Jesus and his gospel

[HouseofIsrael]

Was Jesus really the Johnny Good Fella? the Jesus i read about did not seem as a good fit at least for the people of his day -he was hated by most people and hardly had any followers. However, whilst our views may differ i believe he WAS a great man and God in human form when he walk the earth. His teachings were very different to that being taught by many religions and so was his customs.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Was Jesus really the Johnny Good Fella? the Jesus i read about did not seem as a good fit at least for the people of his day -he was hated by most people and hardly had any followers. However, whilst our views may differ i believe he WAS a great man and God in human form when he walk the earth. His teachings were very different to that being taught by many religions and so was his customs.

Given that this is a debate forum rather than some online simulation of a kindergarten show-and-tell, can you offer any reason why you or your belief should be viewed as credible. Also, would you care to explain and substantiate these "very different" customs (as opposed to "very different" teachings) you claim with such certitude?

 

[HouseofIsrael]

The posting of this thread was a mistake and wasn't intended for for this forum. However, if you are interested in a discussion i would be more than happy to get involve here.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

Mr Soule: my ambitions are not to prove my religious beliefs credible to anyone. People worship creatures and bricks instead of God and many people do not believe in God's existence period. I am here to share and learn in humility. However, if you would like to engage in a discussion based on a thread that was posted i will be more than happy to do so.

 

[Jakaceel]

Given that this is a debate forum rather than some online simulation of a kindergarten show-and-tell, can you offer any reason why you or your belief should be viewed as credible. Also, would you care to explain and substantiate these "very different" customs (as opposed to "very different" teachings) you claim with such certitude?

yall are harse, haha....

 

[Cordoba]

Was Jesus really the Johnny Good Fella? the Jesus i read about did not seem as a good fit at least for the people of his day -he was hated by most people and hardly had any followers.

While we don't know the exact number of his followers, Jesus, peace be upon him, was only hated either because he teached spirituality to people who were very materialistic, or because his teachings threatened to take away power from those who had political and religious power at the time

I'm sure many normal people loved him, especially sincere believers and surely also those he cured from illness

Don't you think?

 

[Beaudreaux]

Mr Soule: my ambitions are not to prove my religious beliefs credible to anyone. People worship creatures and bricks instead of God and many people do not believe in God's existence period. I am here to share and learn in humility. However, if you would like to engage in a discussion based on a thread that was posted i will be more than happy to do so.

Ok, well, I'm one of the ones who doesn't "believe in God's existence period". Can you explain how such a belief is credible whe there is no evidence for it whatsoever?

 

[Humanistheart]

While we don't know the exact number of his followers, Jesus, peace be upon him, was only hated either because he teached spirituality to people who were very materialistic, or because his teachings threatened to take away power from those who had political and religious power at the time

I'm sure many normal people loved him, especially sincere believers and surely also those he cured from illness

Don't you think?

This is a common misconception popularized by the christian bible. Materialism had little to do with it. The pharasee's were turned into the villians of the bible long after jesus (assuming he was indeed a real person) lived and dead. The pharase's are responcible for preserving Judiasm after the destruction of the temple of the jewish diaspora. Christians turned them into villians because the continued to teach the Torah after christians claimed jesus fulfilled it. You cannot full fill a law however, and jesus never fulfilled one single messianic prophecy. Then theres the roman Pilate who was the only prefect to ever be recalled from an asignment for being too bloody. He killed dozens of would be messiah's in his day. Dispite the story in the bible (which no one was around to hear so how did the author know what was said?) Pilate would have killed jesus in a heartbeat if he'd caused any trouble. Trouble like making an uproar at the temple.

And the bible makes it clear that the people who knew him best thought he was crazy. His own family never addressed him as god or savior and the small village he grew up in laughed him out of town.

 

[Cordoba]

Most prophets were persecuted and laughed at by their people, including Prophet Abraham, peace be upon him, and many others

<< His own family never addressed him as god or savior >>

Makes sense because Jesus was not God

He was God's prophet sent to guide the lost sheep of Israel ....

Did the Jewish leaders at the time not have power at the time which they feared they would lose if people followed Jesus?

 

[HouseofIsrael]

Cordoba of course i do, and i agree with that comment totally.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

This is something really to think about -at least i do, with all the good things many religious people talk about Jesus today and praise him for, i often wonder if he should return today and bring the same gospel he did then -would we continue in the same manner of praise we do now or would we sing a different song...

...sometimes it seem as if good men only become good after they are gone.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

Everything that exist is evidence of God's existence, or was it science? bottom line is really, if you don't believe in God's existence then i wont know how to relate anything God to you.

 

[Humanistheart]

Most prophets were persecuted and laughed at by their people, including Prophet Abraham, peace be upon him, and many others

<< His own family never addressed him as god or savior >>

Makes sense because Jesus was not God

He was God's prophet sent to guide the lost sheep of Israel ....

