Kingdom Gospel ism

[David1967]

You know that there are more than ten commandments, yes?

Ten commandments and a whole lotta laws.

 

[exchemist]

In Bible speak, I find 'gospel' is good news such as the good news of God's kingdom of Daniel 2:44.
That kingdom government is the good news of Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8 that Jesus said would be proclaimed on an international scale just as it is being done world-wide today.

In bible speak, i.e. in the table of contents to my bible, I find that there are four gospels.

 

[BilliardsBall]

The Kingdom Gospel is all about conditions, just as the Promise to Abraham had it's own conditions. Since Jesus tells us that the Father gave to Jesus those who belonged to God, doesn't that mean that the Law of Moses has continued from Eden through Matthew... and continues like skipping-stones, through the Revelation? Since the Heaven and Earth have not passed away and will not do so until the Millennium of the Kingdom is finished, and since Jesus says that His words will never pass away... I find that the gospel of Paul is written exclusively for the gentiles. Because according to Jesus, not one word of the Law is removed from His Kingdom Gospel, making His Gospel the gospel to the circumcision.

I am new here... so, moderators, if you please... tell me if I do wrong in posting this thread.

Respectfully, it is almost impossible to understand Paul or the NT writers correctly if you think they wrote only to Gentiles, or parse Jesus's gospel as for Jews only. Most of the Christian cults parse it so, and make themselves the inheritors of the blessings to Israel.

Specifically the many purposes of the Law are explained in the NT, along with the law's replacement by the cross in us, and the OT also promises a time when the Law is written on hearts rather than tables of stone... a new covenant.

 

[OtherSheep]

I can't argue with your logic.

However, the question of the law of Moses in our time

I don't see anything in Moses that talks about sacrifice in foreign lands. I see where Jesus woes the Pharisees for teaching the commandments of men. I follow the One Shepherd wherever He goes.

 

[OtherSheep]

In Bible speak, I find 'gospel' is good news such as the good news of God's kingdom of Daniel 2:44.
That kingdom government is the good news of Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8 that Jesus said would be proclaimed on an international scale just as it is being done world-wide today.

Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom (Matthew 4:23), the everlasting gospel (Revelation 14:6), then shall the end come (Matthew 24:14); Heaven and earth shall pass away but My words shall not pass away (Matthew 24:35).

 

[OtherSheep]

I find while the temporary Constitution of the Mosaic Law was still in effect as the ^ above ^ applies.
Jesus fulfilled that old Law as per Romans 10:4.

Jesus' Kingdom Gospel says the opposite of Romans 10:4. And... if you're born in the circumcision, stay in the circumcision (1 Corinthians 7:18). There are two gospels, one for the uncircumcision, another for the circumcision (Galatians 2:7).

The Mosaic Law has been strengthened by Matthew 24:35. Jesus quotes the Mosaic Law, over and over again, in Matthew 5. He doesn't take it away (Matthew 5:18), He adds to the Law the judgment of the heart. Jeremiah's prophecy of the New Covenant (Jer 31:31-34) is fulfilled by the Gospel of the Kingdom: The Law written on our hearts is the Holy Spirit reminding us of what Jesus has said, and teaching us what He meant (John 14:26).

 

[OtherSheep]

I find at Revelation 7:9 there is an un-numbered great number of people mentioned who come through the great tribulation of Revelation 7:14. They are the humble figurative ' sheep ' of Matthew 25:31-33,37,40, so that seems to indicate that number is more than the congregation of Revelation's Philadelphia congregation - Isaiah 26:20.

You are correct, I misspoke... I knew it the second I posted it, and forgot to go back and fix it... thank you for reminding me.

I meant to say through Tribulation, not through the Great Tribulation. Obviously, Philadelphia will be killed by the beast, exactly as Smyrna was killed. There is no purging by fire where Brotherly Love is fully formed. The Philadelphia assembly, IMHO, will be 144k.

 

[OtherSheep]

Respectfully, it is almost impossible to understand Paul or the NT writers correctly if you think they wrote only to Gentiles, or parse Jesus's gospel as for Jews only. Most of the Christian cults parse it so, and make themselves the inheritors of the blessings to Israel.

Specifically the many purposes of the Law are explained in the NT, along with the law's replacement by the cross in us, and the OT also promises a time when the Law is written on hearts rather than tables of stone... a new covenant.

