Jesus is not God Almighty Himself

[nPeace]

Christ is not mutable, the scripture makes it abundantly clear that he is immutable.
Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever." If Christ was mutable what you are saying would be absolutely true, it was Jesus who said "before Abraham was I am"

What do these scriptures say:
Could you explain particularly John 1:1, 14; 17:5; Acts 2:33-35; Colossians 1:15; Revelation 3:14; Daniel 7:9-14; Psalms 2; 110:1.
Thanks.

 

[nPeace]

This is a sermon i wrote two years ago maybe it will help.
TITLE: The ONLY one true Jesus &
gospel declared.
SCRIPTURE: 2 Corinthians 11:4 "For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him."
1 Corinthians 15:1"I declare unto you the gospel..."
1 Corinthians 15:3-4 "For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
PROPOSITION: to use these texts and others to show who the one true Jesus is, and what the one true gospel is. and to show that a counterfeit Jesus and gospel can never save. and also to show that anyone can be saved through the one true gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ no matter how many sins they may have committed, because through the gospel Christ became a propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of mankind by answering God's just demands in an irrefutable way. In the words "it is finished" we see Justice satisfied, and the sin debt paid.
1.Who is the one true Jesus?
A. The one true Jesus is 100% man without the sin nature, he had no earthly father, but was"made of a woman made under the law" he was of the actual seed of Abraham, born of a virgin.
Hebrews 2:16 "For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham."
Isaiah 7:14 "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall CONCEIVE, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel."
B.The one true Jesus is referred to as the "man child" and and he referred to himself as the "Son of man". the scripture declares that there is only one kind of flesh for men and the one true Jesus "became flesh and dwelt among us".
Revelation 12:5 "And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne..."
1 Corinthians 15:39 "All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds."
C. The one true Jesus is also 100% God, Christ said "before Abraham was I Am" he is co-equal and co-eternal with the Father. He is "the same yesterday, today and forever". he "was with God and was God" and is the creator of all things.
John 1:1-3 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made."
D. The one true Jesus is worshiped by angles and men as He should be. Christ never refused this homage because of his worthiness.
Hebrews 1:6 "And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him."
Matthew 8:2 "And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean."
2.) Why did the one true Jesus have to be 100% God and 100% man at the same time to be a saviour for sinners?
A. In order to fulfill scripture the seed of the woman must bruise the serpents head, and the only way this could happen is if God became a man. Genesis 3:15 "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
B. Because the law was given to men and as sinners all mankind are under the curse of it, It was necessary that the Savior be a man and be placed under the law so that he might fulfill the law and provide a righteousness for those he would purchase through his blood.
Matthew 5:17-18 "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."
Galatians 4:4-5 "But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, MADE OF A WOMEN, MADE UNDER THE LAW, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons."
C. Because Christ is God and holy by nature he is separate from all that is common or unclean, he is also positively pure having a perfect love for God and man. Only the perfect God man could make the statement that "he always did those things which please the father", and only the perfect God man could challenge his hearers in asking "which one of you convinces me of sin". The Lord Jesus Christ is the only one who could have offered himself for sinners "as a lamb without blemish and without spot" to the glory of God the Father.
3.) Why do some religionists preach a counterfeit Jesus?
A. The scripture makes it very clear that anyone who teaches that Jesus was not "made of a woman" and of the actual seed of Abraham is "a deciever and an antichrist." 2 John 1:7 "For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist."
B. The scripture also makes it clear that Christ is God and the creator of all things, anyone who would deny this is just as much a minister of Satan as those who would deny Jesus his humanity.
2 Corinthians 11:14-15 "And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works."
Titus 1:16 "They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate."
4.) What is the only one true gospel?
A. The only one true gospel is that the one true Jesus "died for our sins". When the scripture says Christ died for our sins it means that Christ made a full payment for our sins, he vindicated the glory, majesty and the law of God through his infinite but temporal suffering.
1 Peter 2:24 "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed."
B. The only one true Gospel is that the one true Jesus "was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures"
This was a bodily resurrection, the tomb was empty the disciples felt the nail scars in his hands, and also felt the scar in his side. Christ's resurrection demonstrated that he was all that he claimed to be, and that his power, and might were infinite.
John 10:17-18 "Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father."
C.The only one true gospel is that Christ is the ONLY Saviour and that our character, religious affections, and righteousness cannot save us, only damn us. in short, sinners cannot be their own saviour, or in anyway help Christ save them.
Romans 11:6 "And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."
D. The only one true gospel is that even though we deserve God's infinite displeasure because of our iniquity, God through the ONLY one true Jesus has "abolished death and brought life and immortality through the gospel."
2 Timothy 1:9-10 "Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, NOT ACCORDING TO OUR WORKS, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:"
Question: Have you received a counterfeit Christ? Have you embraced a counterfeit gospel of self effort? Have you put all your trust in the ONLY one true Jesus? If you are not trusting Christ ALONE, than you have never repented of your sins and if you die in this state of death you will know eternal death and perfect despair, your "worm shall not die neither shall your fire be quenched"
Galatians 1:8 "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed."
CONCLUSION: Counterfeiters only counterfeit that which has great worth they never counterfeit trash, but the counterfeit is always trash. Satan is the great counterfeiter, and he would love to offer you a counterfeit Christ, a counterfeit Spirit, and a counterfeit gospel of works salvation, don't fall for the trash he offers! Repent of your sins and receive the Only one true Christ and gospel today!
Mark 1:15 "And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel."

