Man sentenced to death for sorcery.

[Caladan]

i personally don't approve it. in my opinion he should be exiled and Saudi authories should make sure he knows that he would be executed next time he enters Arabia with the same purpose (if that's really the punishment of the crime in general). then Saudi should expose his face in all newspapers and all TVs to make sure their public know that this guy is completely against Islam and he is exiled from the land, would be executed in case he returns with same purpose and any Arab who wants to make deal with this guy has go outside of Arabia to do so

.

What if this publicity gave him more clients?

 

[.lava]

What if this publicity gave him more clients?

why do you ask me this good question, Caladan?

edit: OK, skip the exposing part


.

 

[YmirGF]

What if this publicity gave him more clients?

Indeed. The Saudi's have unwittingly given him a seal of authenticity. No doubt, some fools will look him up.

The idea that behavior, such a practicing sorcery, is worthy of execution is however, somewhat dimwitted or perhaps, demented.

 

[Caladan]

why do you ask me this good question, Caladan?

edit: OK, skip the exposing part


.

I find it a very interesting question. this person obviously has a crowd. he has his own program on television, and he is obviously accused of conducting his business in a foreign nation by foreign clients, as Tashan reveals us.

 

[.lava]

Indeed. The Saudi's have unwittingly given him a seal of authenticity. No doubt, some fools will look him up.

The idea that behavior, such a practicing sorcery, is worthy of execution is however, somewhat dimwitted or perhaps, demented.

so all those people here on RF who claim to be sorcerers, magician..etc are nothing but foolish liars, they should not be respected or taken seriously because they are not more than silly kids playing with unseen toys and fooling themselves. is that what you getting at?

.

 

[AxisMundi]

alright since you mentioned those cases i want to know something:

why is a gay man to be killed according to islamic law?
why is a sorcerer (magician) to be killed according to islamic law?
as for punishing the rape victim that is not islamic so theres nothing to ask about that.

while you are thinking about those questions, tell me, what is an "actual crime" according to whose standards and laws do we define one particular act as a crime.

1. One would assume you read your owns criptures. Plenty of info out there on the subject.
Islam and Homosexuality

2. An actual crime is one that effects a person directly, impinging on one or more of a person's inherent rights such as property rights (theft) or the very right to live (murder).

 

[AxisMundi]

so all those people here on RF who claim to be sorcerers, magician..etc are nothing but foolish liars, they should not be respected or taken seriously because they are not more than silly kids playing with unseen toys and fooling themselves. is that what you getting at?

.

Sorcery/magic is seen as a religious practice, and one that is far older than either Islam or it's parent religion, Judeism, and according to the archival and archaeological library of human history, older than Jehovah/Allah as well.

 

[.lava]

I find it a very interesting question. this person obviously has a crowd. he has his own program on television, and he is obviously accused of conducting his business in a foreign nation by foreign clients, as Tashan reveals us.

so TashaN should let us informed if he knew he was risking his life entering Arabia with that purpose. if yes, then i don't know what to say. if that amount of money he expected to earn worths risking his life then he is nothing but a gambler and he lost the game

.

 

[.lava]

Sorcery/magic is seen as a religious practice, and one that is far older than either Islam or it's parent religion, Judeism, and according to the archival and archaeological library of human history, older than Jehovah/Allah as well.

well...whatever. it is Saudi Arabia and their judgement we are talking about so you need to consider Islamic opinion on the subject

.

 

[maro]

Not to mention who believes the secular government is the only legitimate government and Muslims have no right to choose an Islamic government (of course unless every single person under it agrees). :areyoucra "You must run your life according to my views and you have no right or legitimacy to run it according to your views". How arrogant, arrogant, arrogant!!

Actually this thread revealed a lot arrogance ,not4me....and i believe arrogance stems from ignorance....they talk about their secular political system as if neutral....and accordingly if applied ,it won't offend anyone....their ignorance doesn't allow them to understand that secularism is not neutral to us...but rather the entire opposite of our worldview
they speak as the guardian angles of human rights...and i wonder when will they get tired of playing this role that no one swallows anymore ? when will they start minding their own business and stop preaching morality to us ?