Because Jesus says that He came only to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel, in Matthew 15:24, and Jesus says that He taught the Gospel of the Kingdom, in Matthew 4:23... Jesus is in fact saying that the Kingdom Gospel is the Gospel to the Circumcision.

And Jesus isn't the only one who says it.

"And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we [should go] unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision."

People who are genetically members of the Lost Sheep of Israel, or of Judah/Benjamin which became Lost Sheep in that dark day they were scattered... these are the inheritors of the land of Israel.

The Pharisees killed Jesus for His inheritance, Matthew 21:38. Pharisee means to scatter, scattered is scorpion, scorpion means mark.

 

[OtherSheep]

I have a theory that says Matthew wrote his view of the Gospel in Aramaic/Hebrew. Many of the crucial incidents that happen in the gospel we call Matthew's, happened when Matthew wasn't there... but Peter and John were.

 

[Truthseeker]

Jesus never says He died to the Law. How could He when He tells us that the Law will not pass away until Heaven and Earth pass away? To be born from above you must love Jesus and be keeping His commandments... then Jesus will give you the Holy Spirit, to remind you of all that He has said, and to explain to you what He meant. The New Covenant is only different from the First Covenant by the advent of the Holy Spirit who does what Jesus says He would do... write the Law on our hearts. Jesus says His word will never pass away, and that by His words we are to be judged. He proves this to us in the Book of the Revelation, by saying I know your works. Works are the fruitful seed of the parable of the sower. Works are the fig tree coming to life at the time of the end. Philadelphia is given the ability to pass through Tribulation unscathed, because she is Brotherly Love... which is what good fruits literally mean.

Whenever a Messenger comes he annuls the old. Spiritually the old heaven and earth pass away and a new one is put in it's place. Earth is the knowledge of God, and heaven are the laws of God.

 

[Truthseeker]

Or fewer. Didn't Christ say there were really only two?

He said that the law hung on the two, so there are more than two. Christ wanted His followers to obey the ten commandments, plus some other laws that Christ introduced, like not getting divorced.

 

[OtherSheep]

Whenever a Messenger comes he annuls the old. Spiritually the old heaven and earth pass away and a new one is put in it's place. Earth is the knowledge of God, and heaven are the laws of God.

If that were true, then the new prophet would be able to throw away the very doctrine which tells people how to know that he's a false prophet.

 

[blü 2]

I don't see anything in Moses that talks about sacrifice in foreign lands. I see where Jesus woes the Pharisees for teaching the commandments of men. I follow the One Shepherd wherever He goes.

Your initial question seemed to me to ask whether the Law of the Tanakh was eternal. Clearly it isn't, as that well-known send-up shows with great clarity.

And incidentally shows how anti-gay preachers pick and choose to suit themselves, with no thought to those words attributed to Jesus that urge inclusion and generosity of spirit to everyone. Even anti-abortionists don't read their bible eg Hosea 13:16.

Our morality is a matter of our genes first ─ we're mammals who've evolved to be a gregarious species ─ and then our culture and experience. We live in 2018, not the Bronze Age. If as you seem to be saying we need to look principally to ourselves to decide what's right, not to old books, then I agree with you completely.

 

[David T]

The Kingdom Gospel is all about conditions, just as the Promise to Abraham had it's own conditions. Since Jesus tells us that the Father gave to Jesus those who belonged to God, doesn't that mean that the Law of Moses has continued from Eden through Matthew... and continues like skipping-stones, through the Revelation? Since the Heaven and Earth have not passed away and will not do so until the Millennium of the Kingdom is finished, and since Jesus says that His words will never pass away... I find that the gospel of Paul is written exclusively for the gentiles. Because according to Jesus, not one word of the Law is removed from His Kingdom Gospel, making His Gospel the gospel to the circumcision.

I am new here... so, moderators, if you please... tell me if I do wrong in posting this thread.

Interesting.... Conditional unconditionalism Seems rather confused. Like orderly random.

 

[OtherSheep]

Your initial question seemed to me to ask whether the Law of the Tanakh was eternal. Clearly it isn't, as that well-known send-up shows with great clarity.

And incidentally shows how anti-gay preachers pick and choose to suit themselves, with no thought to those words attributed to Jesus that urge inclusion and generosity of spirit to everyone. Even anti-abortionists don't read their bible eg Hosea 13:16.