So you believe Jesus was 100% man. Not God-man?
Oh. My mistake. You believe 100% man and I 00% God at the same time.
I will wait for your explanation to the scriptures above before proceeding.

While I await that, could you also add an answer to who received the payment of the purchase God made?

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

I cover this on point 2

Why did the one true Jesus have to be 100% God and 100% man at the same time to be a saviour for sinners?
A. In order to fulfill scripture the seed of the woman must bruise the serpents head, and the only way this could happen is if God became a man. Genesis 3:15 "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
B. Because the law was given to men and as sinners all mankind are under the curse of it, It was necessary that the Savior be a man and be placed under the law so that he might fulfill the law and provide a righteousness for those he would purchase through his blood.
Matthew 5:17-18 "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."
Galatians 4:4-5 "But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, MADE OF A WOMEN, MADE UNDER THE LAW, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons."
C. Because Christ is God and holy by nature he is separate from all that is common or unclean, he is also positively pure having a perfect love for God and man. Only the perfect God man could make the statement that "he always did those things which please the father", and only the perfect God man could challenge his hearers in asking "which one of you convinces me of sin". The Lord Jesus Christ is the only one who could have offered himself for sinners "as a lamb without blemish and without spot" to the glory of God the Father.

 

[nPeace]

I cover this on point 2

Why did the one true Jesus have to be 100% God and 100% man at the same time to be a saviour for sinners?
A. In order to fulfill scripture the seed of the woman must bruise the serpents head, and the only way this could happen is if God became a man. Genesis 3:15 "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
B. Because the law was given to men and as sinners all mankind are under the curse of it, It was necessary that the Savior be a man and be placed under the law so that he might fulfill the law and provide a righteousness for those he would purchase through his blood.
Matthew 5:17-18 "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."
Galatians 4:4-5 "But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, MADE OF A WOMEN, MADE UNDER THE LAW, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons."
C. Because Christ is God and holy by nature he is separate from all that is common or unclean, he is also positively pure having a perfect love for God and man. Only the perfect God man could make the statement that "he always did those things which please the father", and only the perfect God man could challenge his hearers in asking "which one of you convinces me of sin". The Lord Jesus Christ is the only one who could have offered himself for sinners "as a lamb without blemish and without spot" to the glory of God the Father.

No. I am not asking why. I would like to discuss that based on your answers to this post.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

if you don't understand it might be best for you just to pray, and ask the Lord to give you the wisdom.
James 1:5 "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."
The Holy Spirit will be a far better teacher to you then I could ever be. I always encourage people to pray so that God might show them the truth.

 

[nPeace]

if you don't understand it might be best for you just to pray, and ask the Lord to give you the wisdom.
James 1:5 "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."
The Holy Spirit will be a far better teacher to you then I could ever be. I always encourage people to pray so that God might show them the truth.

