LGBT Community Rights

[Shadow Wolf]

I expect that they greedily lust after a good job market,
better social services, a more peaceful foreign policy,
lower taxes, better policing, a clean environment, &
finally....making fusion cuisine illegal.

I can live with the gay agenda.

I'll get off yer lawn if you stay out of my head. But read my mind again and your lawn will be lavishly mutilated!

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Aww I remember that!!
The one and only time I’ve ever felt genuinely happy for a politician here lol

Let me in and I will teach you all knew ways, layers, depths and levels to appreciate Aussie politicians.
But that's pretty cool. If it happened here it would have to be state-level politicians in a state like California or New York. Any other setting and bigots would have a field day.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Well why don’t they focus on those subjects, stop turning up to every event semi naked acting inappropriately and people may actually take them seriously

Not every gay person does pride events or 'behaves inappropriately' during them. And there are a hell of a lot more cis heterosexual people who do that and worse at most new years and Mardi Gras parades, not to mention 'spring break parties' and 'hot girl summer.' But you would never say heterosexuality is the problem the way you think lgbt are the problem.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Well why don’t they focus on those subjects, stop turning up to every event semi naked acting inappropriately and people may actually take them seriously

Cisgender straight people could do the same thing as well. And have you been to a beach during the summer?! So...much...skin...

 

[Father Heathen]

See what I mean? Right there, as an individual, you have a right to ask a silly question. So you did.

I was already aware of my right to question silly things, such as your post.
Communities consist of individuals, thus your point was moot.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Because we are being forced to play along with peoples delusions.

No, you are not. You are refusing to be kind and tolerant. You don't need to do a thing or say a word. Coming on to the Internet to complain about such things is mean-spirited. You don't need to do so. You want to. Ask yourself why. Who taught you to think and feel that way? You weren't born with it.

Look at any queer event, always dressed and acting in a perverted manner.

You don't define perversion. I find the religions persecuting such people the perversion - a pervasion of basic human decency. Why is it so difficult to be kind? Is it because of a religion that teaches hatred?

Rights belong to individuals, not collectives.

In America, corporations are given the rights of people.

 

[SomeRandom]

Let me in and I will teach you all knew ways, layers, depths and levels to appreciate Aussie politicians.
But that's pretty cool. If it happened here it would have to be state-level politicians in a state like California or New York. Any other setting and bigots would have a field day.

Hey man, you’re welcome anytime. But if you’re going to try to accomplish such a task, it might be your shout down the pub

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Cisgender straight people could do the same thing as well. And have you been to a beach during the summer?! So...much...skin...

Well hot damn! I'll go to the beach with a guy who's flamboyantly gay amd vocal about and wearinf tue absolute legal bare minimum of coverage to run all the anti-queer jerks off.

 

[Kfox]

Why do you have have such strong feelings about other people's identity?

Nobody has strong feelings about other people's identities, we have strong feelings about others trying to control the way we think because of their identity.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Nobody has strong feelings about other people's identities

Sure they do. Many see nonbinary people and have a dysphoric gut reaction, a type of gender dysphoria itself, but regarding the gender of others rather than oneself. They feel repulsion, not mere disapproval. Why, the humanist asks. Who is teaching them this (see below), and why is their reaction to something that doesn't impact them directly so intense?

we have strong feelings about others trying to control the way we think

Nobody is trying to control how you think about this except much of the Christian clergy and the governor of Florida. They are asking you to try to be kind, and if you can't, keep your opinions to yourself.

 

[FredVB]

It has nothing to do with beliefs for supporting it, you are free to do as you will, while not hurting others that you would be liable for.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Nobody has strong feelings about other people's identities,

Yes, they do. Like atheists and Satanists. Other people are known for having very strong feelings about them, Muslims, Mormons, foreigners, different race and political affiliation.

 

[FredVB]

Yes, they do. Like atheists and Satanists. Other people are known for having very strong feelings about them, Muslims, Mormons, foreigners, different race and political affiliation.

It is quite possible that there are many who do have strong feelings about others. At some earlier time when when I was much younger I could have felt fear because of Satanists. When I would have been very much younger than that, I could have felt fear because of witches. Now though there is just the expected reality that people being people have many different beliefs among them, and it will remain that way as long as we have our own lives. We still have to get along and it involves working toward that. We can still believe as we do.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It is quite possible that there are many who do have strong feelings about others. At some earlier time when when I was much younger I could have felt fear because of Satanists. When I would have been very much younger than that, I could have felt fear because of witches. Now though there is just the expected reality that people being people have many different beliefs among them, and it will remain that way as long as we have our own lives. We still have to get along and it involves working toward that. We can still believe as we do.

Believing as we do got a lot people needlessly killed and seriously injured from covid. Believing as we do is why America is still fighting over teaching actual science in science classes and keeping religious mythos out and why and why LGBT rights are endangered here. It's why this *** backwards country lets kids suffer and die instead of requiring parents to seek real medical attention for the kids (the worst offenders, anyways). And it's how destructive cult aspects of Christianity are thriving in the mainstream (like traumatizing children with hell, televangelists and MAGA).

 

[Kfox]

Nobody is trying to control how you think about this except much of the Christian clergy and the governor of Florida. They are asking you to try to be kind, and if you can't, keep your opinions to yourself.

Does their idea of being kind require you to believe and accept what they tell you?

 

[Father Heathen]

Does their idea of being kind require you to believe and accept what they tell you?

You can disagree with something without being antagonistic about it. For example, I disagree with Christianity, but I wouldn't go out of my way to disrespect or harass Christians, nor do I oppose their freedom to believe and practice as they wish (as long they don't act in ways that violate the rights of others).

