Judgment from Yahweh during Chr-stmas Day?

[Secret Chief]

I get so tired of this arrogance!

Perhaps you are unaware, but the ancient Israelites believed that 7 was theologically important. They also religiously eschewed the use of vowels. Do you got that? Do you?!

Now, why do you suppose that Chr-stm-s always falls on the 25th?

And what to you get when you add 2+5?​

And how many consonants are in the word Chr-stm-s?​

Do you truly not see a pattern here?​

Please make it stop.

 

[Oeste]

...why in-the-world are you being so out-of-context? @Messianic Israelite said that the blizzard happened on Christmas day - that's the correlation.

No, that is simply a statement by @Messianic Israelite, not a correlation.

For correlation we need sufficient data to show a relationship exists between two or more sets of data. @Messianic Israelite failed to demonstrate this. A simple statement that a relationship exists is insufficient to establish correlation, and without this data, it is just as probable the snow was due to more people failing or refusing to celebrate Christmas. In other words, the more people who listen to the Assemblies of Yahweh and abandon Christmas, the worse our weather gets.

Offhand, I see two ways to resolve this: technical (using secular data) and biblical.

Technical

Messianic Israelite could display a graph showing increased snowfall invariably coincides with an increase of Christmas celebrations, discounting climate change, industrialization, or other, natural and artificial inducers of snowfall.

For example, we know their is increased likelihood that snow will fall simply because it's winter and December 25th falls after the winter solstice. What we don't know is if we get more snowfall than anticipated when more people celebrate Christmas. It could be the same, less. or as I suspect, no correlation at all.

Biblical

Unfortunately, there is no command that says "Thou shalt not celebrate, nor praise my name, or give gifts on December 25th". Nor is there any command that says "Thou can truly celebrate, praise my name, or give gifts on any day of the year, just not on any particular day" as some here have speculated. But all is not lost.

In Exodus, we have the pass over. God wrought judgement on Egypt, yet spared those who placed lamb's blood on their doorframes. He declared this before actually doing it. If @Messianic Israelite is correct when he say God brought snow because He was displeased about Christmas, then perhaps He announced something similar to the Assemblies of Yahweh, except those with Christmas ornaments on their doorframes received blizzard conditions, while those without them were not affected by wind or snow at all.

IMO, either would be sufficient to establish a plausible correlation.

As for the rest of us, we make no such correlations, so we need show no such data.

 

[Kenny]

For the run up to Chr-stmas, I have been debating with various people regarding the pagan nature of Chr-stmas, how it isn’t Biblical and how Yahweh is deeply displeased with those who engage in it. I was pleasantly surprised to hear how some people on RF know about the Saturnalia, Bacchanalia and Paganalia that existed before the birth of the Messiah, yet were celebrated around December 25th with the same symbols and practices that are kept at Chr-stmas. Only someone with a very limited thinking process would think that these things are merely coincidence. But Chr-stmas is over, however, I wanted to mention the fact that deadly blizzards have been raging across the U.S.A and in Canada with a special concentration on Chr-stmas day. Perhaps you were one of the people that were affected by this. So I’m going to ask the question that people on RF seem to be avoiding. Is this judgment from Yahweh? I don’t think it is mere coincidence that on Chr-stmas day this should take place. Now I want to start by saying I’m not gloating that many people have died during Xmas. Let me say that whenever they are deaths involved, I’m not happy about it, regardless if people were engaging in sinful practices. My attitude echoes Yahweh in Ezekiel 33:11 “Say to them, ‘As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Yahweh, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! Why will you die, people of Israel?’ Proverbs 24 says:

“Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth,
And let not thy heart be glad when he is overthrown;
18 Lest Yahweh see it, and it displease him,
And he turn away his wrath from him.”

The Buffalo storms have been classed as “a crisis of epic proportion” and “the worst of the worst” by the New York Governor Kathy Hochul, a native of Buffalo, where 2.4-metre (8-foot) snow drifts against front doors and power outages in freezing temperatures have created life-threatening conditions. More than 200,000 people across several eastern states woke up without power on Christmas morning, and many more had their holiday travel plans upended although the five-day-long storm featuring blizzard conditions and ferocious winds showed signs of easing. The two dozen weather-related deaths were confirmed across eight states, but some US media reported as many as 30 storm-linked fatalities, including four people in Colorado who likely died of exposure and at least seven in western New York.

In Canada, hundreds of thousands of people were left without power in Ontario and Quebec, many flights were canceled in major cities and train passenger service between Toronto and Ottawa was suspended.

