "true" scriptures not the altered one then they would have nothing to fear.

The only way this verse makes sense by mentioning mutiple distinct religious groups together, is by recognizing the obvious implication of the text that one can be a devout Christian or follower of the Jewish Scriptures and have nothing to fear from the Muslim God.

you must first know to who, and why, when and what was going on at the time of the revelation in order to understand it. For there is a reason this verse was revealed and it was addressing someone about something that happened.

If it was simply saying that everyone has to be Muslim, it would be pointless to mention Jews. Chrsitian, or Sabians.

A Jew, Christian, or Sabian who submits to the commands of Allah are muslims.

So if you don't want to die, then you're not being a devout Muslim, in your view?

No but it is the quality of a believer. They are eager to meet Allah and recieve the reward. People who reject it long for the life of this world and fear death when it is inevitable.

Isn't it true that in Islam you believe that Jesus will return and will at least aid in ruling and judging the world?

No

This is basically the same thing that Christians believe, although they may exalt Jesus higher. However, surely Muhammad knew these Christian beliefs when he taught about them, and when he taught that Christians have nothing to fear.

No, Allah told us in the Quran he did not know.

 

[Mujahid Mohammed]

Please tell me how you know Islam is the truth? I'm not saying I disbelieve you, I REALLY want to know how you "know."

Well for me its alot of reasons. First I was raised from a few of the Christian persuasions. I will try to keep it brief for it could take all day. Christianity was so confusing in terms of dogmas, version, interpretations etc. etc. I will not bore you with all the details. But after study of theology and history in college and being apart of a masonic fraternity I became an I guess agnostic. For I believed in God but the scriptures I studied in college all contradicted the notion that they were divine. There were problems and i felt God was perfect so he could not be responsible for these things. He is all powerful so I know if he wanted he could have kept what was once his word preserved. Which if anyone studies and believes it as true at some point the original was around. But I never studied Islam, I did a little but it was completely inaccurate. It said Islam was a moon cult and Muhammed was similar to Jesus. Live went on I met a muslim and we talked for a long time. He showed me the scientific miracles in the Quran, He made the whole story about Jesus finally make sense. And it finally put the emphasis back on the Creator, The sustainer and originator of all that exists. There are things in the Quran that it is impossible for a man living 1400 ago to know, many we have just discovered recently in this century. And then the character of the last Messenger Muhammed peace be upon him. His compassion and love for Allah is something truly amazing, his justice, his mercy, He never cursed anyone, took the rights from anyone.He was truly the greatest man ever. The things he did and the adversity he went through. Teaching people the truth about Jesus and his blessed mother. He stood up for the rights of people and the rights of the slave and the oppressed when noone else would. The Quran, the words of Allah. It is the justice of Islam that stands out to me as well. It is fair if everyone does what is required in Islam the world would be a better place. Allah created it the heavens and the earth and the rules in which he governs it are perfect. Could he not send down a book to instruct man on how to govern itself to perfection in all aspects of live. From brushing your teeth to work. Everything. Would not something that came from God be free of defects.

Why is it that Christian and Jews are reluctant to accepting the QUaran as the truth?

I cannot answer for them because i am no longer one but it may be fear, pride(my mom and dad do it and they are never wrong), Simply content with what this life has to offer, not realizing the hereafter and the punishment.

Why is it a problem?

Prophet Muhammed told us this is what will happen. The farther people go in time from the revelations the more and more they forget what the purpose of life is. People think this life is what it is about. Nothing stays. Everything you get at any moment can be taken away. You study all weekend for a test on monday. This is what consumes you this is what you have been working for in college, the big day finals graduation. He get in a wreck and dies on the way. All for what. Can he take it with him. No. The only thing that lasts is the deeds one did. Did you submit to Allah and obey him and pray He gives you some of His infinite mercy or Be wasteful in this life doing things which will only benefit you for a time in this life, when the hereafter is permanent. This goes for everybody