Koran & Hadith in plain english?

[MyM]

But you skip the part where Uthman collected all the Qurans, made a new one, and burned the rest!
Now, if it was all the same, why not give the old ones back?
And Hakim, why did he burned Muhammad's quran?
And the added verses to equal Muhammad with Allah's name?
You know, the reason why there are Sunni and Shiah?

No, you just gave me Muslim propaganda, and no history.
Propaganda is what you get fed by scholars who wants to keep you away from the light, keeping you in the dark.
If they were transparent, they will tell you that not even the Egyptian Golden Quran dating from the 11th century, and your 1928 Egyptian Quran is the same.

Now, concerning the Crucifixion, did you read the 4 gospels that describes the crucifixion?
This was not Paul that wrote it.
Even the Quran say that these people did see the crucifixion!
So, who is now calling Allah a liar?
You, because the gospels are attested by the Quran, and Q4: 157 says they did see Jesus dying on the cross.
Dont you believe in Allah?

I already discussed this with you in length. You refused to listen.

first of all, Allah says,
“Verily, We, it is We Who have sent down the Dhikr (i.e. the Quran) and surely, We will guard it (from corruption)” al-Hijr 15:9

“And (it is) a Quran which We have divided (into parts), in order that you might recite it to men at intervals. And We have revealed it by stages'' al-Isra’ 17:106

They used to memorize the Quran by heart, and a few of them used to write down some verses or surahs on animal skins, thin white stones and the stuff similar. Prophet pbuh forbade the writing of anything other than the Quran, and he forbade them to write down his words for a while, so that the Sahabah would focus on memorizing the Quran and writing it down, and so that the words of the Prophet pbuh would not be confused with the words of Allah, and so the Quran was protected from anything being added or taken away. The messenger of Allah pbuh, ordered but a few of the sahabah who were trustworthy and knowledgeable to write down the revelation. Not anyone had the pleasure of doing this and you never went against Mohammad pbuh.

The Quran was revealed in seven dialects at first then 10 at last. Abu Bakr was afraid that the Quran would get lost due to many of the sahaba being killed so he entrusted Zayd ibn Thabit to gather it up to form the book and it stayed in the house of Abu Bakr and then with Hafsa the daughter of Umar peace be unto them. Now during the time of 'Uthman, upon hearing the DIFFERENT RECITATIONS-not different words, not different meanings, but different recitations, he ordered all to be gathered as to not cause fitna(trials, troubles) amongst the people. The ones that were gathered were burned because in Islam, we don't believe to dishonor Allah's words to be in the trash or anything in the like.

There is NOTHING about changing the Quran. Nothing about redoing the Quran or adding or deleting. Nothing of any sort was done to the Quran that the Messenger of Allah pbuh gave orders to write down. They did nothing wrong.

It was given in a book form to keep and until now, not one word has changed in it.

 

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The Sunnah explains the Quran. Hadiths were forbidden to be written to hide the truth of Ahlulbayt (a) as much as possible from society, but people would write some hadiths in commentary of Quran. This is why they collected Qurans and burned them. To hide the Sunnah as much as possible.

 

[MyM]

So, you say Muslim scholars who translated the Quran in English are lying and insulting Allah!
Remember, I did not say this is what it means, I said, "This is what Muslim scholars and Ex Muslim Arabs say!"

Your fight is not with me, but with Muslims that knows the true meaning of the Arab words.
I am just informing you what I found, and I dont like what I learned.

Secondly, I dont want to derail your post, but to claim that the Quran neve changed over 1400 years is simply not true.
Do you know that a goat ate the verses where Allah instructed men visiting Muhammad's wifes, to suck their breasts, because they will then be their children, and Muhammad would trust them not to cheat on him with his wifes?
This from the mouth of Aisha.

Another evidence that Uthman standardised the Quran is the fact that no where in the Quran does it say that adulteres should be stoned!
Yet when Zaid collected the bits and pieces of the Quran from everyone, he could not find this verse, and left it out.

Wow!
Allah could not protect His verses?

Yet, all muslims knows the stoning of adulterers law was a revelation from Allah, yet the quran does not say that.

Q 24: 2 "The woman and the man guilty of zināʾ (for fornication or adultery),- flog each of them with a hundred stripes: Let not compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day: and let a party of the Believers witness their punishment."

