It is done, I think i've found it

[DanielR]

there's nothing to find

 

[stvdv]

there's nobody to search

 

[Segev Moran]

Work on it a bit if you wish. If you really have no idea/
I am mistaken, same place, tomorrow.

Cant think of a one really
Its kind of the other way around
It was understanding, in a most questionable, skeptic mind.
the emotional part came after the "click".

 

[Segev Moran]

there's nothing to find

I disagree.

 

[Audie]

Cant think of a one really
Its kind of the other way around
It was understanding, in a most questionable, skeptic mind.
the emotional part came after the "click".

So you say; we were not there.

If you've surpassed the proof of Generalissimo
Kalam re existence of god, you should post it.

 

[Audie]

I disagree.

Via reasoning applied to data, or, is this a matter of feelings?

Prease exprain your data, if the former.

 

[Segev Moran]

Work on it a bit if you wish. If you really have no idea/
I am mistaken, same place, tomorrow.

And by "click" i meant a fraction of time where hundreds of things connect togather

So you say; we were not there.

If you've surpassed the proof of Generalissimo
Kalam re existence of god, you should post it.

It will take much more than a short post but the basis is understanding the balance.
What really knocked me was the fact that every discovery we made (humans as a specie) was previously described.
It is not described as a interpretation of things, rather literally written and explained (not in a scientific way, rather in a mechanism way).

Imagine Einstein's exact moment when he figured out what he did.

I can tell you m=e/c2 explains the mass of an object.
Unless understanding the ingredients of the formula, it will be very hard to understand.
understanding each part of the formula relies on understanding whats past it and so on.
I guess it works the same.
There is this moment where every part of the equation suddenly makes sense in the big formula.

I hope this makes some sense.

The process i have made was to test what we(humans/science) know about reality and compare it to what the Jewish religion suggests about it.
As it seems, the later nailed it every time and it provides much more (that will be discovered as true or not in the future, and based on what i have seen so far, it seems it will ).

 

[Segev Moran]

If we read the Tanakh we can show that Judaism has been put under a Curse by the Lord; thus claiming logic means paying attention to all details.

Hosea 5:15 I will go and return to my place, until they acknowledge their offense, and seek my face. In their affliction they will seek me earnestly.”

Hosea 5:5-6 The pride of Israel testifies to his face. Therefore Israel and Ephraim will stumble in their iniquity. Judah also will stumble with them. (6) They will go with their flocks and with their herds to seek Yahweh; but they won’t find him. He has withdrawn himself from them.

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you, that you may be no priest to me. Because you have forgotten your God’s law, I will also forget your children.

Isaiah 43:28 Therefore I will profane the princes of the sanctuary; and I will make Jacob a curse, and Israel an insult.”

Isaiah 65:15 You will leave your name for a curse to my chosen; and the Lord Yahweh will kill you. He will call his servants by another name,

Zechariah 8:13 It shall come to pass that, as you were a curse among the nations, house of Judah and house of Israel, so I will save you, and you shall be a blessing. Don’t be afraid. Let your hands be strong.”

Jeremiah 25:18 Jerusalem, and the cities of Judah, with its kings and its princes, to make them a desolation, an astonishment, a hissing, and a curse, as it is today;

Thus whilst I'm glad you've started on the road to understanding God; individual religions are only the stepping stones to finding it on the other side.

In my opinion.

I assume we are in a disagreement

 

[Segev Moran]

teaching by means of the trickery of men,

I dont think its trickery, rather a different way of thinking about things.
I come for the "trickery" pov. the trickery is on yourself, not on others

 

[stvdv]

Its kind of hard to explain, and that actually drives me nuts i have to say but the more i learn, the more it fits (to me of course )

"The truth can not be put in words, only silence can convey it". As is declared by the saints met and the scriptures I have read.
So I have the feeling you hit the jackpot, by not being able to explain it. Don't let your mind "drive you nuts" I would say. Especially seeing it fits more and more.

 

[Segev Moran]

Try to stop thinking might give an experience, is my experience. You probably did, hence the change.

The only thing i do in the past few weeks is thinking. non stop thinking. every time i think i am imagining things (and i have quite a few moments like these), i find it to be the other way around.
It appears i imagined i knew things while the reality was i knew only a fraction
I used to call it god of the gaps I discovered the gap was me and not the other way around.