What is it I am supposed to understand?
I understand the scriptures don't support the trinity. Isn't that why trinitarians can only provide a whole page of scriptures in which they interpret as they like to try to fit their doctrine, but cannot comment on two or three scriptures that directly refute the false teaching?

That seems to be a common tune of those who meet someone who can discuss scripture against their teachings.
That says enough about the teaching - it clearly is not scriptural.

I hope you do pray that God might show you the truth, and give you the wisdom to realize that those who teach falsehood, and know it, are making of mockery, and God is not one to be mocked.
Galatians 6:7 . . .Do not be misled: God is not one to be mocked. For whatever a person is sowing, this he will also reap;

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

I don't feel like there's anything I can do or say that will help. I don't think you understand you're depravity and this is the heart of the problem

 

[nPeace]

I don't feel like there's anything I can do or say that will help. I don't think you understand you're depravity and this is the heart of the problem

Obviously! There is absolutely nothing you can do to help anyone. Oh wait. There is one. You help people to leave the church that can't teach them anything for their own good.
Do you realize how many young people leave churches like yours, because you sing that tune in their ears... "I can't help you. You need to pray to God, to help you by the Holy Ghost."

Can you imagine a young person barely in their teens is questioning a pastor about the relationship of the father and son, and the pastor cannot even use the Bible to show that person how Jesus is part of a trinity?
Talk about depraved.
That is similar to your false teachings.
You can make false statements, but can't back it up with anything more than another false statement.

Watch.
Prove your statement that I am depraved.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

Everyone of us are depraved. How many lies have you told in your entire life? Have you ever stolen anything? Have you ever taken God's name in vain? Have you ever looked at an individual with impure thoughts?

 

[nPeace]

Everyone of us are depraved. How many lies have you told in your entire life? Have you ever stolen anything? Have you ever taken God's name in vain? Have you ever looked at an individual with impure thoughts?

So wait. You are calling all of Jesus' followers - including his apostles -depraved? Do you guys reason at all.
Once a person turn their lives around, the former sins do not count. It is what they practice after that. They are not depraved - wicked.

If however, one deliberately tell untruths - deliberately. That is the wicked person.
Are you admitting that you are wicked, and therefore everyone else must be like you?
Sorry. That's not how it works.
I don't practice those things you mentioned.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

I'm still not convinced that you understand you're depriving here's a little illustration I wrote up that might help. if you don't understand who Christ is then you're still in a depraved state of condemnation.

Your family and one of your best friends families has decided to go camping, but you forgot to bring a container for water, on your way to the campsite your friend sees a container in the ditch he stops and picks it up, it has a skull and crossbones on the outside of the container, it says poison on it, and has a little bit of poison left at the bottom of the container, so he turns it upside down and dumps the poisonous liquid out, then when you get to the campsite he goes over to an area that has pure filtered water and he fills the container up with water, would you and your family be willing to drink out of that container? Of course you wouldn't! because if the container is contaminated so is the water. God can never accept the righteousness that comes out of the human heart, no matter how good it looks outwardly. God sees that the container it came out of is defiled. No matter how many good works we try to offer to God it can never offset the aggravation of sin, the only thing that can offset the aggravation of sin is the death of Christ, at the cross justice was answered fully and God's holy and righteous demands satisfied. The third day Jesus rose from the dead and defeated death. God offers salvation to anyone that will come to him in repentance and faith.

Isaiah 64:6 " But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away."

Romans 10:3-4 "For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

 

[nPeace]

I'm still not convinced that you understand you're depriving here's a little illustration I wrote up that might help. if you don't understand who Christ is then you're still in a depraved state of condemnation.