Much of the US experienced some sort of winter weather during the large storm, which was generated by a bomb cyclone, a meteorological phenomenon when the atmospheric pressure quickly drops in a strong storm.

What does anger me is that people, I know, are blaming Yahweh for not allowing them to see their loved ones, or friends during this time. For ruining their Xmas, which according to the Chr-stian faith is the holiest day of the year, yet has no basis in the Bible. Yahshua was not even born on December 25, and further, Yahweh doesn’t command we remember his birth but his death at the Passover on the correct day set by the lunar calendar. I know some people are even blaming Yahweh because people have died, at least 60. Instead of blaming Yahweh, why don’t people start asking themselves the question, What am I doing wrong? **Mod Edit**

Kinda makes the Cross irrelevant IMO.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Kinda makes the Cross irrelevant IMO.

What does, and why do you think so?

 

[Kenny]

What does, and why do you think so?

If God is going to punish all people because of Christmas - then why did Jesus go to the Cross for?

It would dictate the what Jesus did was quite irrelevant. His life would also have been different as he was the expressed will of the Father.

 

[DNB]

What the hell does that have to with Christian church services/liturgies celebrating the nativity of Christ? I haven't gotten or given a Christmas gift in years, but I'll sure go to Mass. The presents, Santa and such are irrelevant to the Christian celebration of Christmas. That's a cultural thing only.

Well, then since when does Christian mass, liturgies, his birth have a day of precedence or emphasis, over any other day?

 

[DNB]

I think we’ll have agree to respectfully disagree (Romans 14:1-13).
I think celebrating the coming of the Son of God into this dark, fallen world is worth celebrating. It’s wonderful opportunity to exalt the name of Jesus Christ and share the gospel. Certainly, Christians should do that all year long, nevertheless, many in the world are more receptive at Christmas. Giving gifts is a reminder of God’s greatest gift: Jesus Christ and a way to share love with others.

Should we give gifts at Christmas? | GotQuestions.org

It's misguided, inefficacious and unedifying, and giving gifts to each other is pagan.

 

[DNB]

So if god approved of Christmas, the weather on that day would always be pleasant and delightful, year after year?

Like I said, i don't accept the proposed correlation. But, you should at least appreciate what he was trying to say, otherwise, irrespective of what position you take, it will not be germane to the discussion.

 

[DNB]

Where I live we had a cold snap and some windy conditions on the 23rd of December. On Christmas day things had calmed down and warmed up. Other places were still having problems on Christmas day but the storm did not start on Christmas. It is easy to find "correlation" if you are willing to fudge the facts a little.

Yes, I categorically agree. People trying to find associations or relationships between disparate events, will always end up with outlandish theories that are too far-fetched to even entertain.
I don't believe that Messianic Israelite had enough grounds to make his claims.

 

[DNB]

No, that is simply a statement by @Messianic Israelite, not a correlation.

For correlation we need sufficient data to show a relationship exists between two or more sets of data. @Messianic Israelite failed to demonstrate this. A simple statement that a relationship exists is insufficient to establish correlation, and without this data, it is just as probable the snow was due to more people failing or refusing to celebrate Christmas. In other words, the more people who listen to the Assemblies of Yahweh and abandon Christmas, the worse our weather gets.

Offhand, I see two ways to resolve this: technical (using secular data) and biblical.

Technical

Messianic Israelite could display a graph showing increased snowfall invariably coincides with an increase of Christmas celebrations, discounting climate change, industrialization, or other, natural and artificial inducers of snowfall.

For example, we know their is increased likelihood that snow will fall simply because it's winter and December 25th falls after the winter solstice. What we don't know is if we get more snowfall than anticipated when more people celebrate Christmas. It could be the same, less. or as I suspect, no correlation at all.

Biblical

Unfortunately, there is no command that says "Thou shalt not celebrate, nor praise my name, or give gifts on December 25th". Nor is there any command that says "Thou can truly celebrate, praise my name, or give gifts on any day of the year, just not on any particular day" as some here have speculated. But all is not lost.

In Exodus, we have the pass over. God wrought judgement on Egypt, yet spared those who placed lamb's blood on their doorframes. He declared this before actually doing it. If @Messianic Israelite is correct when he say God brought snow because He was displeased about Christmas, then perhaps He announced something similar to the Assemblies of Yahweh, except those with Christmas ornaments on their doorframes received blizzard conditions, while those without them were not affected by wind or snow at all.

