Leaving RF

[Katzpur]

It is positively amazing how similar they are! I am not easily amazed.

Sort of a perfect example of "Do as I say, not as I do," huh?

 

[jeager106]

My mother was a J.W. as were her siblings.
The siblings, my aunts and uncles were genuinely nice, semi-honest :>) people.
Why semi-honest? Well mom worked at a plant that made garage door remote
control openers.
Her younger brother asked her to "get" him one.
That meant have the workers sneak one outside the fence. STEAL IT!.
And so she did!
Wonder how many Watchtowers they placed that week?
This is in no way meant to cast stones at the organization or Witnesses in general.
I've known many J.W.'s and most all were really devoted, genuine, loving, people.
And the notion of shunning X-mas?
NOT! I knew of many Witnesses, including mother, that took part in the holiday
but kept the drapes closed so no one could see the tree and decorations.
This was pretty common in the circles I'm familiar with.
I grew up terribly confused and torn between what was said and what was done.
Then there was the J.W. elder who was screwing a married J.W. woman younger
than his grown daughter.
This man's daughter, also a J.W. was a stoned alcoholic.
I drank many a bottle with her and other "under ground" friends.
Hypocrites abound in ALL organizations.
Gee, my own mother got a citation to appear on the old charge of slander.
She was to appear before the city solicitor for a scolding and answer for defamation
for bad talking & gossiping about the neighbors teen aged daughters calling them
sluts and whores.
She took a couple of elders to the session with her to explain a J.W. would
never stoop to that . Well she DID do that as I overheard her many times.
She got a scolding anyway.Then there was the elder that messed with my
12 year old sister.
But so goes the way of humanity. Perfection is a goal but we all fall short.

 

[savagewind]

@jeager106
I saw no badness in people when I was almost twenty years in the organization. But I was the only one of my family and my husband's family who was a JW.
Being that my family was not JW I was never invited into the inner circle so of course, there was nothing for me to see.
That there are Jehovah's Witnesses who do not live by the Golden Rule I can see by reading between the lines what they show is that it really does not
matter to be true in the "truth" (they call themselves that) and that God does not care.

 

[jeager106]

@jeager106
I saw no badness in people when I was almost twenty years in the organization. But I was the only one of my family and my husband's family who was a JW.
Being that my family was not JW I was never invited into the inner circle so of course, there was nothing for me to see.
That there are Jehovah's Witnesses who do not live by the Golden Rule I can see by reading between the lines what they show is that it really does not
matter to be true in the "truth" (they call themselves that) and that God does not care.

It's hard to be a J.W. and divorce one's self from so much of the rest of society.
"have no part of this world" can be interpreted many, many, ways.
I DO admire my J.W. relatives for being as close to the religion as possible.
It takes a lot of determination to maintain that position.
I'm fond of that religion actually but wonder if I have the fortitude to stand against
so much "worldly" tradition.
To THIS DAY I feel guilty for buying Christmas gifts and can not put up
a tree in my own home out of fear of ticking off God.
Of course J.W.s don't believe in hell or eternal torment ( me also ) only being
cut off from God and death.

 

[Neo Deist]

I have read those articles and others. The WT is basically telling JWs to stay off internet chat forums and such, because many of them were asking questions after engaging in said forums. Those JWs were learning some truths and the WT did not want that. It moved to try and maintain its control, power and influence against what it perceived as a threat. The Roman Catholic Church did the same thing with regard to an English translation of the Bible. It is a defensive mechanism that is used when it knows it will lose if said situation continues.

 

[Deeje]

I have read those articles and others. The WT is basically telling JWs to stay off internet chat forums and such, because many of them were asking questions after engaging in said forums. Those JWs were learning some truths and the WT did not want that. It moved to try and maintain its control, power and influence against what it perceived as a threat. The Roman Catholic Church did the same thing with regard to an English translation of the Bible. It is a defensive mechanism that is used when it knows it will lose if said situation continues.

What a load of old cods.

Learning some truths?.....seriously you think we are kept in the dark about anything? We are well aware of what apostates say about us...probably if Jesus was preaching today, there would be websites twisting what he said too. It is water off a duck's back.

It is the twisting of information that poses the problem and this is what our brothers warn us about. The devil managed to convince a whole nation that the perfect son of God was a fake Messiah...a trouble maker and a common blasphemer, deserving of death....imagine what he can do with his imperfect disciples? People today are as gullible to juicy bit of gossip as they always were....but just remember...you will be judged by the same measure with which you judge others. If you judge after hearing only one side of a story, be thankful if you ever go to court that the judge has to hear BOTH sides before he makes a judgment. God knows all sides.

