Just Accidental?

[savagewind]

The earliest multicellular life. Two billion years ago. I think it is fair to say that each significant progress since then might have taken one thousand years. One thousand years for a life form to begin to appear as a different life form. How many thousands are there in two billion? I get only two million.

Two million changes (plus all the cosmetic type) from this:

To this:

 

[savagewind]

My math must be right because I haven't heard from anyone yet.

 

[savagewind]

SO?
Is the math right?

 

[Deeje]

From this...

to this....

A few million or billion years and voila! No imagination required. If only they had proof....

Is this the greatest con in the history of the world?

If so, who could convince intelligent people that this actually happened without solid evidence?

 

[Deeje]

I thought it might be interesting to list the kinds of genetic mutations that plague humankind at present....since none of our evolutionary supporters cared to venture any evidence for this....

Genetic Disorders

• Achondroplasia
• Alpha-1 Antitrypsin Deficiency
• Antiphospholipid Syndrome
• Autism
• Autosomal Dominant Polycystic Kidney Disease
• Breast cancer
• Charcot-Marie-Tooth
• Colon cancer
• Cri du chat
• Crohn's Disease
• Cystic fibrosis
• Dercum Disease
• Down Syndrome
• Duane Syndrome
• Duchenne Muscular Dystrophy
• Factor V Leiden Thrombophilia
• Familial Hypercholesterolemia
• Familial Mediterranean Fever
• Fragile X Syndrome
• Gaucher Disease
• Hemochromatosis
• Hemophilia
• Holoprosencephaly
• Huntington's disease
• Klinefelter syndrome
• Marfan syndrome
• Myotonic Dystrophy
• Neurofibromatosis
• Noonan Syndrome
• Osteogenesis Imperfecta
• Parkinson's disease
• Phenylketonuria
• Poland Anomaly
• Porphyria
• Progeria
• Prostate Cancer
• Retinitis Pigmentosa
• Severe Combined Immunodeficiency (SCID)
• Sickle cell disease
• Skin Cancer
• Spinal Muscular Atrophy
• Tay-Sachs
• Thalassemia
• Trimethylaminuria
• Turner Syndrome
• Velocardiofacial Syndrome
• WAGR Syndrome
• Wilson Disease

Specific Genetic Disorders
Now I thought it would be an interesting exercise to see how many mutations are actually listed as beneficial. These were way harder to find, but I did find this one listing......4

It starts off by saying.....
"Most random genetic changes caused by evolution are neutral, and some are harmful, but a few turn out to be positive improvements. These beneficial mutations are the raw material that may, in time, be taken up by natural selection and spread through the population. In this post, I'll list some examples of beneficial mutations that are known to exist in human beings."

So some random beneficial mutations "may, in time, be taken up by natural selection and spread through the population".......Will they? Might they? Could they? Did they?

Here are the four.....

1) Beneficial mutation: Apolipoprotein AI-Milano...."removing cholesterol from cells and dissolving arterial plaques, and additionally functions as an antioxidant, preventing some of the damage from inflammation that normally occurs in arteriosclerosis."

2) Increased bone density: "In one family that had harder than average bones."

3) Malaria resistance: "The hemoglobin mutation named HbS that makes red blood cells take on a curved, sickle-like shape. With one copy, it confers resistance to malaria, but with two copies, it causes the illness of sickle-cell anemia.
People with just one copy of this gene are 29% less likely to get malaria, while people with two copies enjoy a 93% reduction in risk. And this gene variant causes, at worst, a mild anemia"

4) Tetrachromatic vision: .....affecting color vision.

4 Beneficial Evolutionary Mutations That Humans Are Undergoing Right Now

Compared with the mutations that are detrimental, and in many cases fatal, that is hardly a drop in the bucket.

None of them earth shattering.

Considering the number of beneficial mutations that was supposed to have taken place to finally arrive at man down the long evolutionary track, how does science continue to use this to explain how random mutations helped to shape who we became?

That's a lot of "maybe's"

 

[Jose Fly]

From this...

to this....

A few million or billion years and voila! No imagination required.

So you're basically saying, "No way any of these things could arise without divine intervention".

