Islamic Jihad

[Firemorphic]

- Many millions of Muslims pursue:
- FGM
- general misogyny, homophobia, and anti-semitism
- restricting women's rights, including the right to education
- restricting knowledge that cannot be made to agree with Islamic scripture
- incursions on secular states
- promotion of theocracy
- denial of religious freedoms for non-Muslims

Not a lot of goodwill to be found in those activities

Somehow you saying this kind of crap doesn't surprise me in the least. Well, my expectations at this point are pretty low for you though for having an honest intellectual conversation. You've got no first-hand experience and are incapable of answering anything I've ever asked you in my entire time on this forum but sure, make your laughable prejudiced statements.

 

[loverofhumanity]

B freakin' S!

If I had not read your "holy" bible I might believe
that. But I did read it. Including numbers 31 18

Bible Gateway passage: Judges 6 - New Century Version

Both the Medianites and the Amalekites has attacked Israel and treated them most cruelly.

Every nation has the right of self defense.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Off the top of my head:

- Many millions of Christians pursue:
- defeating a woman's right to have control of her own body
- restricting women's right to education
- teaching ID in schools
- denying climate change
- corporal punishment for kids
- supporting pedophilic clergy
- incursions on secular states

- Many millions of Muslims pursue:
- FGM
- general misogyny, homophobia, and anti-semitism
- restricting women's rights, including the right to education
- restricting knowledge that cannot be made to agree with Islamic scripture
- incursions on secular states
- promotion of theocracy
- denial of religious freedoms for non-Muslims

Not a lot of goodwill to be found in those activities

Not the law of love Christ taught is it? So are they following Christ or their own desires?

 

[ManSinha]

@loverofhumanity

There were excesses committed in the name of the Lord (of both the Qu'ran and the Bible) - many times among members of the same community like Muslim upon Muslim violence.

Now this Lord is said to be all powerful

Why were the individuals committing such excesses not brought to a change of heart or laid low by a personal natural disaster such as a stroke or heart attack? Imagine how many lives would have been saved if such a (godly) intervention would have happened.

Ergo - either the Lord is impotent or does not exist - or does not care (contrary to where I have heard adherents say "God is just") And please do not give me the party line that they will be punished on the day of reckoning or some other BS like that - it never happens - never has in 6000 years of recorded history

Why does human law and human society mete out justice here and now if someone is found guilty? Humans do not wait until the day of reckoning - justice serves as much a role for punishment and rehabilitation as much as an example for others

Either way - such a deity does not deserve the time of the day leave alone worship

 

[Firemorphic]

either the Lord is impotent or does not exist - or does not care (contrary to where I have heard adherents say "God is just") And please do not give me the party line that they will be punished on the day of reckoning or some other BS like that - it never happens - never will[/USER]

"What is 2 + 2? but DO NOT TELL ME THAT IT'S 4! "

I'll tell you one thing: Maya ain't no walk in the park and by the time curtains close and the lead dancers bow to the audience, what will your Soul's tally be?

Lest I say too much or too little!

 

[ManSinha]

"What is 2 + 2? but DO NOT TELL ME THAT IT'S 4! "

I'll tell you one thing: Maya ain't no walk in the park and by the time curtains close and the lead dancers bow to the audience,

Yes Maya exists - but then ascribe it ALL to Maya - including the postulating of a god that can intervene - that is an illusion as well

"what will your Soul's tally be?

Lest I say too much or too little!

I am not too worried about my soul - "Paanch tat ko tan rachiyo - ....... - jeh teh upjiyo .....leen tahay mein maan"

 

[Firemorphic]

Yes Maya exists - but then ascribe it ALL to Maya - including the postulating of a god that can intervene - that is an illusion as well

Well for us, we're nondual in the absolute (transcendent) but we believe in a distinct differentiation between us and God, which is the perfect, pure, transcendent essence. Between us and God, there is Maya, which is the Demiurge of this material world.
The purpose of this life is for the soul/atma to reach perfection, which is the very purpose of messengers. God has never communicated or manifested itself first hand because that'd contradict God's Oneness. It only theophanizes and sends down Angels (I know Sikhs aren't too fluffed about that stuff but I don't care).
The soul's/atma's journey is a test and it passes through Dualism (the material) to achieve perfection.

I am not too worried about my soul

I should have mentioned Atma(n) for good measure but whatever you do or please is all on you, I ain't concerned but from within Hindu and Sufi influences, I do think Sikhism has most of the right tools for you

 

[ManSinha]

Well for us, we're nondual in the absolute (transcendent) but we believe in a distinct differentiation between us and God, which is the perfect, pure, transcendent essence. Between us and God, there is Maya, which is the Demiurge of this material world.

What you are referring to is very close to Dwaita Vedanta or dualism philosophy from the six astika schools of Hindu Yoga Philosophy

I should have mentioned Atma(n) for good measure but whatever you do or please is all on you, I ain't concerned but from within Hindu and Sufi influences, I do think Sikhism has most of the right tools for you

As you are well aware Guru Nanak picked elements of Sufi mysticism including the singing rendering which is a hallmark of the religion to this day

BUT we digress.....

