Wrong .. they interpret the evidence they have collected on ancient history, and make their own conclusions, as disbelievers.
wrong again. They explain evidence. In some cases where there are so many parallels happening exactly at the time the new religion moved in and occupied the nation it's hard to not make obvious conclusions.
Especially when the OT even mentions the Persian emissary Cyrus and says Yahweh praised him and called him a "servant". The doctrines are too similar to not comment .
This is basic common sense.
NOw apologists however employ psuedo-science and ridiculous nonsense crank in the same setting.
For example, your apologist crank, "oh well the Persians had a prophet so they were correct anyways"? Which doesn't explain why Yahweh waited 600 years or more to tell his people all these new truths? And you have no evidence prophets are real.....OR GODS????
So you get down on scholars for talking basic common sense and facts about history, meanwhile apologists LIE.
apologist crank - "The Quran must be written by God because how else would the Quran know life started from water???"
Uh, actually they used Greek science.
apologist crank - "but how do you know God still didn't tell them the new science anyways?
So it's all a big coincidence? And it's known Arabs were strongly into studying Greek science which the church ignored? Historical facts?
To the Arabs, ancient science was a precious treasure. The
Qurʿān, the sacred book of Islam, particularly praised
medicine as an art close to God. Astronomy and astrology were believed to be one way of glimpsing what God willed for humankind. Contact with Hindu mathematics and the requirements of
astronomy stimulated the study of numbers and of geometry. The writings of the Hellenes were, therefore, eagerly sought and translated, and thus much of the science of antiquity passed into Islamic
culture. Greek medicine, Greek astronomy and astrology, and Greek mathematics, together with the great philosophical works of Plato and, particularly, Aristotle, were
assimilated in Islam by the end of the 9th century. Nor did the Arabs stop with assimilation. They criticized and they innovated. Islamic astronomy and astrology were aided by the construction of great astronomical observatories that provided accurate observations against which the Ptolemaic predictions could be checked. Numbers fascinated Islamic thinkers, and this fascination served as the motivation for the creation of algebra (from Arabic
al-jabr) and the study of algebraic functions.
..and as disbelievers, come to a conclusion that it's all plagiarism.
Uh, no it's religious syncretism not plagarism. Again you are wrong.
Not all scholars are disbelievers.
Here historian and Pastor, who believes explains how Aquinas, and all later theologians used Greek theology to form modern ideas about God
36:46 Tertullian (who hated Plato) borrowed the idea of hypostases (used by Philo previously) to explain the relationship between the trinity. All are of the same substance.
38:30 Origen a Neo-Platonist uses Plato’s One. A perfect unity, indivisible, incorporeal, transcending all things material. The Logos (Christ) is the creative principle that permeates the created universe
41:10
Agustine 354-430 AD taught scripture should be interpreted symbolically instead of literally after Plotinus explained Christianity was just Platonic ideas.
Thought scripture was silly if taken literally.
45:55 the ability to read Greek/Platonic ideas was lost for most Western scholars during Middle Ages. Boethius was going to translate all of Plato and Aristotle into Latin which would have altered Western history.
Theologians all based on Plato - Jesus, Agustine, Boethius Anslem, Aquinas
59:30
In some sense Christianity is taking Greco-Roman moral philosophy and theology and delivering it to the masses, even though they are unaware
Here hhistorian and believing Pastor explains the historical evidence that proves Daniel is a fraud
43:53 Daniel attributed to a prophet of the Babylonian period but actually written between 167 and 164 BC. Daniels visions from Gabriel are very specific and accurate up through the year 167 BC and then fail dramatically after 164 BC. Which illustrates the date.
Daniel believes they are at the end times and are totally wrong.
Ezekiel’s prediction of the worlds end failed so the author of Daniel reinterpreted the timeframe so the end would occur in his day.
Danilel’s prediction failed so John the Revelator reinterpreted the timeframe so the world would end in his day. His failure resulted in ongoing recalculations.
Apocalyptic authors suffered from lack of perspective, falsely believing themselves to have been living at the end times.