OK, so please tell me why Muslims stones adulterers, when Allah clearly dont say it!

Another Muslim predicament when evidence shows Uthman changed the Quran.

I think that you just want to argue.

Allah also says to pray five times a day but doesn't say how in the Quran. That is why Allah says to follow his Quran and His Sunnah of Mohammad. pbuh.

I don't really care what you say about that verse concerning our beloved Maryam, chosen above all women in all nations of the world. In the Arabic verse it doesn't say he blew into her vagina. Go to any arabic speaker and ask them lol the word is nafakhaa feehi... means blow into her...... . So wherever you are getting your information from. DISMISS IT. Arabic is precise. It's not something to take like we know it without asking those who know more. We cannot say where Allah blew into Maryam because he did not mention it. But womb the scholars say is the closest if you are to get so technical.


You say you have all these evidences, but you can't back up your claims because you are not knowledgeable in the religion of Islam, Arabic or that much in the religion. It's all based on heresay or the things you read that are not authenticated or you just read and pick and choose what you wish to make an argument.

Still what does the word BEGOTTEN MEAN??????

WHY ARE YOU DISMISSING IT?

 

[MyM]

The Sunnah explains the Quran. Hadiths were forbidden to be written to hide the truth of Ahlulbayt (a) as much as possible from society, but people would write some hadiths in commentary of Quran. This is why they collected Qurans and burned them. To hide the Sunnah as much as possible.

That is your version

How are you link? I'm suffering with Covid bleh and its a harsh virus!! Fever gets to 40c then down then up n then down...may Allah take away my sins ameen

 

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That is your version

How are you link? I'm suffering with Covid bleh and its a harsh virus!! Fever gets to 40c then down then up n then down...may Allah take away my sins ameen

Salam

I hope you get better soon. I'm alright, I get to on top of somethings school wise today. But doing okay.

 

[MyM]

Do you agree that the 1924 Quran you have is not the same as Muhammad's?
Then I will go over to begotten.
No problem pal.

The Quran has not been changed. IT HAS NOT BEEN CHANGED. Same words, same meanings. get it through your head.

I can conceivably make a copy of the Quran but not change anything in it. Doesn't mean it is my Quran.

 

[SA Huguenot]

I think that you just want to argue.

Allah also says to pray five times a day but doesn't say how in the Quran. That is why Allah says to follow his Quran and His Sunnah of Mohammad. pbuh.

I don't really care what you say about that verse concerning our beloved Maryam, chosen above all women in all nations of the world. In the Arabic verse it doesn't say he blew into her vagina. Go to any arabic speaker and ask them lol the word is nafakhaa feehi... means blow into her...... . So wherever you are getting your information from. DISMISS IT. Arabic is precise. It's not something to take like we know it without asking those who know more. We cannot say where Allah blew into Maryam because he did not mention it. But womb the scholars say is the closest if you are to get so technical.


You say you have all these evidences, but you can't back up your claims because you are not knowledgeable in the religion of Islam, Arabic or that much in the religion. It's all based on heresay or the things you read that are not authenticated or you just read and pick and choose what you wish to make an argument.

Still what does the word BEGOTTEN MEAN??????

WHY ARE YOU DISMISSING IT?

Not dismissing anything, I told you we can open a debate where we can discuss any point you wanted about the Bible etc.
But, I still think it is important that you agree that all the English translations of the Quran is false, and whitewashed to prevent the western world to see what a bad book it actually is.
Therefore, the Quran "English versions
are all CORRUPTED!

and as for the Arabic script, it contains changes, lost revelations, spelling errors, new words, 2 added verses etc.

Do you agree to the above?
You see, even if you do agree to the above, it still does not change the message of the Quran in the least.
It is just that Muslims are too proud or brainwashed to think that the 1924 Quran they have "somehow mirracilously" never changed.
Now untill Muslims cant even be truthfull about this fact, no person on earth would be able to debate with such people.
Greetings.

 

[SA Huguenot]

The Quran has not been changed. IT HAS NOT BEEN CHANGED. Same words, same meanings. get it through your head.

I can conceivably make a copy of the Quran but not change anything in it. Doesn't mean it is my Quran.