 

[loverofhumanity]

B freakin' S!

If I had not read your "holy" bible I might believe
that. But I did read it. Including numbers 31 18

One other thing is that laws in a desert a quite different to those in

B freakin' S!

If I had not read your "holy" bible I might believe
that. But I did read it. Including numbers 31 18

This is a Baha’i explanation of things like which you described that involved cruelty towards the Israelites by the Midianites and Amalekites continually attacking the innocent.

A conquest can be a praiseworthy thing, and there are times when war becomes the powerful basis of peace, and ruin the very means of reconstruction. If, for example, a high-minded sovereign marshals his troops to block the onset of the insurgent and the aggressor, or again, if he takes the field and distinguishes himself in a struggle to unify a divided state and people, if, in brief, he is ‘waging war for a righteous purpose’, then this seeming wrath is mercy itself, and this apparent tyranny the very substance of justice and this warfare the cornerstone of peace. Abdu’l-Baha

 

[Firemorphic]

What you are referring to is very close to Dwaita Vedanta or dualism philosophy from the six astika schools of Hindu Yoga Philosophy

I am very fond of Dvaita, even moreso than Advaita. Dvaita and the inner-workings of Islam are one and the same in philosophical essence. Some aspects of Advaita also shares bonds with Islam but not so much when it comes to the topic of God, although several Sufis in our history have veered into that direction.

As you are well aware Guru Nanak picked elements of Sufi mysticism including the singing rendering which is a hallmark of the religion to this day

Yes, and that's one of the various things that make me have a affection for with your religion (cause it does interest me a lot).
But in a lot of numerous ways, Sufism is Shi'ism for Sunnis though (that's my humorous way of stating that Sufism shares a lot in common with Shi'ism) but that's for another DIR.

Easy drivin' with that Atma of yours!

 

[Notanumber]

More likely are the rise of India and (continued) China which will shift more manufacturing away from the West. Beside during this so-called Golden Age we had nation-states chemically castrating gays, citizens lynching people due to race, race riots, segregation, etc, etc it didn't even phase the West as far as I can see. The Oil embargo during Carter did more in short time then citizens killing fellow citizens for nonsensical reasons over decades.

The Golden Age that I am talking about is the personal free will that the West has enjoyed without encroaching Sharia law.

 

[Notanumber]

the scriptures of both religions teach only peace and love

Really

 

[Notanumber]

There may not have even been such a person.

That is irrelevant, what is relevant is that Islam exists on the belief that he did exist and that he did say these things.

 

[Audie]

Bible Gateway passage: Judges 6 - New Century Version

Both the Medianites and the Amalekites has attacked Israel and treated them most cruelly.

Every nation has the right of self defense.

Killing babies is self defense in your book.

 

[Audie]

More likely are the rise of India and (continued) China which will shift more manufacturing away from the West. Beside during this so-called Golden Age we had nation-states chemically castrating gays, citizens lynching people due to race, race riots, segregation, etc, etc it didn't even phase the West as far as I can see. The Oil embargo during Carter did more in short time then citizens killing fellow citizens for nonsensical reasons over decades.

What did the oil embsrgo do?

 

[icehorse]

Somehow you saying this kind of crap doesn't surprise me in the least. Well, my expectations at this point are pretty low for you though for having an honest intellectual conversation. You've got no first-hand experience and are incapable of answering anything I've ever asked you in my entire time on this forum but sure, make your laughable prejudiced statements.

Your opinion of me isn't the point. I've made a series of claims. In a debate, that's what you need to focus on, the claims, not your personal junk.

 

[icehorse]

Not the law of love Christ taught is it? So are they following Christ or their own desires?

That's a good question indeed! I don't think Christ would be happy to see how many so-called "Christians" have distorted his messages.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

The way all the goddies talk about how
the others dont have the true faith kinda
hints at a inconvient fact-none of you
guys have "true" this or that or any other.

Ever think derp enough to invedtigate that
ttuth?

The laws and commandments of a Religion is defined in its Holy Book, not by the adherents or their actions.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Killing babies is self defense in your book.

The author? In many of these accounts the author is unknown and not the recipient of a revelation from God. In one instance the author is purported to have recorded tye event some 200 years after it occurred so I question its authenticity as it dies not accord with what the Prophets teach.

We cannot be sure of the authenticity of any of the phrases in the Old or the New Testament. What we can be sure of is when such references or words are cited or quoted in either the Quran or the Bahá'í writings.
(4 July 1947 to an individual believer)

 

[loverofhumanity]

That's a good question indeed! I don't think Christ would be happy to see how many so-called "Christians" have distorted his messages.

Very true and Jesus said so. Jesus would immeduately disassociate Himself from those who commit bad deeds and call themselves followers.

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.