Then Jesus need not have gone to the cross ,if you and everyone else , were fine on their own .
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Its Good news .
- Thread starter John1.12
- Start date
By Definition the word literally means ' good news ' . Gospel.
InChrist
Free4ever
I think the reality is that no created being can ever be perfect simply because only God is God, only God is perfect. Human beings are not God; never will be, therefore on our own or by our own less than God ability cannot be perfect. The sensible love offered by God is that He provides a way to receive righteousness and perfection through Christ as a free gift. God does not desire any to be separated from Him in eternal damnation with satan, but neither does He force anyone into heaven. Each one is free to choose to be in the new heaven and earth with Him forever or not. That is true freedom and love.
Psalm 19
Psalm 19
Kjv
19 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.
Rom 1
( This describes how people wind up worshipping Turtles and elephants also)
18¶For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24¶Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
The truth is that 10 out of 10 people die . The truth ( according to the bible) is that without God a person does indeed end up in hell . Now this isn't the ' Gospel ' this is the reality of peoples destiny without Christ .
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
That's not the point. The question is, will a loving father reject his children simply because they are not perfect? That is not a loving father, that is an abusive father. A loving father disciplines and teaches his children so that they become better, raises them to maturity. He doesn't cast them aside because they don't meet the standard of perfection.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Jesus' death accomplished nothing. There was no reason for it. I'm sorry.
We only become a ' child of God ' through the new birth. John 1.12 . Every one who is not ' born again ' and in Christ, is not a child of God .
That's not what the bible says .
2 cor 5.19
17Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
18And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
The 1st truth is obvious.
You can claim the second as truth, but that does not make it true. Its not reality. Just a false belief that you have.
So what? The book's name is wrong then.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
You're conflating "beliefs" with "facts" and "objective" with "subjective", thus it might be wiser to start your sentence off with "I believe...".
The bible says We only become a ' child of God ' through the new birth. John 1.12 . Every one who is not ' born again ' and in Christ, is not a child of God . According to the bible.
halbhh
The wonder and awe of "all things".
Equal: equal to everyone it seems:
1 Peter 4:6 That is why the gospel was preached even to those who are now dead, so that they might be judged as men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
(so that all get the same chance it seems)
Why?
It seems this is the answer for why:
Romans 2:11 For God does not show favoritism.
God's impartial Justice is laid out in Romans 2:6-16:
6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”
7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.
11 For God does not show favoritism.
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
And that's part of why we need Christ: a redeemer that can remove the accumulation of our wrongdoing in life, if we repent and rely on His cleansing of us.
oh dear
I asked you how to infer things without the Bible, and you clarify that by mentioning the Bible? Lol
is that all Christianity reduces to? A pointless exercise of circular reasoning, that collapses after the simplest logical challenge?
ciao
- viole
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
That's according to the Bible along with the view that the Bible is absolutely inerrant, which really makes it a form of idolatry. The Bible is about God from a subjective perspective, but with that being said, it isn't God. The Church never viewed the Bible as being totally inerrant or perfect.
Jeremiah Ames
Well-Known Member
ok, I will try
it’s not easy for me to speak totally at ease
this is the internet after all
but consider that the Lord wants the absolute best for everyone
consider whether an infinite love, the source of all goodness and truth, could punish anyone
but then this infinite love cannot allow any evil to get near itself, nor near the heaven where it resides
what is the answer?
what if those individuals who have chosen a life of falsity and evil, through their own free will and choices, while are earth, must go to a “place” of their own making, where they can exist in their evils with others like them?
what if a hellish person, who resides in hell, was allowed to visit heaven? would he like it, or would he hate it and feel horribly out of place? would he possibly desire to get back to people who think and act more like him?
i have had an experience that may illustrate this:
i once had a good friend who I enjoyed many years spending time with. he had a habit of speaking very very poorly about everyone he knew, many whom I knew as well. i would listen, as a friend. i assumed he surely wouldn’t speak evil of me, would he? after years of this, I then found the Lord, and my desire to spend time in gossip fests no longer was there. at first, I would steer the conversations to other benign topics, but eventually had to mention that I did not like gossiping. he acted like i was attempting to murder him. how dare I say such a thing? he said he was only providing useful “information”.
and then, he eventually threw me away, and found others to continue living the life he loved.
just my ramblings
Jeremiah Ames
Well-Known Member
what an interesting thought. i happen to agree completely but the fact you call it idolatry is spot on. it’s a sad state, what is happening to Christianity in America. it’s possible part of the problem is their inerrancy concept regarding the Bible. at the least it’s just one more way to move people further from the Lord, and closer to man made precepts.
Sand Dancer
Currently catless
Eternal Stockholm Syndrome.
Actually, this is what you asked " Ok, should they know then? How does it work?
How do people infer the Christian God just by observing "creation"?