Well, if you remain in the dark, you are welcome to believe it.
Only, Muslims know such a claim is false.
Just look at your muslim scholar Rashad Khalifa that gave the evidence from Islamic history.
Its not Me pal, your Muslim scholars say so!
Why dont you check the link on a slight accusation.
Muslims Say: The Quran Has Never Changed! - Isa And Islam

 

[SA Huguenot]

The Quran has not been changed. IT HAS NOT BEEN CHANGED. Same words, same meanings. get it through your head.

I can conceivably make a copy of the Quran but not change anything in it. Doesn't mean it is my Quran.

NOW GET IT THROUGH YOUR HEAD. THE QURAN CHANGED OVER THE CENTURIES AND WHAT YOU HAVE DATES FRON 1924.
IT IS NOT THE SAME AS THE ORIGINAL.
YOU DONT EVEN HAVE MUHAMMAD'S QURAN TO COMPARE IT WITH!
Have there been changes to the Quran?
1924 Quran arabic say
“And if ye die, or are slain, Lo! It is unto Allah that ye are brought together.”
However the “Great Paris Manuscript,”Surah 3:158
if you die or are slain, you are NOT brought together unto Allah!

 

[MyM]

Well, if you remain in the dark, you are welcome to believe it.
Only, Muslims know such a claim is false.
Just look at your muslim scholar Rashad Khalifa that gave the evidence from Islamic history.
Its not Me pal, your Muslim scholars say so!
Why dont you check the link on a slight accusation.
Muslims Say: The Quran Has Never Changed! - Isa And Islam

Here we go again, if you are seriously wanting to disprove the Quran, ask about it sincerely and not go into a hated website that demeans Islam.

Again, why have you not gotten back to me about the word BEGOTTEN????

STILL WAITING.

 

[SA Huguenot]

Here we go again, if you are seriously wanting to disprove the Quran, ask about it sincerely and not go into a hated website that demeans Islam.

What do you mean this website "Demeans Islam.
They are only taking MUSLIM sources and showing MUSLIMS that the Quran was changed, and denying is a lie!
If their sources and quotes was not from Islamic sources, I could have rejected it myself.
But here you are telling me in an ad Hominen argument that the person telling you these stuff are liars, but you dont look at the facts they show you.

 

[MyM]

Not dismissing anything, I told you we can open a debate where we can discuss any point you wanted about the Bible etc.
But, I still think it is important that you agree that all the English translations of the Quran is false, and whitewashed to prevent the western world to see what a bad book it actually is.
Therefore, the Quran "English versions
are all CORRUPTED!

and as for the Arabic script, it contains changes, lost revelations, spelling errors, new words, 2 added verses etc.

Do you agree to the above?
You see, even if you do agree to the above, it still does not change the message of the Quran in the least.
It is just that Muslims are too proud or brainwashed to think that the 1924 Quran they have "somehow mirracilously" never changed.
Now untill Muslims cant even be truthfull about this fact, no person on earth would be able to debate with such people.
Greetings.

seriously, you have a problem. I am telling you that it isn't true, but you are telling me it is. I know more about my religion than you do. I have read the translations from the most authenticated sources. I see no whitewash. Why are you so adamant on saying they are? Is it because you don't understand?!

The Quran has no fault in it. The Arabic is still the same as it was 1400 years ago. Over 1.5 BILLION Muslims in the world will tell you the exact same thing... millions upon millions have the Quran memorized entirely. I myself have memorized Sura Baqarah, Al Imraan, An Nisa', Al Mai'da, suratal Mulk and juza Tabarak (the end chapters) If you were to tell me to recite Qul huwa Allahu ahad...I know the exact meaning and if you were to try and change it in english and push it off as some other meaning, I CAN CORRECT YOU.
In saying that, stop trying to push what you think wrongly onto something you have no chance of winning.

 

[MyM]

What do you mean this website "Demeans Islam.
They are only taking MUSLIM sources and showing MUSLIMS that the Quran was changed, and denying is a lie!
If their sources and quotes was not from Islamic sources, I could have rejected it myself.
But here you are telling me in an ad Hominen argument that the person telling you these stuff are liars, but you dont look at the facts they show you.

With a cross symbol lool give me a break. Sorry but anyone can imitate a site that proves nothing to me. The sources are not authenticated.