 

[stvdv]

The only thing i do in the past few weeks is thinking. non stop thinking. every time i think i am imagining things (and i have quite a few moments like these), i find it to be the other way around.
It appears i imagined i knew things while the reality was i knew only a fraction
I used to call it god of the gaps I discovered the gap was me and not the other way around.

Makes sense what you say. Once I heard a master say "snap your fingers twice", God can be experienced in the silence in between 2 snaps.

 

[wizanda]

I assume we are in a disagreement

That depends on if we want to be on the same page...

As an Arch Angel sent before the Tribulation, we can come to agreement if we're logical...

Would rather find an enlightened understanding between us; just disagreeing, without fully comprehending why, would be naive.

In my opinion.

Please note my statements are never to inflict suffering or harm on any being; literally just want to deal with the data in the most logical method.

 

[Segev Moran]

Makes sense what you say. Once I heard a master say "snap your fingers twice", God can be experienced in the silence in between 2 snaps.

That is not what i've meant

 

[Segev Moran]

That depends on if we want to be on the same page...

As an Arch Angel sent before the Tribulation, we can come to agreement if we're logical...

Would rather find an enlightened understanding between us; just disagreeing, without fully comprehending why, would be naive.

In my opinion.

Please note my statements are never to inflict suffering or harm on any being; literally just want to deal with the data in the most logical method.

Here goes

If we read the Tanakh we can show that Judaism has been put under a Curse by the Lord;

I Disagree with the word Curse I can't see how having the need to study something makes it a curse?
As i see it, if you could reveal things in an instant, the lesson or knowledge you gain have a very low impact on you or your life So i would say it is the vice versa of a curse.

thus claiming logic means paying attention to all details.

I Agree here, details are very important when studying. but it has got nothing to do with religion though, it is true to every aspect of life.
Some people need to start with the big picture and drill down, some people (like me) need to understand the details in order to see the big picture.
each way has its advantages i guess

Hosea 5:15 I will go and return to my place, until they acknowledge their offense, and seek my face. In their affliction they will seek me earnestly.”

I don't see this as a curse rather a description of a situation.

Hosea 5:5-6 The pride of Israel testifies to his face. Therefore Israel and Ephraim will stumble in their iniquity. Judah also will stumble with them. (6) They will go with their flocks and with their herds to seek Yahweh; but they won’t find him. He has withdrawn himself from them.

The word is חלץ which is not really "withdrawn". I would say "released" is more fitting.

Isaiah 43:28 Therefore I will profane the princes of the sanctuary; and I will make Jacob a curse, and Israel an insult.”

Cant find any reference to a curse in this verse

Isaiah 65:15 You will leave your name for a curse to my chosen; and the Lord Yahweh will kill you. He will call his servants by another name,

Same here, nothing related to a curse.

can you say what you mean when you say "curse" ?

Zechariah 8:13 It shall come to pass that, as you were a curse among the nations, house of Judah and house of Israel, so I will save you, and you shall be a blessing. Don’t be afraid. Let your hands be strong.”

Same here. The word used is קללה, which can translate to a curse, but not in the context it appears in this verse.
In this verse it means that they will be "hated" (I wouldnt use this word, but i lack the knowledge to describe what i mean in english)

Jeremiah 25:18 Jerusalem, and the cities of Judah, with its kings and its princes, to make them a desolation, an astonishment, a hissing, and a curse, as it is today;

Same here, the word curse is not fitting.

Thus whilst I'm glad you've started on the road to understanding God; individual religions are only the stepping stones to finding it on the other side.

I dont think religion has got anything to do with discovering god.
I think that once i stopped studying the religion part of things, my mind was finally open to understand things.

And of course, IMO only


,

 

[Samantha Rinne]

I am a very logical person.
I'm skeptical in thought and I love studying about the different religious and myth of different cultures.

I've been an atheist for several years, but only recently I've discovered I am really not (???)
It feels like "Coming out", but feels right to write this.

From being someone who honestly did not believe a god exists, today my thought are much different.

I've been studying the Jewish religion for some time now. I am Jewish, so no surprise I was drawn to the Jewish beliefs.

