Jesus did not die on the Cross

[sojourner]

Thanks for your input.

Paul and Church doctored/redacted anonymous writings known as Gospels for the purpose of making Jesus a god or son of god.
Notwithstanding the above; there are enough clues right in the Gospels, reading between the lines, to make it obvious that Jesus did not die on the Cross.


Regards

All texts have been edited -- not just the gospels. And Paul wasn't an editor.

One doesn't "read between the lines" in exegeting the texts.

 

[outhouse]

Acts is reliable.

That is up for serious debate


But lets not feed it here.

 

[paarsurrey]

False. Acts was written by the author of Luke. Luke-Acts was originally one document. Acts is reliable.

OK; but not written by Jesus or by any person explicitly authorized by Jesus to write on his behalf.

Regards

 

[Muffled]

well...in the ancient age, thousands of people died on the cross.
The Greeks crucified the Carthaginian prisoners even in IV century BC
so...why not Jesus?

I believe the Bible.

 

[Muffled]

Sure; thousands of people died on the Cross but there were some who were put on the Cross but survived. Jesus did not die on the Cross he was delivered from the Cross in near-dead position.

Jesus had prophesied it.

Regards

I don't beleive there is any evidence that Jesus was taken from the cross alive.

 

[Muffled]

Jesus was put to death by being nailed to a stake, or upright wooden pole. Acts 5:30 reports; "The God of our forefathers raised up Jesus, whom you killed, hanging him on a stake." So Jesus died on a stake, not a cross. I believe it is on the basis of Jesus ransom sacrifice we have the hope of everlasting life. (John 3:16)

My translation says tree not stake and a tree has branches. I believe this is a JW myth that only has partial credibility in that records show that crucifixion was usually done by nailing the person and crossbar on the stake making it a cross.

 

[sojourner]

OK; but not written by Jesus or by any person explicitly authorized by Jesus to write on his behalf.

Regards

If that's the criterion, there would be no bible at all.

 

[Estro Felino]

Delivered by the Roman Officials.
Pilate did not find any fault with Jesus; it is very much in the Bible.

Regards

If they did, they surely gained Heaven for doing that.

 

[paarsurrey]

I believe the Bible.

One may believe in anything blindly;that is one's birth-right; please enjoy it.

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Jesus was put to death by being nailed to a stake, or upright wooden pole. Acts 5:30 reports; "The God of our forefathers raised up Jesus, whom you killed, hanging him on a stake." So Jesus died on a stake, not a cross. I believe it is on the basis of Jesus ransom sacrifice we have the hope of everlasting life. (John 3:16)

Jesus death never happened; he was delivered from the Cross in near-dead position.

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

It's also very much in the bible that Jesus did die, that he was checked to be sure he was dead, and that he was buried.

It was just an assumption; none of the scribes of Gospels was an eye-witness of the event of crucifixion; they all fled away as per Matthew.

Had they sided with Jesus; crucifixion might have not happened. They deserted Jesus.

Why trust them?

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

I think you missed the point. From the atheist point of view jesus did not die on the cross because he never existed in the first place.

I can understand Atheists viewpoint. The Jesus of Bible a god or son of god was a fictional character of Paul and the Church invented for Bible; sure such mythical character never existed.

Jesus son of Mary did exist.

Regards

 

[Estro Felino]

Jesus son of Mary did exist.

Regards

There must be a reason why the Qur'an names an entire sura after Mary, and not after Jesus. In fact, the reason is that Mary is the most perfect and divine human being.
She is the living proof of how a simple human being can become divine.

 

[paarsurrey]

I don't beleive there is any evidence that Jesus was taken from the cross alive.

Jesus was a strong man; what would have happened to him; other persons put on the Cross were alive; so must Jesus, specifically because he was to show sign of Jonah to the adulterous Jews as he had promised to them.

So; definitely he did not die.

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

All texts have been edited -- not just the gospels. And Paul wasn't an editor.

One doesn't "read between the lines" in exegeting the texts.

Haven't you seen an interpretations made by the Christian? I understand there are a lot of them.

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

If that's the criterion, there would be no bible at all.

Did Jesus say that there would be an NT Bible? If there had been any need he would have written it himself.

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

If they did, they surely gained Heaven for doing that.

That is up to G-d to decide.

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

There must be a reason why the Qur'an names an entire sura after Mary, and not after Jesus. In fact, the reason is that Mary is the most perfect and divine human being.
She is the living proof of how a simple human being can become divine.

That is because she was regarded a bad women by the Jews; so Quran wanted to clear her from such blames.

Quran mentions it.

Regards

 

[Estro Felino]

That is because she was regarded a bad women by the Jews; so Quran wanted to clear her from such blames.

Quran mentions it.

Regards

wow, really? I love the Qur'an!

 

[paarsurrey]

Originally Posted by paarsurrey
That is because she was regarded a bad women by the Jews; so Quran wanted to clear her from such blames.

Quran mentions it.

wow, really? I love the Qur'an!

I quote here from Quran:

[4:154] The People of the Book ask thee to cause a Book to descend on them from heaven. They asked Moses a greater thing than this: they said, ‘Show us Allah openly.’ Then a destructive punishment overtook them because of their transgression. Then they took the calf for worship after clear Signs had come to them, but We pardoned even that. And We gave Moses manifest authority.
[4:155] And We raised high above them the Mount while making a covenant with them, and We said to them, ‘Enter the gate submissively,’ and We said to them, ‘Transgress not in the matter of the Sabbath.’ And We took from them a firm covenant.
[4:156] Then, because of their breaking of their covenant, and their denial of the Signs of Allah, and their seeking to kill the Prophets unjustly, and their saying: ‘Our hearts are wrapped in covers,’ — nay, but Allah has sealed them because of their disbelief, so they believe not but little —
[4:157] And because of their disbelief and their uttering against Mary a grievous calumny,

The Holy Quran Arabic text with Translation in English text and Search Engine - Al Islam Online

Regards