But then you immediately switch to...

I thought it might be interesting to list the kinds of genetic mutations that plague humankind at present.

So I guess by your own line of reasoning, it must be that God intervened to create (and is still doing so) all those terrible genetic afflictions you listed.

 

[Jose Fly]

The earliest multicellular life. Two billion years ago. I think it is fair to say that each significant progress since then might have taken one thousand years. One thousand years for a life form to begin to appear as a different life form.

What are "significant progress" and "a different life form"? And where did you come up with your thousand year estimate?

 

[savagewind]

What are "significant progress" and "a different life form"? And where did you come up with your thousand year estimate?

Thousand years is a guess and I believe very much tipped toward YOUR opinion of evolution only (life sans design).

I think YOU know what significant progress means. Or, I think you should.

It means whenever a life form begins anew. When you go back many generations and compare the life form from a thousand years ago to the one with "significant progress (forward)", nobody can say, "those look the same to me!".

 

[savagewind]

Two pictures which show gross "progress"*

Just Accidental?

What features do the share, in your opinion?


*Are you going to beat my word progress to death?

 

[Jose Fly]

Thousand years is a guess

Ah, "I guessed". Got it.

I think YOU know what significant progress means. Or, I think you should.

It means whenever a life form begins anew. When you go back many generations and compare the life form from a thousand years ago to the one with "significant progress (forward)", nobody can say, "those look the same to me!".

So let's summarize here.....you guessed that it would take a thousand years for evolution to make "significant progress" and "different life forms", but you don't have any sort of usable or quantifiable definition for "significant progress" or "different life form".

I hope you appreciate how when you ask "is the math right", the most polite answer you'll get is "No, because there isn't any real math and what you have posted is meaningless", and most of the time people are going to laugh at you, shake their head, and walk away.

 

[savagewind]

Ah, "I guessed". Got it.



So let's summarize here.....you guessed that it would take a thousand years for evolution to make "significant progress" and "different life forms", but you don't have any sort of usable or quantifiable definition for "significant progress" or "different life form".

I hope you appreciate how when you ask "is the math right", the most polite answer you'll get is "No, because there isn't any real math and what you have posted is meaningless", and most of the time people are going to laugh at you, shake their head, and walk away.

Hahahaha A different life form is life that can not be compared as the same to generations ago.

You appear to me a lot smarter than you seem. LOL

 

[savagewind]

How many generations is there between life forms where the parent life form looks very, very, very little than the one we see for real? You do not understand? Or is this some kind of weird, funny, stupid, test?

 

[Jose Fly]

Hahahaha A different life form is life that can not be compared as the same to generations ago.

And you honestly think that's mathematically meaningful and usable?

 

[Jose Fly]

How many generations is there between life forms where the parent life form looks very, very, very little than the one we see for real? You do not understand? Or is this some kind of weird, funny, stupid, test?

You're the one claiming to have done the calculations. Let's see 'em.

 

[savagewind]

And you honestly think that's mathematically meaningful and usable?

No, but I think that someone might get it!
I believe there's SPIRIT about math, physics, and so forth. I can't do the math, but I can see the spirit.
I do not know if I can do the math because I never tried. I live in view of The Spirit.

 

[Jose Fly]

Me: "And you honestly think that's mathematically meaningful and usable?"

No

Then we're done here, and your appeals to math are meaningless.

 

[savagewind]

You're the one claiming to have done the calculations. Let's see 'em.

Seeing math and calculating it are different. I can see it. To calculate it takes much time and patience, of which I do not allow.

 

[savagewind]

Me: "And you honestly think that's mathematically meaningful and usable?"



Then we're done here, and your appeals to math are meaningless.

I am appealing to visions of time. Time is counted, therefore math.

 

[Jose Fly]

Seeing math and calculating it are different. I can see it. To calculate it takes much time and patience, of which I do not allow.

Ok. Get back to us when you've done some actual math.

 

[savagewind]

Ok. Get back to us when you've done some actual math.

If I knew how to do the equations and then got back to you with them, I do not doubt that you would reject it
out-of-hand like you do everything.