And the most arrogant view is of those who think that science provides all the answers and solves all the riddles...and thus is worthy of becoming god instead of God...and accordingly what it can't prove ,is a superstition....someone talked about decieving people into the belief in an afterlife....not realizing that he's the decieved one

I think ali ezzat begovic' said it best ,when he said...:

Modern man’s narrow-mindedness is best shown in his belief that there is no riddle before him. His wisdom is the sum of his knowledge and his ignorance, of which he is not aware, he accepts it as knowledge. Even in the face of the greatest mystery, he behaves self-consciously and conceitedly. He does not even see the problem. It is in this that the true measure of his ignorance and prejudice is manifested. In autumn, the swallows fly from

Europe to Africa. In springtime, they return to the same roof where they set their nest. How do they know that they have to go and when they must leave? Coming back, how are they able to find the same roof among thousands of roofs in a big town? To this question, our conceited man answers that it is instinct which leads them, or that it is a question of natural selection – only the birds which “understood” that they had to move to warmer regions survived. The others who did not “understand” this died out. Their instinct to migrate is the result of the accumulated knowledge of thousands of generations.

The problem does not lie in this empty answer. It lies in the fact that our disputant thinks that he gave an answer at all: he eliminates questioning which is the first condition for exploring the truth. The appearance of the general theory of relativity is due to the fact that Einstein saw a problem where everything seemed clear ad defined.

The meaning of art, philosophy, and religion is to direct man’s attention to riddles, secrets, and questions. It sometimes leads to a certain knowledge but more often to an awareness of ignorance or to transforming our ignorance of which we are not aware into ignorance of which we are aware. This is the dividing line between the ignorant and the wise. Sometimes both of them know very little about some question, but the ignorant, contrary to the wise, takes his ignorance as knowledge and behaves accordingly.

He is simply blind to the problem and, in our case, blind to the miracle. This situation sometimes has tragic consequences in practical life: ignorant persons are very sure of themselves, while the wise behave in a Hamletian way, which gives the first group obvious advantages. This state of affairs is the exact opposite of the state of meditation. No meditation is needed of the so-called “mass-man.” This type of man does not litter his mind with any riddles or secrets. He does not wonder nor admire when confronted with the unknown. If a problem arises, he terms it and goes on living, believing that the problem has been solved in this way. Such terms are “instinct,” “self-organizing matter,” “complex form or highly organized matter,” and so forth.

 

[Caladan]

so TashaN should let us informed if he knew he was risking his life entering Arabia with that purpose. if yes, then i don't know what to say. if that amount of money he expected to earn worths risking his life then he is nothing but a gambler and he lost the game

.

That's actually an interesting notion too. what was he thinking when he went to do business in the KSA? was he considering that the Saudi authorities might take issue with him? was he thinking that his foreign nationality and publicity in Lebanon would protect him?

 

[.lava]

That's actually an interesting notion too. what was he thinking when he went to do business in the KSA? was he considering that the Saudi authorities might take issue with him? was he thinking that his foreign nationality and publicity in Lebanon would protect him?

because of these kind of questions that's not answered yet i rather him to be exiled from the land and never return. maybe he did not know this time, next time he would know it for sure what he's actually risking. and in case he is that famous he could ignore Saudi clients

.

 

[TashaN]

That's actually an interesting notion too. what was he thinking when he went to do business in the KSA? was he considering that the Saudi authorities might take issue with him? was he thinking that his foreign nationality and publicity in Lebanon would protect him?

He was confident on his power maybe?

They asked him on tv after he got caught, didn't the demons whom you claim to be working with warned you that you might get caught by the Saudi authorities, he said no. Why? they asked him. He said, i absolutely have no idea.

 

[kai]

Actually this thread revealed a lot arrogance ,not4me....and i believe arrogance stems from ignorance....they talk about their secular political system as if neutral....and accordingly if applied ,it won't offend anyone....their ignorance doesn't allow them to understand that secularism is not neutral to us...but rather the entire opposite of our worldview
they speak as the guardian angles of human rights...and i wonder when will they get tired of playing this role that no one swallows anymore ? when will they start minding their own business and stop peaching morality to us ?

And the most arrogant view is of those who think that science provides all the answers and solves all the riddles...and thus is worthy of becoming god instead of God...and accordingly what it can't prove ,is a superstition....someone talked about decieving people into the belief in an afterlife....not realizing that he's the decieved one

I think ali ezzat begovic' said it best ,when he said...:

I would ask you to have patience with secularists Maro they don't have what theocrats have , which is the benefit of all the answers.

 

[AxisMundi]

well...whatever. it is Saudi Arabia and their judgement we are talking about so you need to consider Islamic opinion on the subject

.

Saudi, and yourself, need to understand that religious freedom is a basic Human Right.

And while this guy certainly sounds more like a charletan than anything else, last time I checked bilking money out of the gulible wasn't a capital crime deserving of death.

 

[.lava]

He was confident on his power maybe?

he never had it without demons

.

 

[kai]

Saudi, and yourself, need to understand that religious freedom is a basic Human Right.