Their readers share the same lack of perspective, falsely imagining that the text refer to the readers time (when they actually referred to the authors time)
For centuries people have been reading Revelation as future history. Often convinced the signs point to their own time. This is called temporal narcissism.
1:03:40
Joachim of Fiore used Revelation to predict the world would end 1260 AD.
1:08:03 Newton spent equal time studying the Bible to predict the future and inventing calculus. His future calculations were all wrong.
In Revelation - no mention of the Rapture, no anti-Christ, not a message of fear but hope
Revelation is misread as future history. War, famine, pestilence and death are already loosed on Earth. Revelation envisions a world where they will be eliminated.
Here a believing pastor explains that Apocalypticism and the 2nd coming, end of the world final battle where everyone gets resurrected and lives in paradise on Earth is a Persian myth borrowed by Judaism and Christianity.
33:50
Comes into Judaism from Persian religion. Messianic savior myths also come from Persia. Prior to this there also is no cosmic devil. This comes from Zoroastrianism. Physical resurrection of people and a new world at the end of times battle comes into Judaism from Zoroastrianism.
37:00 during the 2nd Temple Period God becomes more cosmic in scope, not walking around wrestling with people. Visions are attributed to angels and ancient authorities - Daniel, Enoch, Adam…
Because smart people are interested in what the evidence is and know that ridiculous apologetics are simply make believe for people who don't care about what is actually true.
No fact is !00%, particularly those of ancient history.
It is 100% fact that the earliest mention of world saviors we know of is from the Persians. It is 100% fact that when the Persians invaded Israel that then did Judaism start predicting they will be getting a world savior as well.
It is 100% fact that the basic plot is the same in Noah and Gilamesh. It is 100% fact that some lines are almost verbatim.
It is 100% fact that Gilamesh is far older than the Noah story.
Noah - Also he sent forth a dove from him, to see if the waters were abated from off the face of the ground; But the dove found no rest for the sole of her foot, and she returned
Gilamesh - When the seventh day dawned I loosed a dove and let her go. She flew away, but finding no resting- place she returned.
Noah - And the ark rested in the seventh month, on the seventeenth day of the month, upon the mountains of Ararat. And the waters decreased continually until the tenth month: in the tenth month, on the first day of the month, were the tops of the mountains seen.
Gilamesh - When the seventh day dawned the storm from the south subsided, the sea grew calm, the flood was stilled;
Noah - And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar. And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake;
Gimamesh - , I made a sacrifice and poured out a libation on the mountain top. Seven and again seven cauldrons I set up on their stands, I heaped up wood and cane and cedar and myrtle. When the gods smelled the sweet savour, they gathered like flies over the sacrifice.
Noah - The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence.
And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth. And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
Gimamesh - “Wisest of gods, hero Enlil, how could you so senselessly bring down the flood? Lay upon the sinner his sin, Lay upon the transgressor his transgression, Punish him a little when he breaks loose, Do not drive him too hard or he perishes; Would that a lion had ravaged mankind Rather than the flood, Would that a wolf had ravaged mankind Rather than the flood, Would that famine had wasted the world Rather than the flood, Would that pestilence had wasted mankind Rather than the flood
Gilamesh - ‘For six days and six nights the winds blew, torrent and tempest and flood overwhelmed the world, tempest and flood raged together like warring hosts. When the seventh day dawned the storm from the south subsided, the sea grew calm, the flood was stilled;
Noah - And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth.
Noah - And all the days of Noah were nine hundred and fifty years: and he died.
Gilamesh - Gilgamesh, the son of Ninsun, lies in the tomb.
Silly question .. they don't.
Naturally, humans often do.
Uh oh, well then there must be many mistakes in the Quran as well.
If it pleases you to believe that..
What a stupid discussion. Unless saying nothing and being proven wrong over and over is fun for you.
Yes, prophets only know what a human of the time could know. If you disagree, PROVE ME WRONG.
Agreeing with me and using an emoji (5th grade called, they want their debate style back) does not in any way demonstrate I'm incorrect. I have to tell you how to even try to make a point?