 

[SA Huguenot]

The Quran has no fault in it.

Mmmm realy?
Do you think that the Quran has no fault if it says Allah created sailships?
And that Allah commands all these ships?
Do you think Allah was corrct when He revealed that the Sun sets in a murky spring?
when Duhl Quartnain travelled east and saw the sun rising over people who get verry hot, or where Duhl Quarnain built a wall and a steel gate between mountains?
Or when Allah said He made the Earth, then everything on the Earth, then he brought the heaven and the Earth together when the Heaven was still a Nebulous cloud?
What about changing Jews into pigs and apes?

What about Allah telling us that the witnesses to the crucifixion DID SEE JESUS DIE ON THE CROSS, but it was only a MOVIE SHOW ALLAH PROJECTED TO EVERYONE!

 

[MyM]

NOW GET IT THROUGH YOUR HEAD. THE QURAN CHANGED OVER THE CENTURIES AND WHAT YOU HAVE DATES FRON 1924.
IT IS NOT THE SAME AS THE ORIGINAL.
YOU DONT EVEN HAVE MUHAMMAD'S QURAN TO COMPARE IT WITH!
Have there been changes to the Quran?
1924 Quran arabic say
“And if ye die, or are slain, Lo! It is unto Allah that ye are brought together.”
However the “Great Paris Manuscript,”Surah 3:158
if you die or are slain, you are NOT brought together unto Allah!

Stop just stop. The Quran speaks for itself. I rest my case. Millions upon Millions of muslims have memorized this Book of God and they all repeat the same. The words are the same, the meanings are the same over 1400 years ago.

I have explained to you omg why can't you understand what I am saying??

 

[SA Huguenot]

With a cross symbol lool give me a break. Sorry but anyone can imitate a site that proves nothing to me. The sources are not authenticated.

Now why should I give you a break.
All I did is to show you how bad Muslims translated the Quran into English!
You dont have to answer me on anything my friend.

 

[MyM]

Mmmm realy?
Do you think that the Quran has no fault if it says Allah created sailships?
And that Allah commands all these ships?
Do you think Allah was corrct when He revealed that the Sun sets in a murky spring?
when Duhl Quartnain travelled east and saw the sun rising over people who get verry hot, or where Duhl Quarnain built a wall and a steel gate between mountains?
Or when Allah said He made the Earth, then everything on the Earth, then he brought the heaven and the Earth together when the Heaven was still a Nebulous cloud?
What about changing Jews into pigs and apes?

What about Allah telling us that the witnesses to the crucifixion DID SEE JESUS DIE ON THE CROSS, but it was only a MOVIE SHOW ALLAH PROJECTED TO EVERYONE!

Look, I am not here to bash you or you to bash me. I will not continue talking when you cannot even define the word BEGOTTEN that I asked you to define in how many posts? You said you will but YOU NEVER HAVE.

You do that, I then will answer your questions.

 

[SA Huguenot]

Stop just stop. The Quran speaks for itself. I rest my case. Millions upon Millions of muslims have memorized this Book of God and they all repeat the same. The words are the same, the meanings are the same over 1400 years ago.

I have explained to you omg why can't you understand what I am saying??

Millions upon Millions of Muslims memorised the revised Uthman Quran, that the Egyptians canonised in 1924.
What about the millions of North Africans that dont use the 1924 Quran?
They use the 900 year old Warsh Quran. it is different and uses the word "I" in the place where the 1924 say "He", when Allah speaks.

No pal, there are at least 26 different Qurans in the world, and yours are only 98 years old.

 

[MyM]

Now why should I give you a break.
All I did is to show you how bad Muslims translated the Quran into English!
You dont have to answer me on anything my friend.

lol if it were BAD MUSLIMS then that is what they are...bad. No one is perfect but that one was purely not knowing the proper Arabic text. Sorry so please do NOT take it as thus. Then you have sooooooo many others that don't say that so why pick on one???? sheesh

 

[SA Huguenot]

Look, I am not here to bash you or you to bash me. I will not continue talking when you cannot even define the word BEGOTTEN that I asked you to define in how many posts? You said you will but YOU NEVER HAVE.

You do that, I then will answer your questions.

Just to show you that Arab speaking Christians tells us that the Quran is whitewashed from bad words.
Tell me where theis guy is wrong