I must say that I was "blind" in a way to the things i am finally beginning to understand.

There are tons of things i can't yet accept in the Jewish religion, but the more i learn, the clearer it gets.

So there, its out. I really do believe there is a god! after a long process of internal "war", i have come to the point that everything starts to come into place.

I am not a religious person (yet?), and it seems very far from me, but no matter how i turn things, there are answer in the Jewish knowledge.

I find answers, and answers keep popping to me.

the one thing that really makes my mind twirl, is the fact that it is "too" obvious that out of all the Jewish knowledge strikes me with its accurate description of reality and much too often to be a "lucky shot", the Jewish texts describe many things we only today starting to realize as a human specie.

Don't get me wrong, I still think religion is very very dangerous. I think religion MUST be supervised and criticized and i still can't accept answers that are enigmatic.

So, anyways... there. I'm out

My fellow atheists are welcome to share their thoughts (I would actually love that, i think it will make me study things in a much more down to earth way)

Cheers

Congratulations, I guess. I'm not sure I understand your fears about religion being dangerous (IMHO people are dangerous), but okay.

 

[Segev Moran]

Via reasoning applied to data, or, is this a matter of feelings?

Prease exprain your data, if the former.

Both
Nothing is a way to describe absence.
It is varied in each purview you use it.
In content, it can describe emptiness,
In science, it can mean either an absolute vacuum (although we never managed to achieve such condition) or absence of matter.
In math it can be 0
In algebra it can be an empty set ({})
In emotions it can represent a lack of significance.
And so on, so nothing cannot be found rather defined imo.

 

[wizanda]

can you say what you mean when you say "curse" ?

The Curse is stipulated in Deuteronomy 28 & Leviticus 26... It was placed since the 2nd temple destruction to be historical with the timeline.

I can't see how having the need to study something makes it a curse?

You don't need to study it for it to be a Curse; it exists as something that has, and is still taking place.

In my opinion.

 

[Segev Moran]

Explain to me how you want me to explain it.

Explain it as you mean it

What i understand from it is that by saying God nature, you refer to a measurable predicable conduct of god.
This is a term i dont accept so that is why i asked you to explain what you've meant.

Suddenly I am sounding to you as confused.
Not suddenly

I know that and I know why. You don't know that.

See... confusing How do you know what I know? and how do you know anything about me other than what i write here?

So to explain I almost start sounding like I am talking in riddles which all the previous should feel like to you or at least obscure and odd. I know that.

???

To put it another way possibly more clearly visualize this form of writing as mechanical metronome. It runs at 60 beats a minute metered precisely.

That i can understand

We can play along and communicate in that even in debate as long as it is precisely 60 beats per minute. What I have alluded to God nature is the metronome isn't real or fundemental. In a sense Einstein articulated this. The mechanical clock is relative subjective. There is another form of time and it is felt first written second. That's called kairos. I disregard theologians on that topic as any sane person should. They have no clue they are art critics not artists or very very rarely are artists on extremely rare occasions.

Sorry. Lost you here.
I understand your reference to subjective time, but i cant see how it fits to things i have written
When you say Art critics, you mean they only value an old art and are not part of making it? if so i agree.
Still don't understand the connection though

In the Catholic tradition they have a term its called "the sacred heart." 60 beats perminute is nearly exact to the human heart beat it

No it is not. not at rest at least

can be felt first independent of a metronome. In that state God/nature is not a mechanically metered separate terms but a single note of notes as one. Religion tends to be mostly modern intellectualizing and some tiny accidental awareness maybe about this term sacred heart.

Still confused

From just a simple evolution ary perspective heart is way way older than brain. And life can exist without both but that life only goes by kairos or feel.

Didnt get it.
I Agree life can be without heart and brain as we know them, but life have a very specific mechanism that we know just a fraction about.

All the above wierdly obscure I am most certain. But that's because of the question. View attachment 22879

What question?

It seems i really dont understand your words (i understand them literally but cant grasp what it is you are trying to say).
Sorry.
I would appreciate if you could simplify things.
cheers

 

[Segev Moran]

I'm very happy for you discovering God and spirituality, and it's value and truth!
Also, congrats on being one of God's "chosen people".

Lol,
Its not about who god chose, rather who chose god