Your family and one of your best friends families has decided to go camping, but you forgot to bring a container for water, on your way to the campsite your friend sees a container in the ditch he stops and picks it up, it has a skull and crossbones on the outside of the container, it says poison on it, and has a little bit of poison left at the bottom of the container, so he turns it upside down and dumps the poisonous liquid out, then when you get to the campsite he goes over to an area that has pure filtered water and he fills the container up with water, would you and your family be willing to drink out of that container? Of course you wouldn't! because if the container is contaminated so is the water. God can never accept the righteousness that comes out of the human heart, no matter how good it looks outwardly. God sees that the container it came out of is defiled. No matter how many good works we try to offer to God it can never offset the aggravation of sin, the only thing that can offset the aggravation of sin is the death of Christ, at the cross justice was answered fully and God's holy and righteous demands satisfied. The third day Jesus rose from the dead and defeated death. God offers salvation to anyone that will come to him in repentance and faith.

Isaiah 64:6 " But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away."

Romans 10:3-4 "For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

Are you here to preach, or debate?
RF has rules against preaching.
If you are here to debate, you failed to respond to one of my post, so when, or if you are ready to respond to it let me know.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

I'm not preaching anymore than you are.

 

[nPeace]

I'm not preaching anymore than you are.

Good. We agree on something then.
BTW Welcome to RF.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

I would encourage you to examine yourself to see if you're in the faith.
2 Corinthians 13:5 "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"
Is this a fair thing to ask of you? I believe it is because you don't seem to understand depravity or Christ deity.

 

[nPeace]

I would encourage you to examine yourself to see if you're in the faith.
2 Corinthians 13:5 "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"
Is this a fair thing to ask of you? I believe it is because you don't seem to understand depravity or Christ deity.

Is that your understand of these verses?
John 1:1, 14; 17:5; Acts 2:33-35; Colossians 1:15; Revelation 3:14; Daniel 7:9-14; Psalms 2; 110:1.
Or clearly, you are not ready to debate, at least not nPeace. That's okay. There are plenty folk on RF. Just browse around. Hope you enjoy it.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

in what way have I not debated in peace?

 

[nPeace]

in what way have I not debated in peace?

No. I didn't say in peace. I said nPeace - that's me.

 

[GODbeMERCIFULtoMEaSINNER]

Ok i see said the blind man!

 

[Deeje]

'Now when Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, "I am God Almighty; Walk before Me, and be blameless. "I will establish My covenant between Me and you, And I will multiply you exceedingly." Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying, ' Genesis 17:1-3

'But the Lord , who brought you up from the land of Egypt with great power and with an outstretched arm, Him you shall fear, and to Him you shall bow yourselves down, and to Him you shall sacrifice. ' 2 Kings 17:36

'"And it shall be from new moon to new moon And from sabbath to sabbath, All mankind will come to bow down before Me," says the Lord .' Isaiah 66:23

'I will bow down toward Your holy temple And give thanks to Your name for Your lovingkindness and Your truth; For You have magnified Your word according to all Your name.' Psalms 138:2

Jews still worship and pray to God by facing in the direction of Jerusalem. God's presence was manifested on Mount Sinai, the tabernacle, the temple etc. so the Jews worshiped Him in this manner.

Bowing down to humans as an act of respect was admissible in the Jewish faith, but bowing to anyone other than Jehovah as a deity was prohibited by God. (Exodus 23:24; 34:14) Similarly, the worshipful bowing down to religious images or to any created thing was positively condemned. (Exodus 20:4, 5; Leviticus 26:1; Deuteronomy 4:15-19; Isaiah 2:8, 9, 20, 21) In the Hebrew Scriptures, when certain of Jehovah’s servants prostrated themselves before angels, they only did so to show they recognized that these were God’s representatives, not to render obeisance to them as deities. (Joshua 5:13-15; Genesis 18:1-3) Angels often rejected the act as inappropriate as they were just fellow servants of the same God.

So let me ask you this one question.....do you physically bow down to God in your Christian worship? Do you see Christ recommending any kind of prostration in the worship he promoted? Was "proskyneo" just a physical act or can "worship" be rendered in one's mind and heart? There is so much emphasis placed on this word, and yet how do those who call themselves "Christians" today render their "worship"? How many physically bow down, as opposed to bowing their heads in prayer?

The only people I know who physically prostrate themselves to their god today, are the practicers of Islam. I do not see religious Jews ever doing this as part of their daily worship, except perhaps in the extreme orthodox sects. AFAIK facing Jerusalem to pray is not an act of prostration.