The Watchtower is a Bible Society that does not exert power or control over anyone. It is God's own word that is "active" upon his worshippers and motivates a person to right conclusions. (Hebrews 4:12-13)

You can believe whatever you like....but the truth is missing from the twisted, one sided stories of our opposers. Its all rubbish. That is often what you find in the gutter.

Are we going to play shoot the messenger again? Its all been done before.....

 

[Neo Deist]

What a load of old cods.

Learning some truths?.....seriously you think we are kept in the dark about anything? We are well aware of what apostates say about us...probably if Jesus was preaching today, there would be websites twisting what he said too. It is water off a duck's back.

It is the twisting of information that poses the problem and this is what our brothers warn us about. The devil managed to convince a whole nation that the perfect son of God was a fake Messiah...a trouble maker and a common blasphemer, deserving of death....imagine what he can do with his imperfect disciples? People today are as gullible to juicy bit of gossip as they always were....but just remember...you will be judged by the same measure with which you judge others. If you judge after hearing only one side of a story, be thankful if you ever go to court that the judge has to hear BOTH sides before he makes a judgment. God knows all sides.

The Watchtower is a Bible Society that does not exert power or control over anyone. It is God's own word that is "active" upon his worshippers and motivates a person to right conclusions. (Hebrews 4:12-13)

You can believe whatever you like....but the truth is missing from the twisted, one sided stories of our opposers. Its all rubbish. That is often what you find in the gutter.

Are we going to play shoot the messenger again? Its all been done before.....

Brainwashing at its finest.

Jesus said to spread the good news. Your WT is telling you not to. What could possibly be the motivation for a religious organization to tell its members to stay off of internet forums? Hmmm...

 

[Deeje]

Brainwashing at its finest.

Jesus said to spread the good news. Your WT is telling you not to. What could possibly be the motivation for a religious organization to tell its members to stay off of internet forums? Hmmm...

Perhaps I should ask who brainwashed you?

The motivation has already been stated.....it is to prevent more trusting souls from being stumbled by people who are nothing more than wolves in sheep's clothing.

You think you know so much about everything, but it is clear to me that you know little about anything and are happy to promote your skewed version of things as if it were gospel truth.
That's OK because Jesus knows his sheep and they know him.....and that is all that matters.

 

[jeager106]

@Kolibri

I'm curious.
If you are leaving for reasons of your own why not just leave?
Why post you are leaving and explain why you are leaving?
Is the G.B. somehow afraid members here might corrupt your beliefs in some way?
I read posts by members of Islam, Jews, Protestants, Catholics, .....................................
I don't feel my spiritual beliefs are corrupted in any way.
Quite the contrary.
I feel spiritually enlightened in many ways.
I recall many years ago when I was somewhat associated with a local J.W. congregation and having a
LOT of trouble with alcoholism.
I began attending A.A. and outside consoling to quit drinking before the disease KILLED me.
Elders suggesting I study the J.W. Bible with a well recognized elder.
I did.
He poured me glasses of home made wine. REALLY?
Attending A.A. was very much frowned upon by the W.T.B.&T.S. (Governing Body)
It was thought prayer and meetings at the Kingdom Hall could prevent addiction.
Not so.
I drank alcoholically for DECADES and nearly did die several times.
I'm in remission through A.A. and my sober friends.
My A.A. sponsor is gay.
J.W.'s would CONDEMN be for even associating with that man that helps SAVE MY LIFE!
Though I was never a baptized J.W. I was shunned by those I knew, EVEN my FAMILY who were J.W.'s
for becoming a Police Officer.
Darn!
Jehovah judges, I do not. Judging isn't in my job description.
I would posit that taking part in internet discussion would be a premier method of spreading
the Good News of the Kingdom to come.
How many spiritual people can be reached via the internet?
J.W.'s are now even on television & radio spreading the Good News.
Do what you feel you must.

 

[jeager106]

@Deeje

My dear good friend.
Why are you still posing here?
I LOVE reading you and over time have become very fond of you and would miss you
very much were you not part of this forum.

 

[Neo Deist]

The motivation has already been stated.....it is to prevent more trusting souls from being stumbled by people who are nothing more than wolves in sheep's clothing.

Nah.

Sounds like too many in the fold were asking questions that the WT did not want to answer, and so they are issuing a mandate to try and nip it in the bud. Same old song and dance. It has been repeated many times throughout history.

 

[ukok102nak]

In light of this article Question Box — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY I will be leaving RF within the next few days. The direction given is put in bold print and the reasons given are solid ones.

