Indirectly. Scripture is just scripture. The best way of defending against its misuse is by far simply by learning better and spreading the education.
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Jihadists must die, --- but our real enemies are the Qur’an and Bible.
- Thread starter Greatest I am
- Start date
Indirectly. Scripture is just scripture. The best way of defending against its misuse is by far simply by learning better and spreading the education.
National Socialism can hardly be claimed to be any of that.
Zulk-Dharma
Member
Hitler wanted to control religious life and either secularize Christianity to his standards or destroy it all and replace it with a Nazified science.
More like take advantage of it.
There are those who believe in that. I don't know how they manage.
gsa
Well-Known Member
And treating it as mythological.
Zulk-Dharma
Member
So you're one of those people who thinks that a belief system can't motivate a person to harming others?
Zulk-Dharma
Member
Inspire, but not motivate. I said it in my post, a teaching is just a teaching, it can be interpret to harm others, but I haven't seen one religion just going out and preaching murder.
What is the difference between inspiring and motivating? I don't see one. There have been persecutions and killings motivated by religion for centuries. There's even offshoots of mainstream religions that encourage violence, such as Christian Identity.
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I agree, but there is more to the story...
We have to notice that from generation to generation and over many centuries, scripture has a knack for sustaining ideas - both good and bad.
For example, "go forth and multiply", which made sense 2000 years ago, also motivates Christians to resist the use of condoms in AIDs ridden populations today. We can find many passages in the Quran that align perfectly with 1400 years of Islamic conquest, and with OIC's ongoing distortions of basic human rights.
Zulk-Dharma
Member
Inspiring is more like giving ideas, while motivating is to promote or advocate for something. Where the material is advocating you to do it, while inspirations is getting inspired from a religion.
There are very few religions motivating evils. I also, to be fair, I said "creed," (tenets, principles, etc.) not religion as a whole.
Perhaps, if he were an atheist. Which I very much doubt he was. The had too much of a messianic stain.
Perhaps because you take for granted that Hitler was an atheist and anti-theist, which he is all but certain not to have been.
Zulk-Dharma
Member
@LuisDantas. Whether or not he was an atheist is inconclusive, some say he was a Deist - what I consider for materialized theism or watered-down atheism, since it's a belief in an impersonal force with no religious authority. I think it was likely he was an atheist, all his contemporaries, allies and influences were atheists and actively lived by such a lifestyle, I find it hard to believe a Catholic would give these high authorities and wage holy war against their mental represented notion that is atheism in the same time and the quote below shows that he is not fond of the "spiritualist, but not religious" kind of people, he seems like not fond of spirituality at all.
But it's irrelevant whether or not he was an atheist, he's an irreligious materialist nevertheless.
About the messianic stain, I don't think he would ever had considered himself as such. This is why:
But it's irrelevant whether or not he was an atheist, he's an irreligious materialist nevertheless.
About the messianic stain, I don't think he would ever had considered himself as such. This is why:
What??? ROFL! Abrahamic religions are the worst tools of dominating masses that have ever been created. I think I don't think to quote any scriptures on that. No wonder most people is meak, coward and conforming these days. e.g. they teach us not to lie, steal and kill, while governments do all of that, all the time! They teach us that being rich and having sex is bad, while the Elite that rules the World is immensely rich and enjoy every imaginable pleasure available. The old trick of "do what I say, but not what I do".
About scriptures, no, they shouldn't be amended, they should be forgotten as mass manipulating myths. Do they have some truth in them? Of course, if you believe in Jesus and ask him the protection of Archangel Michael you will be protected. Now, should you buy the whole package and believe everything in the book? You would end up like Ned Flanders. Now who is really Jesus and Michael? Well, you'll have to find that out by yourself (ask them who they are).
I think it's pointless to get some book like Mein Kampf and reinterpret it until it ends up being a children's bedtime story. In the same way it would be loosing time to get the Quran and reinterpret verses like:
8:12 [Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, "I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip."
9:5 And when the sacred months have passed, then kill the polytheists wherever you find them and capture them and besiege them and sit in wait for them at every place of ambush. But if they should repent, establish prayer, and give zakah, let them [go] on their way. Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.
So much for "forgiving and merciful"! Maybe only to new forced converts! What was the big threat of polytheists anyway? Were they the "competition"?
Then you could wonder why so much violence would be needed against unbelievers. They don't believe because they didn't see, right? Duh! Allah, just present yourself so they see you and they'll believe in you. Otherwise you can "strike" them on their necks and fingertips for their whole life and they'll have even less faith than what they had before!
I could go on citing Deuteronomy and Leviticus in the Bible, etc. but it's beyond the point. Bad books and bad religions should be abandoned.
Anyway most people is in abrahamic religions only because they were made members when they were helpless toddlers, not because of the quality of those paths. So people must learn to question everyone and everything, study History and wake up! The Bible and the Quran are not the only options!
You really don't want to admit things for what they appear to be, now do you?
Sure you don't want to perceive him as such, but that goes against the grain of very nearly all of the available evidence.
ether-ore
Active Member
In other words, you want God to change his mind about homosexuality because you think God is mistaken concerning it? In any case, completely getting rid of scripture will not achieve your desired result, because some people on their own, without the influence of scripture will still find homosexuality repugnant. What will you want then? To declare that only your preferences are then legally acceptable; and that others who hold contrary views are not entitled to their preferences by law? You would destroy agency so that you can feel accepted by those people who do not accept you? Who then is the tyrant?
I have always been a believer in the right of association. All individuals have the right to associate with whom they wish for whatever reason they wish and in whatever capacity and to whatever extent they wish. Conversely, all people have the right not to associate with whomever they wish, and not to associate with for whatever reason. Happiness is mostly derived through human associations. I have no problem with your finding happiness in associating with whomever you wish, for whatever reason you wish, but you don't like it if I do the same thing. You would deny me my rights not to associate with you if I wish not to? The point of a right is that I do not have to justify my not wanting to associate with you. It is just my preference because I don't like you or what you are doing. It's that simple. I think you just need to get over yourself. There are plenty of people out there who accept you. Be happy with them and leave the rest alone.
I say let people believe whatever they want to, just don't let them do whatever they want to. We should also make it a point to foster good education and reasoning skills in society. I believe those things would help reduce the use of scripture as justification to rob people of their rights or harm them in other ways.
ether-ore
Active Member
You're interested in "re-education camps" for those with different points of view and the indoctrination of children to believe a certain way which is compliant with the desires of a specific group?
You would not allow people to act on their desires not to support the actions of others they do not like? When you say "to rob people of their rights or harm them in other ways", what specific actions are you referring to which rob or harm?