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Joseph Smith - Prophet of God

B

Bathsheba

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DeepShadow said:
Love.
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Obedience is the first law of heaven. . . . In fact without obedience there could be no union or order, and chaos and confusion would prevail. (Joseph F. Smith, JD 16:247-248 (1873)

Obedience is the first law of heaven, the cornerstone upon which all righteousness and progression rest. It consists in compliance with divine law, in conformity to the mind and will of Deity, in complete subjection to God and his commands. (Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 539)

jesus tap dancing christ, get the doctrine straight mister! :slap:
 
Bishka

Bishka

Veteran Member
Bathsheba said:
Obedience is the first law of heaven. . . . In fact without obedience there could be no union or order, and chaos and confusion would prevail. (Joseph F. Smith, JD 16:247-248 (1873)

Obedience is the first law of heaven, the cornerstone upon which all righteousness and progression rest. It consists in compliance with divine law, in conformity to the mind and will of Deity, in complete subjection to God and his commands. (Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 539)

jesus tap dancing christ, get the doctrine straight mister! :slap:
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Funny, did someone forget to tell you?

Mormon Doctrineis not doctrine, it's one mans opinion.

Doctrine = scriptual statements
Any other = opinions

Now without any further ado, please continue. ;)
 
nutshell

nutshell

Well-Known Member
Obedience does NOT equal blindly following what another says. Besides, if the First Law is Obedience, the next logical question is Obedience to what? That answer is 1. Love god and 2. Love your Neighbors (these are the GREATEST commandments).

So, the Love answer was correct from the standpoint that it is the Loving God and Neighbors that is important and not blind obedience.
 
B

Bathsheba

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LSDLDS said:
Obedience does NOT equal blindly following what another says. Besides, if the First Law is Obedience, the next logical question is Obedience to what? That answer is 1. Love god and 2. Love your Neighbors (these are the GREATEST commandments).

So, the Love answer was correct from the standpoint that it is the Loving God and Neighbors that is important and not blind obedience.
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Oh, now you are quibbling with the so-called apostle Bruce and so-called prophet Joe.

 
J

jonny

Well-Known Member
Bathsheba said:
Oh, now you are quibbling with the so-called apostle Bruce and so-called prophet Joe.
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I don't know what types of discussion forums you're used to, but here people talk respectfully of other religions. If you want to go and degrade leaders of the LDS Church, you'd be more than welcome at CARM.
 
Bishka

Bishka

Veteran Member
Bathsheba said:
Oh, now you are quibbling with the so-called apostle Bruce and so-called prophet Joe.
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You really have an enormous amount of animosity towards the LDS Church. Why such hate? (Honestly, it's said to see anyone have such hatred toward any faith).
 
B

Bathsheba

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beckysoup61 said:
If you could give me when and where he said that I would be happy too.
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That is pretty funny beckysoup61, you are willing to defend the context prior to knowing what it is, what a good little sheep you are. Word of advice, if you discover that Oaks was wrong - don't criticize him even if you are right. Not everything that is true is useful. Oh, and you can be too smart for your own good - apparently intelligence only garners so much glory according to Oaks. See the link below, you'll see what I mean.

LDS Newsroom - Elder Oaks Interview Transcript from PBS Documentary
 
nutshell

nutshell

Well-Known Member
Bathsheba said:
Oh, now you are quibbling with the so-called apostle Bruce and so-called prophet Joe.
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Umm...I wasn't quibbling with anyone. I made a logical extension of the question. When you failed to address.

Why don't you go quibble with yourself. Or, if you are feeling this isn't going as well as you had hoped, go visit CARM like Jonny suggested. You'll feel much better there.
 
B

Bathsheba

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LSDLDS said:
Umm...I wasn't quibbling with anyone. I made a logical extension of the question. When you failed to address.

Why don't you go quibble with yourself. Or, if you are feeling this isn't going as well as you had hoped, go visit CARM like Jonny suggested. You'll feel much better there.
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Thanks for the tip.
 
Popeyesays

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
A call for obedience is not so unusual.

"CXXXII
Glorified be Thy name, O Lord my God! I beseech Thee by Thy power that hath encompassed all created things, and by Thy sovereignty that hath transcended the entire creation, and by Thy Word which was hidden in Thy wisdom and whereby Thou didst create
Thy heaven and Thy earth, both to enable us to be steadfast in our love for Thee and in our obedience to Thy pleasure, and to fix our gaze upon Thy face, and celebrate Thy glory. Empower us, then, O my God, to spread abroad Thy signs among Thy creatures, and to guard Thy Faith in Thy realm. Thou hast ever existed independently of the mention of any of Thy creatures, and wilt remain as Thou hast been for ever and ever. In Thee I have placed my whole confidence, unto Thee I have turned my face, to the cord of Thy loving providence I have clung, and towards the shadow of Thy mercy I have hastened."Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, pp. 206-207:

Regards,Scott
 
Bishka

Bishka

Veteran Member
Bathsheba said:
LDS Newsroom - Elder Oaks Interview Transcript from PBS Documentary
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I also said something else that has excited people: that it’s wrong to criticize leaders of the Church, even if the criticism is true, because it diminishes their effectiveness as a servant of the Lord. One can work to correct them by some other means, but don’t go about saying that they misbehaved when they were a youngster or whatever. Well, of course, that sounds like religious censorship also.



But not everything that’s true is useful. I am a lawyer, and I hear something from a client. It’s true, but I’ll be disciplined professionally if I share it because it’s part of the attorney-client privilege. There’s a husband-wife privilege, there’s a priest-penitent privilege, and so on. That’s an illustration of the fact that not everything that’s true is useful to be shared.
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Here is the full bit of what he said instead of just a snippet that you presented.

What I believe Elder Oaks is trying to say is that there are many other effect means then criticizing the leaders of the LDS Church. Like his example, to bring up something from their youth and say 'Look what they did, look who they were', is pretty ridiculous. Most people change over the course of their lifetime.

Mainly I believe this is directed at the members of the LDS Church. Since you aren't one, go ahead criticize, makes no difference to us anyways.

BTW, this has gone so far off-topic.

So back to Joseph Smith then, will we?
 
B

Bathsheba

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beckysoup61 said:
You don't have my pity, I just think it is rather sad.
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Hey, I hear ya. Sometimes I am quite surprised by what people feel. And then, on other occasions I find their emotions to be quite ordinary. For example, your expression of sadness (based on your perception of my feelings) is probably more passive aggressive posturing than anything else, really quite ordinary, ya know. Will you be saying a prayer for me tonight with love in your heart?
 
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