Islam will dominate!

[nameless]

You know what the difference between me and you is:

If that PIC had hindu men standing of the charad bodies of hindu babies. I would on my beaurifull girls lives denounce them, Expose them muslims and share with your grieve.

i did not knew you were such a kind person, tell us other good qualities of yours.
You are still not ready to accept crime of mughals, there is no meaning for feeling sympathy for sufferings of people today, without accepting the struggle of people of the past. What you say about islamic domination of India?

You on the other hand out of extreme hatered for Islam and Muslims you will deny these barbaric acts and be 100% supportive of your hindu comrads all the way to burikna faso as you are doing right here right now.
.

thanks for teaching me about myselves.

I repeatedly said in my posts that i dont justify hindu extremists, just made an attempt to present the real story using wikipedia as source.

 

[nameless]

Now, enough about Indian religious affairs, as this thread is about islamic domination. Indian religious condition may not be good but it needs a fresh topic to debate on that, also it is very important to discuss consequences of islamic domination, so pls dont stray away from topic.

 

[Madhuri]

Once we let go of our denial of our weakness and our Anti-agnostic and idol worshiping thoughts, we become closer to God.

I disagree. Some of the most devotional and saintly people I know worship physical representations of the Divine. 'Idol worship' as you call it may seem silly to you but it doesn ot take a person away from God.

 

[DeitySlayer]

Now, enough about Indian religious affairs, as this thread is about islamic domination. Indian religious condition may not be good but it needs a fresh topic to debate on that, also it is very important to discuss consequences of islamic domination, so pls dont stray away from topic.

He did a pretty fast switch there. One second Islam will dominate the world! And the next they're innocent little victims of Hindu extremism. The guy paints in black and white. He refuses to see the grey.

 

[maro]

The masses that were touched by the fire of secularisim are waking up to the realities they are living. The have only started to see the rotten system they were delluded with.

The masses were touched by the fire of tyranny and colonialism....not secularism

Secularism is not a problem as long as it's not forced on muslims..and islam is not a problem as long as it's not forced on non muslims....both ,secularism and the islamic regime should be a reflection of the people's will and free choice.

 

[DeitySlayer]

EXACTLY 301 ouncer. Listen to a sane, rational Muslim talking.

 

[zenzero]

Friends,

Another form of extremism?
http://www.sanfranciscosentinel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/islamic-extremism.jpg

Love & rgds

 

[maro]

Hinduism doesn't have that need to dominate like Islam and Christianity, and it doesn't reach its goals through missionary and the sword.

Islam doesn't want to dominate...people want to dominate....islam doesn't reach its goals by the sword because the ' hearts' of people is the only goal of islam

We preach and practice dawah but we don't have missionaries in the christian sense of the word

 

[DeitySlayer]

Islam doesn't want to dominate...people want to dominate....islam doesn't reach its goals by the sword because the ' hearts' of people is the only goal of islam

We preach and practice dawah but we don't have missionaries in the christian sense of the word

The Mughals ruled India by force and war for centuries. I'm not holding this up as a microcosm of the entirety of Islam; but it is an undeniable fact that Islam has spread its message partially through force in the past. And well, Islam did pretty much go through the Iranian plateu and into Africa trying to convert people. Not always through force, far from it, but they did try and convert people a lot of the time.

 

[nameless]

Islam doesn't want to dominate...people want to dominate....islam doesn't reach its goals by the sword because the ' hearts' of people is the only goal of islam

I don't think 'blame ' is the right word ,bro . Those conquests brought a great religion to those countries...without them ,i wouldn't have been a muslim..and probably you too...

I am proud of those conquests , and i don't think it's right to look down at them to please anyone..there were plenty of efforts and sacrifices..plenty of martyrs...to deliver the word of Allah to you and me , and we should be proud of that

select only one...

 

[maro]

select one...

Where do you see the contradiction ?

I don't think the islamic conquests' purpose was to dominate...but to preach the religion when there was no other communication channels possible....and yes , without them ,i wouldn't have been a muslim ,myself

 

[DeitySlayer]

I don't think the islamic conquests' purpose was to dominate...but to preach the religion when there was no other communication channels possible....and yes , without them ,i wouldn't have been a muslim ,myself

Is not the nature of a conquest the forcing of a new rule upon a people? I very much doubt the Hindu kings in India willingly accepted Mughal rule. I mean, they were in near-constant warfare for a few centuries after; they wouldn't have been fighting if the occupation was mutually accepted.

 

[maro]

The Mughals ruled India by force and war for centuries. I'm not holding this up as a microcosm of the entirety of Islam; but it is an undeniable fact that Islam has spread its message partially through force in the past. And well, Islam did pretty much go through the Iranian plateu and into Africa trying to convert people. Not always through force, far from it, but they did try and convert people a lot of the time.

