Jewish Messiah

[Jimmy]

Is it unrealistic that Jewish people expect the Messiah will establish world peace? Or are they just talking about larger wars not happening, not necessarily a perfect world?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

In my (wholly unorthodox) opinion, the task of establishing world peace is ours alone.

 

[Harel13]

Is it unrealistic that Jewish people expect the Messiah will establish world peace? Or are they just talking about larger wars not happening, not necessarily a perfect world?

The first step is establishing peace for the Jewish people in the Land of Israel. I think the rest of the nations will follow after, but obviously they will have to hash out peace deals amongst themselves. The Jewish Messiah isn't supposed to serve as the UN's secretary general.

 

[dybmh]

Is it unrealistic that Jewish people expect the Messiah will establish world peace?

If Jewish people expect that, then yes.

The Prophecy:
Peace comes at the end of days.
The Jewish Messiah comes at or before the end of days ( among other things ).
The two occur in the same context, but one is not causing the other.

 

[dybmh]

are they just talking about larger wars not happening, not necessarily a perfect world?

That is one possible form in which the prophecy of "peace" might be fulfilled. But there are other prophecies.

 

[christos]

Is it unrealistic that Jewish people expect the Messiah will establish world peace? Or are they just talking about larger wars not happening, not necessarily a perfect world?

I think whatever the Jewish viewpoint is (I haven’t got enough knowledge on Jewish beliefs, ofcourse there’s lots of wonderful Jews on here)

But I have the oppinion this world will never be perfect
Not in the ethereal, heveanly, divine, sense

We can certainly be better, no wars, one ultimate goal, no fighting, no murder

You can obviously imagine a utopia type world, where we’re all mostly cool with one another

BUT I think dispute, argument, debate, fighting over resources is always going to be a thing, just because we’re material and flawed and have egos and have desires and strive for power or whatever

I can see a mostly peaceful world, but I don’t see a perfect world

And the true is for our future as a multi planetary species, IF we get there
Mars and any other body will be subject to politics, dispute, arguments, resource issues

…Only God is perfect

 

[Jimmy]

I think whatever the Jewish viewpoint is (I haven’t got enough knowledge on Jewish beliefs, ofcourse there’s lots of wonderful Jews on here)

But I have the oppinion this world will never be perfect
Not in the ethereal, heveanly, divine, sense

We can certainly be better, no wars, one ultimate goal, no fighting, no murder

You can obviously imagine a utopia type world, where we’re all mostly cool with one another

BUT I think dispute, argument, debate, fighting over resources is always going to be a thing, just because we’re material and flawed and have egos and have desires and strive for power or whatever

I can see a mostly peaceful world, but I don’t see a perfect world

And the true is for our future as a multi planetary species, IF we get there
Mars and any other body will be subject to politics, dispute, arguments, resource issues

…Only God is perfect

Imo we will never live on other planets

 

[dybmh]

I think dispute, argument, debate, fighting over resources is always going to be a thing, just because we’re material and flawed and have egos and have desires and strive for power or whatever

What if?

Everyone agrees, except for the mentally ill, the criminally insane, that there is a God in heaven, and there will be a just accounting of each individuals actions when they pass on. This is, essentially, the definition of a "believer" as written in the Quran.

What if?

In addition to the above shared belief, the justice system here on Earth was refined and improved. Discouraging without interfering with personal freedom? Evidence is collected and tested for credibility in a much more to use and accurate manner?

What if?

this world will never be perfect

Right. In this case seeking perfection is the enemy of the good. But there's a whole lot of opportunity for good improvement, IF, we cooperate and we aren't afraid of failure.

 

[christos]

What if?

Everyone agrees, except for the mentally ill, the criminally insane, that there is a God in heaven, and there will be a just accounting of each individuals actions when they pass on. This is, essentially, the definition of a "believer" as written in the Quran.

What if?