Our morality is a matter of our genes first ─ we're mammals who've evolved to be a gregarious species ─ and then our culture and experience. We live in 2018, not the Bronze Age. If as you seem to be saying we need to look principally to ourselves to decide what's right, not to old books, then I agree with you completely.

The without-law-gospel is one of expediency tied to a lack of conscience. It is so at odds with itself that it contradicts its own principles on every page. While it claims that all things are lawful, it whines when it's disciples commit incest.

The Law and the Prophets are eternal, insofar as they match what Jesus calls His own eternal words. (This means no Sodom and no child-sactifice. Those people will not be living in the Kingdom.)

You and I disagree on every point, blü 2.

 

[OtherSheep]

Interesting.... Conditional unconditionalism Seems rather confused. Like orderly random.

The void between
"Conditional Kingdom Gospel"

or​

"unconditional grace gospel"
can never be bridged.

What happens is the anomia people pretend that the murder of Jesus
and the theft of His inheritance made the Kingdom Gospel go away.
But the Kingdom Gospel will be preached in all the world by the
two witnesses. The anomia will be told that Jesus never knew them.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Because Jesus says that He came only to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel, in Matthew 15:24, and Jesus says that He taught the Gospel of the Kingdom, in Matthew 4:23... Jesus is in fact saying that the Kingdom Gospel is the Gospel to the Circumcision.

And Jesus isn't the only one who says it.

"And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we [should go] unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision."

People who are genetically members of the Lost Sheep of Israel, or of Judah/Benjamin which became Lost Sheep in that dark day they were scattered... these are the inheritors of the land of Israel.

The Pharisees killed Jesus for His inheritance, Matthew 21:38. Pharisee means to scatter, scattered is scorpion, scorpion means mark.

In the four gospels, Jesus quotes prophecies referencing Himself that He would have two flocks including the Gentiles, and merge them. The fact that some apostles chose Jewish evangelism and others Gentile outreach is missing the fact that Paul still stayed in rabbis' houses after, preached in synagogues, and said he was working diligently via Gentile evangelism to reach Jews for salvation (Romans 10-11).

Jesus genuinely presented Himself to Israel, and per prophecy saved all people via the Cross as one result.

 

[sojourner]

It appears to be based upon the two distinct gospels, to two different sets of people. One, those who kept the circumcision and all of the 10 commandments, even outside of the land of Israel. The other, for those who didn't want the law, or weren't genetic Israel from the Lost Sheep.

No; it’s the same gospel. That gospel transcends the Mosaic Law to encompass a greater cross section of cultures. The gospel isn’t a “continuation” of Mosaic Law, but a new creation that springs from it.

 

[David T]

The void between
"Conditional Kingdom Gospel"

or​

"unconditional grace gospel"
can never be bridged.

What happens is the anomia people pretend that the murder of Jesus
and the theft of His inheritance made the Kingdom Gospel go away.
But the Kingdom Gospel will be preached in all the world by the
two witnesses. The anomia will be told that Jesus never knew them.

So identical to most in physics we have a conditional or conceptual state state called "laws" of physics and those laws are followed by reality.... Is that about right?

 

[blü 2]

The without-law-gospel is one of expediency tied to a lack of conscience.

When it's asserted as eternal, god-given bible law, it's certainly self-serving and very probably expedient. It may or may not be without conscience, though.

While it claims that all things are lawful, it whines when it's disciples commit incest.

Where does it say that?

The Law and the Prophets are eternal, insofar as they match what Jesus calls His own eternal words.

Nothing is eternal. There are no moral absolutes ─ if you disagree, please state one. An onlooker could fairly point to your choice of Jesus as arbitrary, too, though the NT attributes to him a number of sayings I agree with. And there are things in the Tanakh I also agree with.

(This means no Sodom

Just call it homophobia. Don't bother with attempts to justify it scripturally ─ it's just personal intolerance and that expedience you mentioned. Homosexuality occurs throughout nature; it's an aspect of evolution that's simply there.

and no child-sactifice.

So you like the idea of sacrificing the occasional adult human just to keep the ratings up? I'd call that sick.

Those people will not be living in the Kingdom.

I don't know why they'd want to. I wouldn't. Besides, I'm a democrat, not a monarchist. If I'm to be governed, I want a say in who governs and how. None of the ads for heaven seem to want to talk about the dictatorship aspect.

You and I disagree on every point, blü 2.

Just about every point, it seems. Ah well.