I can reason that blocking from sight the posts from those disfellowshipped to protect their social vacuum (so as to not undermine Jehovah's loving discipline for them) as one way to comply w/o leaving RF. (1 Corinthians 5:5; 1 Timothy 1:20) I can also see blocking those determined to destroy my precious faith - especially those that left us because they were 'not of our sort' as a means to that end as well. (1 John 2:19)

However, If I died today, could my tombstone truthfully say:

He did not associate with deceitful men,
And he avoided those who hide what they are.
(Psalms 26:4)

We are reminded at 1 Corinthians 1:26 that among true Christians there are "not many wise by human standards". (footnote) Do I see myself above being duped by someone that sees themselves as the cat in a cat and mouse game? Have I ever felt like someone was stringing me along to see how long they can get me to talk with them when they know it would damage my relationship with Jehovah to do so?

I have also been considering 2 Timothy 2:23-26.

"Further, reject foolish and ignorant debates, knowing that they produce fights. For a slave of the Lord does not need to fight, but needs to be gentle toward all...."

Before considering the linked article I had already decided that I needed to further refine how and where I would post here. Some threads have lived too long and I had a share in keeping them alive.

Where there is no wood, the fire goes out,
And where there is no slanderer, quarreling ceases.
- Proverbs 26:20

[Avoid] the scornful man,
And contention will disappear;
Disputes and insults will cease.
- Proverbs 22:10

What brought me to the conclusion that I need to set a time limit and leave RF instead of just modifying my use of it was the part in the article just prior to the bold printed direction. The RF is not country specific. Can I say I am not seeking out people physically located in countries where online communication is monitored by hostile local authorities? Do I want to be responsible for those hostile authorities to use something I posted to fuel their hatred for Jehovah's pure worship and give them their excuse ramp up their acts of intolerance?

I've posted this in both under Religious Debate for everyone to see today, and in the Jehovah's Witnesses DIR so that it won't disappear quickly as not many new threads are opened there.

~;> perhaps we could share this writtings unto you
so as it is written
:read:
Isaiah 29:13
The Lord said, "Because this people draws near with their mouth and with their lips to honor me, but they have removed their heart far from me, but in vain do they worship me, teaching the commandments and doctrines of men.

Matthew 15:8
'These people honor me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9 And in vain do they worship me,
teaching as doctrine rules made by men.'"

thats why
as it is written
:read
Jeremiah 22:3
Thus says the Lord: "Execute justice and righteousness, and deliver him who is robbed out of the hand of the oppressor: and do no wrong, do no violence, to the foreigner, the fatherless, nor the widow; neither shed innocent blood in this place.


:ty:



godbless
unto all always

 

[savagewind]

...it is to prevent more trusting souls from being stumbled by people who are nothing more than wolves in sheep's clothing.
.

Except that a "trusting soul" can't be stumbled. If the Watchtower is really God's will be done on Earth, NOTHING will be able to convince a true believer otherwise.
Romans 8:38-39 Or is John 10:5 not true?

If a Jehovah's Witness can be stumbled, then she was not convinced in the first place.

 

[Deeje]

Matthew 18:1-7:
"In that hour the disciples came near to Jesus and said: “Who really is greatest in the Kingdom of the heavens?” 2 So calling a young child to him, he stood him in their midst 3 and said: “Truly I say to you, unless you turn around and become as young children, you will by no means enter into the Kingdom of the heavens. 4 Therefore, whoever will humble himself like this young child is the one who is the greatest in the Kingdom of the heavens; 5 and whoever receives one such young child on the basis of my name receives me also. 6 But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who have faith in me, it would be better for him to have hung around his neck a millstone that is turned by a donkey and to be sunk in the open sea.
7 “Woe to the world because of the stumbling blocks! Of course, it is inevitable that stumbling blocks will come, but woe to the man through whom the stumbling block comes!"

 

[ukok102nak]

~;> as it is written
:read:
Hebrews 10:35
Therefore do not throw away your boldness, which has a great reward.
36 For you need endurance so that, having done the will of God, you may receive the promise.
37 "In a very little while,
he who comes will come, and will not wait.
38 But my righteous onen will live by faith.
If he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him."

for so as it is written
:read:
Ephesians 6:12
For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against the principalities, against the powers, against the world's rulers of this darkness, and against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.


:ty:




godbless
unto all always

 

[savagewind]

Matthew 18:1-7:
"In that hour the disciples came near to Jesus and said: “Who really is greatest in the Kingdom of the heavens?” 2 So calling a young child to him, he stood him in their midst 3 and said: “Truly I say to you, unless you turn around and become as young children, you will by no means enter into the Kingdom of the heavens. 4 Therefore, whoever will humble himself like this young child is the one who is the greatest in the Kingdom of the heavens; 5 and whoever receives one such young child on the basis of my name receives me also. 6 But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who have faith in me, it would be better for him to have hung around his neck a millstone that is turned by a donkey and to be sunk in the open sea.
7 “Woe to the world because of the stumbling blocks! Of course, it is inevitable that stumbling blocks will come, but woe to the man through whom the stumbling block comes!"