I don't know about the Mughals..and even if it's true...why should their actions be attributed to Islam...Islam did..islam wants...Islam bla bla , Is it hard to attribute the action simply to the person who did it ?

I don't deny the islamic conquests...and i have just said they were meant to preach the religion ,not to force people to convert
The best example is my own country were there are still coptic christians who didn't convert and still practice their religion freely and enjoy their civil rights untill now

 

[DeitySlayer]

I don't deny the islamic conquests...and i have just said they were meant to preach the religion ,not to force people to convert
The best example is my own country were there are still coptic christians who didn't convert and still practice their religion freely and enjoy their civil rights untill now

Again, the Mughals.

The best example is my own country were there are still coptic christians who didn't convert and still practice their religion freely and enjoy their civil rights untill now

Does Egypt prescribe the Sharia code as the sole source of law? If yes, my argument stands nullified, but if not, I point towards countries such as Saudi Arabia and Iran where the practice of any other religion apart from Islam is illegal, non-Muslims have to pay a Jizya tax, non-Muslims are worth less money in the eyes of the law, and it is illegal to deconvert from Islam; punishable by death.

Egypt is a good model for moderate Islam, but the sad reality is, it is in the minority amongst Islamic states.

 

[maro]

Is not the nature of a conquest the forcing of a new rule upon a people? I very much doubt the Hindu kings in India willingly accepted Mughal rule. I mean, they were in near-constant warfare for a few centuries after; they wouldn't have been fighting if the occupation was mutually accepted.

I don't think it's an islamic objective to force a rule on people...islam is a religion with general rulings for life....how can the people be ruled by it without accepting it as a religion in the first place ? that would be a tyranny practiced in the name of the religion ?

and if it was practiced in india or wherever..then i think it's wrong and condemmed

 

[nameless]

Islam doesn't want to dominate...people want to dominate....islam doesn't reach its goals by the sword because the ' hearts' of people is the only goal of islam

Where do you see the contradiction ?

I don't think the islamic conquests' purpose was to dominate...but to preach the religion when there was no other communication channels possible....and yes , without them ,i wouldn't have been a muslim ,myself

how did islam conquered India? not by sword?

 

[DeitySlayer]

and if it was practiced in india or wherever..then i think it's wrong and condemmed

Then we have no disagreement on this matter.

My main point is the practice of Islam in what I view as extreme states, like Saudi Arabia and Iran, where it is punishable by death to deconvert from Islam. That's rule through fear and threat, not freedom of choice.

 

[maro]

Does Egypt prescribe the Sharia code as the sole source of law? If yes, my argument stands nullified, but if not, I point towards countries such as Saudi Arabia and Iran where the practice of any other religion apart from Islam is illegal, non-Muslims have to pay a Jizya tax,

Then your arguments stands nullified because the shariah has always been applied in Egypt since the conquest..and she was only secularized recently after the english colonialism

The shariah doesn't prevent any other religion to practice....non muslims pay jizya because unlike muslims ,they don't pay zakat and are not obliged to join the army at the time of war ,whil muslims are obliged to defend them and their property as citizens in the islamic state

non-Muslims are worth less money in the eyes of the law,

I don't understand

and it is illegal to deconvert from Islam; punishable by death.

The apostasy argument is controversial and many scholars think it's only punishable when it's associated with treason..which is what i tend to agree with

Egypt is a good model for moderate Islam, but the sad reality is, it is in the minority amongst Islamic states.

I agree

 

[Breathe]

Islam doesn't want to dominate...people want to dominate....islam doesn't reach its goals by the sword because the ' hearts' of people is the only goal of islam

True people want to dominate - but they want to dominate using Islam. Islam in itself is not an entity so it can't have feelings or desires or anything.

Those who do believe it, though, usually use Islamic eschatology to say why they think this: the whole "Isa will return to kill the Dajjal, he will break the cross and kill the swine" etc to them says that one day Islam will dominate theologically, and by extension, the world will be governed by shari'a. I know not all Muslims accept Isa's return and all that, though - and those who enact upon it use verses from the Qur'an to justify warfare, ignoring other verses to let those believe as they want.

This is a problem with "This is the only way to God, if you don't believe you burn", in my view - exclusivity can bring hostility because of love; you care for someone, so you don't want them to burn in hell, etc.

My $0.02

 

[maro]

how did islam conquered India? not by sword?

well ,i don't know about india....but yes ,muslims used the sword...they used the sword when they came to my country...the fought against the roman empire which was dominant over Egypt then
but they didn't convert people by the sword

they used the sword to be allowed to preach freely....and then they let the people free wether to accept the religion or not

Do you want to say Islam reach its goals by the sword because muslims used the sword to pave the road infront of their dawah ?...so be it....i see no problem with this.....as long as the sword was not used to force anyone to convert or to force a ruling system over people....the truth is that it was used to remove a tyranny that existed already ...a tyranny that prevented people from making their choice regarding islam