In addition to the above shared belief, the justice system here on Earth was refined and improved. Discouraging without interfering with personal freedom? Evidence is collected and tested for credibility in a much more to use and accurate manner?

What if?



Right. In this case seeking perfection is the enemy of the good. But there's a whole lot of opportunity for good improvement, IF, we cooperate and we aren't afraid of failure.

Absolutely we can move towards something greater

 

[metis]

In my (wholly unorthodox) opinion, the task of establishing world peace is ours alone.

For what it's worth, I agree.

 

[InChrist]

Is it unrealistic that Jewish people expect the Messiah will establish world peace? Or are they just talking about larger wars not happening, not necessarily a perfect world?

I think according to the scriptures it’s realistic to expect the Messiah to establish peace…


Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them, and it shall be an everlasting covenant with them; I will establish them and multiply them, and I will set My sanctuary in their midst forevermore. 27 My tabernacle also shall be with them; indeed I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 28 The nations also will know that I, the Lord, sanctify Israel, when My sanctuary is in their midst forevermore.” Ezekiel 37:26-28

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I think according to the scriptures it’s realistic to expect the Messiah to establish peace…


Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them, and it shall be an everlasting covenant with them; I will establish them and multiply them, and I will set My sanctuary in their midst forevermore. 27 My tabernacle also shall be with them; indeed I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 28 The nations also will know that I, the Lord, sanctify Israel, when My sanctuary is in their midst forevermore.” Ezekiel 37:26-28

As in Parashat Pinchas (Numbers 25:11), the JPS views the Hebrew "b'riti shalom" as an idiom to be rendered "My pact of friendship."

 

[dybmh]

For what it's worth, I agree: the task of establishing world peace is ours alone.

That's the same mistake people have been making since the dawn of civilization: Let's do this alone.

 

[dybmh]

JPS views the Hebrew "b'riti shalom" as an idiom to be rendered "My pact of friendship."

The JPS is erasing and replacing the meaning of the word Shalom with something else atheist-friendly.

@InChrist , The JPS is atheist-propaganda. It is not faithful to Judaism. It is there for atheists who need validation of their non-belief in spite of their Jewish cultural heritage. That's why Jay is pushing it.

 

[David1967]

And the true is for our future as a multi planetary species, IF we get there
Mars and any other body will be subject to politics, dispute, arguments, resource issues

What an exciting time to be alive.

 

[dybmh]

I will make a covenant of peace

The Judaica Press agrees with this translation.
The Art Scroll agrees with this translation.
The Da'ath Sofrim from Moznaim agrees with this translation. It's a wonderful ( somewhat ) modern translation.

Page 622: ( sorry for the poor quality photo, in a spoiler to save screen space )

Spoiler

You really are conversing with someone whose agenda is far more important to them than scriptural fidelity and academic integrity. They don't tell you that the JPS is written for atheists. You won't ever get the complete story from people like this. Lying by omission is their #1 tactic.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

The JPS is erasing and replacing the meaning of the word Shalom with something else atheist-friendly

(Who would have thought that Jacob Milgrom could prompt such pathetic nonsense?)​

 

[metis]

That's the same mistake people have been making since the dawn of civilization: Let's do this alone.

So, besides us, who else if going to solve our problems?

 

[metis]

The JPS is atheist-propaganda. It is not faithful to Judaism. It is there for atheists who need validation of their non-belief in spite of their Jewish cultural heritage.

I don't buy that as I have both the JPS and the Stone Edition Chumash and Tanakh, and in most cases they are generally comparable. Either way, the JPS certainly isn't even close to being atheistic.

 

[InChrist]

The JPS is erasing and replacing the meaning of the word Shalom with something else atheist-friendly.

@InChrist , The JPS is atheist-propaganda. It is not faithful to Judaism. It is there for atheists who need validation of their non-belief in spite of their Jewish cultural heritage. That's why Jay is pushing it.

That’s not too surprising.