But a "little" one is he or she that has not learned trust yet. It appears that you read between the lines just what you want to read between the lines. Again I say, "a TRUSTING soul can't be stumbled." Who do YOU trust @Deeje?

 

[savagewind]

Trust in Jehovah with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding...............and still..............if you do that...................you might be stumbled..........according to..........the Jehovah's Witnesses.

If stumbling is possible with trust in God, then why is it written that we should trust God?

If a person who is really following Jesus can be misled how is he the fine shepherd?

 

[firedragon]

I really enjoyed and learned from our discussions about Daniel, and I developed a newfound respect for Jehovah's Witnesses from dialogueing with you and other JW's, you will be missed

Sometimes I wonder where people like you are from mate. You have some quality about you you know that?

 

[ukok102nak]

~;> if we may say so
could we give some comments unto your post thats why we reply unto it
coz humans are having some short comings sometimes
thats why the sin comes after that
and it is not wrong if someone is not intending to sin meaning if some humans doesnt knew it is a sin from the beginning theyve done some things here in this reality
becaused some humans were been brainwashed eversince they were a child
look what happened unto those vietnamise kids during the american vietnam war
even those children participate in war becaused they were been brainwashed
by their leaders

were those children could be pronounced as sinners for they do not know what they do
as it is written
:read:
Luke 23:34
And יהושע said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do.” And they divided His garments and cast lots.
(TS1998 VERSION OF THE HOLY BIBLE)

by the way
the translation of this word יהושע
seems different from the given name of christ
thats why some writtings were been mistranslated and misinterpreted


:ty:




godbless
unto all always

Trust in Jehovah with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding...............and still..............if you do that...................you might be stumbled..........according to..........the Jehovah's Witnesses.

If stumbling is possible with trust in God, then why is it written that we should trust God?

If a person who is really following Jesus can be misled how is he the fine shepherd?

 

[ukok102nak]

~;> if we may say so
could we give some comments unto your post thats why we reply unto it
coz humans are having some short comings sometimes
thats why the sin comes after that
and it is not wrong if someone is not intending to sin meaning if some humans doesnt knew it is a sin from the beginning theyve done some things here in this reality
becaused some humans were been brainwashed eversince they were a child
look what happened unto those vietnamise kids during the american vietnam war
even those children participate in war becaused they were been brainwashed
by their leaders

were those children could be pronounced as sinners for they do not know what they do
as it is written
:read:
Luke 23:34
And יהושע said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do.” And they divided His garments and cast lots.
(TS1998 VERSION OF THE HOLY BIBLE)

by the way
the translation of this word יהושע
seems different from the given name of christ
thats why some writtings were been mistranslated and misinterpreted


:ty:




godbless
unto all always

:smoke: although in some translation
as it is written
:read:
Translation and Meaning of יהושע in
English-Hebrew Dictionary

1. A . B . Yehoshua:
   א . ב . יהושע , אברהם בולי יהושע ( נולד ב - 1936 ), סופר מחזאי ואיש רוח ישראלי ( מספריו " המאהב ", " השיבה מהודו " ועוד )
2. Beit Yehoshua:
   בית יהושע ( מושב בשרון )
3. Hexateuch:
   ( מונח תיאולוגי ) הכסטבכוס , שישה ספרי התנ " ך הראשונים שכוללים את התורה ( בראשית , שמות , ויקרא , במדבר , דברים ) וספר יהושע ; חמשת החומשים וספר יהושע
4. Joshua son of Nun:
   יהושע בן - נון ( עוזרו של משה שהפך ליורשו בהנהגת העם בדרך אל א " י )
5. Kfar - Yehoshua:
   כפר יהושע ( מושב בעמק יזרעאל )
6. Rahab the harlot:
   רחב הזונה ( האישה שסייעה למרגליו של יהושע להימלט מיריחו )
7. shock - headed Peter:
   יהושע הפרוע ( פרוע , מזוהם , מוזנח )
8. Shushan Purim:
   שושן פורים ( בערים מוקפות חומה מימי יהושע בן - נון נחוג חג פורים בט " ו באדר )
9. Sobol:
   סובול , שם משפחה ; יהושע סובול ( מחזאי ישראלי )
10. the Early Prophets:
    נביאים ראשונים ( הספרים הראשונים של נביאים : יהושע , שופטים , שמואל ומלכים )

:ty:




godbless
unto all always