And while this guy certainly sounds more like a charletan than anything else, last time I checked bilking money out of the gulible wasn't a capital crime deserving of death.

well it is in Saudi and i am sure a muslim would be more aware of Saudi law than a non Muslim . Its a bit like shaking your head when a westerner gets caught with drugs in south east Asia.

 

[.lava]

Saudi, and yourself, need to understand that religious freedom is a basic Human Right.

And while this guy certainly sounds more like a charletan than anything else, last time I checked bilking money out of the gulible wasn't a capital crime deserving of death.

i don't think it deserves that either. but what i think does not matter, does it? so be realistic, by that i mean, accept nations and their laws. if they don't fit you then don't go there. i am not saying this just for Saudi Arabia. that pretty much includes Western nations. if i knew i would have to wear clothes that go against my moral opinion in some nation, i would not go there. simple that is. in case i decided to go that means i accept their conditions. i am not here to change entire world into what i like to see. you should not act like a global cop either, seriously, even the greatest worldly power could not handle such a job

.

 

[Sahar]

Actually this thread revealed a lot arrogance ,not4me....and i believe arrogance stems from ignorance....they talk about their secular political system as if neutral....and accordingly if applied ,it won't offend anyone....their ignorance doesn't allow them to understand that secularism is not neutral to us...but rather the entire opposite of our worldview
they speak as the guardian angles of human rights...and i wonder when will they get tired of playing this role that no one swallows anymore ? when will they start minding their own business and stop peaching morality to us ?

And the most arrogant view is of those who think that science provides all the answers and solves all the riddles...and thus is worthy of becoming god instead of God...and accordingly what it can't prove ,is a superstition....someone talked about decieving people into the belief in an afterlife....not realizing that he's the decieved one

Ameen.
Beautiful and enlightening quote btw;

I think ali ezzat begovic' said it best ,when he said...:

Modern man’s narrow-mindedness is best shown in his belief that there is no riddle before him. His wisdom is the sum of his knowledge and his ignorance, of which he is not aware, he accepts it as knowledge. Even in the face of the greatest mystery, he behaves self-consciously and conceitedly. He does not even see the problem. It is in this that the true measure of his ignorance and prejudice is manifested. In autumn, the swallows fly from Europe to Africa. In springtime, they return to the same roof where they set their nest. How do they know that they have to go and when they must leave? Coming back, how are they able to find the same roof among thousands of roofs in a big town? To this question, our conceited man answers that it is instinct which leads them, or that it is a question of natural selection – only the birds which “understood” that they had to move to warmer regions survived. The others who did not “understand” this died out. Their instinct to migrate is the result of the accumulated knowledge of thousands of generations.

The problem does not lie in this empty answer. It lies in the fact that our disputant thinks that he gave an answer at all: he eliminates questioning which is the first condition for exploring the truth. The appearance of the general theory of relativity is due to the fact that Einstein saw a problem where everything seemed clear ad defined.

The meaning of art, philosophy, and religion is to direct man’s attention to riddles, secrets, and questions. It sometimes leads to a certain knowledge but more often to an awareness of ignorance or to transforming our ignorance of which we are not aware into ignorance of which we are aware. This is the dividing line between the ignorant and the wise. Sometimes both of them know very little about some question, but the ignorant, contrary to the wise, takes his ignorance as knowledge and behaves accordingly.

He is simply blind to the problem and, in our case, blind to the miracle. This situation sometimes has tragic consequences in practical life: ignorant persons are very sure of themselves, while the wise behave in a Hamletian way, which gives the first group obvious advantages. This state of affairs is the exact opposite of the state of meditation. No meditation is needed of the so-called “mass-man.” This type of man does not litter his mind with any riddles or secrets. He does not wonder nor admire when confronted with the unknown. If a problem arises, he terms it and goes on living, believing that the problem has been solved in this way. Such terms are “instinct,” “self-organizing matter,” “complex form or highly organized matter,” and so forth.

 

[Perfect Circle]

i don't think it deserves that either. but what i think does not matter, does it? so be realistic, by that i mean, accept nations and their laws. if they don't fit you then don't go there. i am not saying this just for Saudi Arabia. that pretty much includes Western nations. if i knew i would have to wear clothes that go against my moral opinion in some nation, i would not go there. simple that is. in case i decided to go that means i accept their conditions. i am not here to change entire world into what i like to see. you should not act like a global cop either, seriously, even the greatest worldly power could not handle such a job

.

Well said lava... This is how I tend to view things. I personally find the notion that someone will be executed for sorcery abhorrent and bit silly. However, the man knew full well where he was going and what type of laws they uphold. Even though I may disagree with the laws of that land, I (as a US citizen) have no right to preach to a sovereign government about what laws are just or unjust. That's between that government and its people.