IMO, either would be sufficient to establish a plausible correlation.

As for the rest of us, we make no such correlations, so we need show no such data.

Yes, it was a correlation - whether false or not, Messianic Israelite attempted to draw a correlation between the two facts, obviously.
And, if you would follow the context a bit more closely, you would've understood what was being addressed and why. Therefore, it was a correlation, that Heathen failed to recognize..

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Well, then since when does Christian mass, liturgies, his birth have a day of precedence or emphasis, over any other day?

When the church made it an official holy day back in the fourth century. Actually, individual bishops did celebrate teh Nativity before then, and the day varied from bishop to bishop, but the church unified the day in the fourth century.

 

[pearl]

For ruining their Xmas, which according to the Chr-stian faith is the holiest day of the year,

Wrong, the highest holy days are the Easter Triduum, the three days of the Easter Triduum are from dusk on Holy Thursday to dusk on Good Friday (day one), dusk on Good Friday to dusk on Holy Saturday (day two), and dusk on Holy Saturday to dusk on Easter Sunday (day three).

 

[paarsurrey]

#52 by pearl, "Religion: Catholic", thread "Judgment from Yahweh during Chr-stmas Day?"

Wrong, the highest holy days are the Easter Triduum, the three days of the Easter Triduum are from dusk on Holy Thursday to dusk on Good Friday (day one), dusk on Good Friday to dusk on Holy Saturday (day two), and dusk on Holy Saturday to dusk on Easter Sunday (day three).

Hi friend Pearl!

Did (Jesus) the Israelite Messiah celebrate it (Easter Triduum) and or give any commandment to celebrate it, please? Right?

How could Yeshua celebrate it or give commandments/teachings to do so, one understands,

1. as he never died on the Cross in the first place, never rose from the factual dead, one imagines,
2. for the atonement of sins of the sinful "Christians"
3. as "Christians", it transpires, cannot leave sinning,
4. and Yeshua never ascended to skies, please, right??

It has most certainly no origin in Yeshua, one could say, right?
Right?

Regards

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

It's misguided, inefficacious and unedifying, and giving gifts to each other is pagan.

Although I agree that Christians adopted a number of pagan-oriented rituals that had a Christian label slapped on them in order to somehow justify Christians celebrating Christmas, I also acknowledge that there are Christians who disagree with our personal views on the holiday and do not believe that celebrating it is unbiblical or misguided. They have their personal views, just as you and I do.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Did (Jesus) the Israelite Messiah

Jesus is not the Israelite Messiah.

 

[Wildswanderer]

I think Jesus likes us to get together and think about his arrival on earth.
I don't think he's especially happy with the commercialism, but that would apply to pretty much every holiday.
Christ mas is actually a celebration of Jesus' sacrifice, BTW. The mass is a recreation of the crucifixion.
I wish more people understood that about Christmas. It's not just about the manger.

 

[DNB]

When the church made it an official holy day back in the fourth century. Actually, individual bishops did celebrate teh Nativity before then, and the day varied from bishop to bishop, but the church unified the day in the fourth century.

Thank you IndigoChild, but my question was rhetorical, not historical. I understand the inception and grounds for the holiday, but I am stating that they are all misguided - every single day requires meditation and devotion to Christ, for both what he deserves, and that the world is a wicked place.

 

[DNB]

Although I agree that Christians adopted a number of pagan-oriented rituals that had a Christian label slapped on them in order to somehow justify Christians celebrating Christmas, I also acknowledge that there are Christians who disagree with our personal views on the holiday and do not believe that celebrating it is unbiblical or misguided. They have their personal views, just as you and I do.

Yes, of course, Christmas can be what you make of it - but, I truly believe that the first-generation Apostles will be turning in their grave on such a notion. Never, ever would they have endorsed such a selective and arbitrary manner to honour Christ. For, the Bible does not state the day of Christ's birth, arguably, just for this reason. Therefore, only a misguided person will attempt to, first, define the day that he was born, and secondly, use it dogmatically as grounds to honour Christ.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Jesus is not the Israelite Messiah.

Well, it turns out that G-d doesn't just love the Israelites.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Thank you IndigoChild, but my question was rhetorical, not historical. I understand the inception and grounds for the holiday, but I am stating that they are all misguided - every single day requires meditation and devotion to Christ, for both what he deserves, and that the world is a wicked place.

Are you saying you want all days to be alike, no holidays, no holy days? I'm just wondering how you can manage that belief and at the same time have the Torah as part of your holy scriptures.