Did the Jewish leaders at the time not have power at the time which they feared they would lose if people followed Jesus?

Jesus would never have troubled the FEW jewish people who worked with the roman government. He was a minor individual which most never heard of during his lifetime. This is why we have no proof that he lived at all. If he'd been important enough to be a threat there would be something written on it. John the Baptist we have historical refference to, in roman documents and in jewish ones from the time. Yet nothing of Jesus.

Jesus was not a prophet. According to jewish tradition a prophet can only arise when Isreal was free under gods rule, but isreal was under rome's rule at the time. Jesus could not have been a prophet, nor could he have been a messiah as he did not fulfill one messianic prophecy.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

For the Romans it was all about power and money, Jesus brought a gospel that would ultimately take that away and so yes he was the treat of the day for them, they just couldn't believe an ordinary man that had no material wealth could be the Son of God who also heal sick people and raise the dead -only God has such power.

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

This is something really to think about -at least i do, with all the good things many religious people talk about Jesus today and praise him for, i often wonder if he should return today and bring the same gospel he did then -would we continue in the same manner of praise we do now or would we sing a different song...

...sometimes it seem as if good men only become good after they are gone.

I think this is a great insight. Many of God's prophets are rejected, mocked, and scorned. Sometimes even cast out or killed. Yet people look back and say "We wouldn't have done that. We would have accepted the prophets." At the same time they may very well be rejecting the prophet that God has sent to their generation.

25 And now when ye talk, ye say: If our days had been in the days of our fathers of old, we would not have slain the prophets; we would not have stoned them, and cast them out.
26 Behold ye are worse than they; for as the Lord liveth, if a prophet come among you and declareth unto you the word of the Lord, which testifieth of your sins, and iniquities, ye are angry with him, and cast him out and seek all manner of ways to destroy him; yea, you will say that he is a false prophet, and that he is a sinner, and of the devil, because he testifieth that your deeds are evil.
27 But behold, if a man shall come among you and shall say: Do this, and there is no iniquity; do that and ye shall not suffer; yea, he will say: Walk after the pride of your own hearts; yea, walk after the pride of your eyes, and do whatsoever your heart desireth&#8212;and if a man shall come among you and say this, ye will receive him, and say that he is a prophet.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

Jesus was more than just a prophet, during his time it was all about him that's why they nail him to the cross early and he wasn't the only one check out Daniel, Peter, Paul, Jonah, John the revelator etc almost all the prophets were wanderers and had to flee many places to save their own lives, they were often taken in captive by the powers that be which of course worship by their own accord instead of God and had their own beliefs and today it's no different. And this is why all things must be restored because in the beginning was God and his word, today it's confusion and diverse beliefs, don't want to step on no one's toes but that's just the way i see it, the evidence are all there in the modified book called the bible.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

Alleluia, wonderful.

 

[Humanistheart]

Jesus was more than just a prophet, during his time it was all about him that's why they nail him to the cross early and he wasn't the only one check out Daniel, Peter, Paul, Jonah, John the revelator etc almost all the prophets were wanderers and had to flee many places to save their own lives, they were often taken in captive by the powers that be which of course worship by their own accord instead of God and had their own beliefs and today it's no different. And this is why all things must be restored because in the beginning was God and his word, today it's confusion and diverse beliefs, don't want to step on no one's toes but that's just the way i see it, the evidence are all there in the modified book called the bible.

There were many other potential messiah's such as Honi the Circle Drawer and they all had the same end, death at the hands of the romans. Niether jesus nor his disciples were unique in this.

The modified book? So your aware that the bible read today is not the same as the one originally compiled in the Nicen Creed. Or did you mean something else?

 

[HouseofIsrael]

My friend i am not a historian and there are lots of things about biblical history i know not -indeed Jesus and his disciples were not the only great people that died by the Romans, of course not. About the bible: indeed. I am aware. The bible is modified all the time and reason for that would make discussion too complex and blow things out of proportion for me right now. the bible we read today is a very small portion of the real deal and it is believed that the omitted books and writings were systematic in nature with very planned intent. the only modified bible version i read today is the king james because it's the closest you would get to anything real about what was actually written i believe.

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

My friend i am not a historian and there are lots of things about biblical history i know not -indeed Jesus and his disciples were not the only great people that died by the Romans, of course not. About the bible: indeed. I am aware. The bible is modified all the time and reason for that would make discussion too complex and blow things out of proportion for me right now. the bible we read today is a very small portion of the real deal and it is believed that the omitted books and writings were systematic in nature with very planned intent. the only modified bible version i read today is the king james because it's the closest you would get to anything real about what was actually written i believe.

Paul knew that this would take place. In 2 Thessalonians 2 he states:
" Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"