Flat Earth Kyle
Well-Known Member
Interesting scriptures what book is it out of?
Next question is what do you believe the point of having an infinite amount of unrememberable births is?
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Man Existed Before He Was Born
- Thread starter Flat Earth Kyle
- Start date
Interesting scriptures what book is it out of?
Next question is what do you believe the point of having an infinite amount of unrememberable births is?
outhouse
Atheistically
do you deny that homo sapiens have been on the planet for 200,000 years, of which is not up for debate at all?
Do you deny that Israelies did not exist before 1200 BC, and before that time they were in fact a different culture??
Are you stating there was a worldwide flood, and the earth has only been here 6000 years?
Gjallarhorn
N'yog-Sothep
Then kindly remove the false part of your argument.
This is in reference to an event, not an ongoing condition, hence the past-tense. - Job 38:7
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
and this:
. . .is a reference to the King of Babylon, not a fallen angel.
The idea that this passage has some sort of double application is strictly an article of faith. There's absolutely no rational or logical reason to read it as your reading it.
And as far as Revelation goes: Revelation is describing a future war in Heaven. I think the text makes that clear. How some religious people manage to turn that into an account of something that happened at the beginning of the world is baffling.
The Bhagavad Gita.
It is Sri Krishna who says he remembers all His previous births (incarnations and avatara), but it is Arjuna, Krishna's (human) friend who would not remember his previous births. It's not within the capabilities of a jiva (living being/soul) to (consciously) remember. The re-births are samsara, the cycle of re-births based on karma that all living beings are subject to.
But Krishna, who is God, is not subject to the laws of karma, and says:
"Whenever there is decline of Dharma [righteousness and good] and ascendance of Adharma [unrighteousness and evil], then... I [incarnate] Myself in a body.
For the protection of the good, for the destruction of the wicked, and for the establishment of Dharma, I am born from age to age. Bhagavad Gita 4.7-8 Inasmuch as we cannot choose to incarnate, Krishna can.
Flat Earth Kyle
Well-Known Member
- I am not stating that the earth has only been here for 6,000 years. The Bible certainly does not say that. Genesis 1 does not say that he created anything out of nothing.
- I do believe there was a world wide flood
- Exactly when Israel the man was on the earth, I don't have an exact date for you.
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
It does by implication. The total length of time between Adam and Jesus is 4004 years, IIRC. Since Jesus is generally accepted to have been born 2016 years ago, humanity has logically been here for just over 6000 years.
outhouse
Atheistically
You dont understand
Israelites as a people are known not to exist at all before 1200 BC
before then it is well known they were in fact displaced Canaanites who after 1200 BC gradually began their own unique identity that developped into the Isralite culture.
I dont know what to tell you bud. You already kmow there is ZERO evidence for this to have happened. And we see through previous mythology that the noah story originated from the Sumerian epic of Ziusudra when the Euphrates overflowed its bank in 2900 BC, and later turned into a sea deluge within the meopotamian cultures, LONG before these same people migrated to Israel as well as the Israelites who learned these epic adventures while in exile [babylonian] before they migrated back to Israel
JustWondering
Jerk
All your information regarding your god was gained from men. Kinda ironic, huh?
JustWondering
Jerk
Well, if god speaks directly to you then thats different. If he spoke directly to me I'd be a believer too.
Disciple of Christ
Member
I have not read all you post , but knowing the basis of Mormon theology stating that "Just as Adam was, God is"and "just as God is Adam was" I wonder then why did God kick Adam out of the garden and curse him. Was not that same lie spoken by the serpent (the Devil). Did he not tempt Eve with the idea of becoming as God? Did we not by the lie and so here we are. Why do you want to repackage the idea and feed it to us again. What god are you trusting in? The god of this world (Satan)? The father of lies? Who is your father?
By the way, one can not precede ones existence that would be an oxymoron,would it not? why do you have no recollection then? And What makes you any different than the reincarnationist?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
That is not "the basis on Mormon theology"; its two lines from a poem, and you didn't even get them right. The actual two lines were: "As man is, God once was. As God is, man may become." While that may be interesting to think about, you won't find those lines anywhere in the LDS canon.
So when Jesus Christ said, "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in Heaven is perfect," what was He doing? Making a suggestion or giving us a commandment?
Adam disobeyed God and was cast out of Eden. But in doing so, he took the first step in becomming like His Father in Heaven -- he gained a knowledge of good and evil, and as God himself said, "Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil." So apparently it wasn't a lie after all.
I believe the repackaging was done by the Christians who came before us.
The same God Jesus Christ told us to trust in, our Father in Heaven.
What an unnecessary slam. What would prompt you to say suggest such a thing?
God, our Heavenly Father, the Creator and Father of the spirits of all of us.
It is entirely possible for the human spirit to exist prior to the physical body. Take Jesus Christ himself, for instance. He was with His Father in the beginning, but He did not have a physical body until He was born of Mary.
Why should you have a recollection of something that happened before you were born? You don't even remember your birth or the first couple of years of your life? Why not? Were you non-existent prior to the part of your existence that you can recall?
To believe in reincarnation means that we continue to be physically born multiple times in different forms -- as other human beings or even as other animals. Mormons don't believe that. They simply believe that God created our spirits prior to the act of conception, and that our spirits resided in His presence until that time. When we die, our spirit leaves our body but does not die itself (i.e. we don't believe in "soul sleep"). When we are resurrected, our spirit will re-enter our newly perfected and immortal body, giving it new and everlasting life. That has nothing in common with reincarnation.
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lunakilo
Well-Known Member
What doyou mean by "history books change every day"?
History books are usually full of a lot of speculation based on what little facts were available to the writer at the time of writing. Sometimes you can find very different stories based on the same facts, but that dos not mean the underlying facts are wrong, just that people see the world differently and interpret things differntly.
Sometimes new knowledge comes to light and disproves speculation from earlier history books, but that still doesn't mean that the facts known at the time were wrong, just that the assumptions made by the writer were wrong.
fetteredbybeauty
New Member
I believe what the Word says is true and you have given great references showing it is so.
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
Which Bible?
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Pegg
Jehovah our God is One
is there any reason why we wouldn't remember it?
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
You don't even remember something so significant being born, Pegg. Why would you expect to remember something that happened before you were born? That logic completely aside, it was God's will that we not remember. We needed to learn to walk in faith and to trust that He placed us here for a very important reason. If we were able to recall our existence prior to our birth, it would defeat God's purpose. We'd know all of the answers before having to experience mortality.
Flat Earth Kyle
Well-Known Member
I think you have it backwards.
The saying goes "As man is God once was, and as God is man may become."
I believe Satan speaks half truths. Would you be like God knowing good and evil? Yes, for God knows good and evil. Would you die by partaking of the fruit? This was the Lie, Satan said they would not die, obviously that was not true.
If we could not be like God then I don't believe Christ ever would of stated "Be ye therefore perfect even as your father in heaven is perfect."
This here is a commandment to be like God. What is the issue?
The big difference between me and a a reincarnationist is I believe I only get one mortal life experience of birth and death. A reincarnationist believes when they die they get born again and go through life on earth over and over and over and over again. I do not believe in that at all.