 

[SkepticThinker]

Well why don’t they focus on those subjects, stop turning up to every event semi naked acting inappropriately and people may actually take them seriously

Or you could just stop turning up at LBGTQ events because it sounds like it really bothers you. Problem solved.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Does their idea of being kind require you to believe and accept what they tell you?

You wrote, "we have strong feelings about others trying to control the way we think" and I answered, "Nobody is trying to control how you think about this except much of the Christian clergy and the governor of Florida. They are asking you to try to be kind, and if you can't, keep your opinions to yourself." I can find no reason to be unkind to such a person. I find no reason to judge, oppose, or condemn them. I empathize with them. I want such lives to be happy lives. Don't you?

To answer your question, no, you don't have to accept what people tell you to accept them or be kind to them.

What are they asking you to believe or accept that's so difficult? I hear transexuals (M->F in my example) telling me that they feel like women, want to pass as women on the street, and wish to be treated like women. If your answer is that they want you to believe that they are biological women, I disagree that that is the usual message, but even if somebody does think that way, so what? I would disagree, but silently, because disagreeing aloud adds nothing but contention and bad feelings, and to do that would be unkind.

If your answer is that they should be allowed to participate in women's sports, no, you don't have to believe that, nor is it unkind to feel otherwise, and under some circumstances it would not be unkind to express that opinion even to such an athlete.

 

[setarcos]

In my opinion....and I struggle a lot with this to understand my own feelings towards LGBTQ++ etc. etc. persons; whether I can be empathetic, whether my own feelings should also be legitimized, who's right, whose wrong, my motivations, my fears, my hatreds, my own desires, etc.,...I currently think that LGBQ...yada yada represents a fragmenting of normalcy in civil society. The arguments I've been hearing are questioning what normalcy IS, or should be, or if it even exists. Whether science should classify what being male or female means or whether personal opinion should determine that reality? Whether mental attitude should supersede physical reality? Whether anything can be considered obscene? Whether words like obscenity, perversion, degeneracy, disease, or abnormality even have meaning anymore or can be legitimately assigned as descriptors to anything anymore.
My own experience has been that when I share my feelings - Instinct? - about these things I'm labeled in a kind of reverse hypocrisy as a ____fill in the blank phobic, hate mongering, bigoted, monster instead of having legitimate/instinctual and perhaps justifiable to some extent feelings concerning these things.
Why is it that LGBTQ++ pride parades always seem to have an almost cartoonish emphasis on sexuality?
Why is it that when someone voices a legitimate concern such as exposing young children to drag shows - a traditionally adult form of entertainment - that the concern is turned into a hyperbolic joke like "LGTBQ++ people just want to 'gobble up your children'..."?
I think its a bad thing to take understandable, well defined words like male and female and personal pronouns and render them informationally meaningless. I think its a bad thing to justify personal behavior by personal preference. I think its a bad thing to sacrifice foundational normalcy to the alter of personal desire and I think its a bad thing to normalize and even promote as good, chaos, from what may be an expression of disease whose foundations are born from that chaos.
I think its a good thing to address the victimization of LGBQ....persons, but not through beautifying a discordant sexuality by marginalizing all other opinions for the sake of promoting a deterioration of a foundation of acceptable norms .

Mark my words....rendering normalcy meaningless promotes chaos which promotes chaotic responses such as violence, indifference, and emotional desensitization and the eventual demise of civil society.
I suppose now I'll have to endure the condemnations and accusations instead of productive dialogue.

 

[Left Coast]

Why is it that LGBTQ++ pride parades always seem to have an almost cartoonish emphasis on sexuality?

Mainly because our sexuality is precisely what is treated as taboo by social conservatives. It's a way of having fun and showing the world that we are not dangerous.

Moreover, the double standards of straight people regarding outward displays of sexuality are relevant here. Public heterosexual behavior is almost never denounced (certainly not as loudly or consistently) by the same people who shame gays for walking around in a thong during a parade. There's a reason for that.

Why is it that when someone voices a legitimate concern such as exposing young children to drag shows - a traditionally adult form of entertainment - that the concern is turned into a hyperbolic joke like "LGTBQ++ people just want to 'gobble up your children'..."?

Because that is not hyperbolic, frankly. There literally are many conservatives who make comments along the lines of LGBT people being "groomers," "dangerous to children," etc.

So if you want LGBT people to stop reacting to things like that, advise your fellow conservatives Christians to stop making those kinds of comments.

I think its a bad thing to take understandable, well defined words like male and female and personal pronouns and render them informationally meaningless.

There's a difference between sex and gender. This has been explained....so. many. Times.

I think its a bad thing to justify personal behavior by personal preference.

This is too vague to know exactly what you're referencing.

I think its a bad thing to sacrifice foundational normalcy to the alter of personal desire and I think its a bad thing to normalize and even promote as good, chaos, from what may be an expression of disease whose foundations are born from that chaos.

Slavery used to be normal. Women being treated as second class citizens used to be normal.

There is a societal benefit to normalcy and stability. But not for its own sake. It has to be rooted in a deeper moral foundation than just, "this is what we've always done."

This is one of the key conservative reasons to support same sex marriage. If you want gay people to create stable, "normal" relationships and families, promote that stability with civil institutions.

Furthermore, being LGBT is not a "disease."

I think its a good thing to address the victimization of LGBQ....persons, but not through beautifying a discordant sexuality

"Discordant" how? Rarity is not evidence of immorality. Lack of fertility is not evidence of immorality. So how?

I suppose now I'll have to endure the condemnations and accusations instead of productive dialogue.

That depends what outcome you want a dialogue to produce.